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Default GOP Corruption and Obstruction

June 26th, 2010, 22:49
Calm down. Even if it ever passes, the bill's been whittled down to half what it was so it can continue keeping money out of the hands of the people who will spend it the fastest (those who have been unemployed > 24 months) on their mortgages, food and bills, thus keeping it out of the economy, thus keeping the recession/downturn continuing, thus making it easier for the repubs to make the other side look bad in November.

Word on the Hill is that the repubs are through with the recession; for them it's over and now it's all about strangling the dems in the midterms. You can see why that's the case in the snip below.
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/jun…aires-20100611:
Unemployment remains at near-record levels, and most Americans are struggling to rebuild their battered finances. But the country's wealthy are once again doing just fine, thank you.

No group was immune to the downturn. In 2008, as the financial crisis raged, the stock market hit bottom and the Great Recession ate into the economy, the number of millionaires in the United States plunged.

But last year the number of millionaires bounced up sharply, new data show.

And after that decline and rebound, the millionaire class held a larger percentage of the country's wealth than it did in 2007.

"It's been a recession where everyone took a hit — with the bottom taking a bigger hit," said Timothy Smeeding, a University of Wisconsin professor who studies economic inequality. But "the wealthy alone have bounced back."
But if you're rich, who cares how the 'small people' are doing?

Where there's smoke, there's mirrors.
Last edited by magerette; June 26th, 2010 at 23:00.
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June 27th, 2010, 19:27
That's largely based on paper wealth numbers, though. Those folks had, and have, a greater percentage of their assets tied into the stock market. So when the stock market lost half its value, those folks took a bath that you and I never felt. Now that the stock market has bounced back to some extent, those folks are making it back while you and I never feel it. It's the financial equivalent of no pain no gain, and we're couch potatoes on this one.

I didn't hear you crying for the people that lost literally millions of dollars every day for a few months straight when the market took a shit, so it rings a little hollow for you to drag out the class warfare arrows as they recover some of that lost value. Certainly, those folks are "moving in different air" than us and their problems aren't the same as ours, but you can't really pick and choose when to impose your value system on their situations.

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June 27th, 2010, 22:16
I can't pick and choose when to impose my value system on wha..?? You mean your side can sit and make insulting judgment calls about the unemployed and the poor being lazy bums on drugs (Orrin Hatch,) or stray animals that shouldn't be fed because they'll breed (SC Lt Gov Andre Bauer,) and much much more but I can't point out factually that millionaires came out of the financial meltdown smelling like a rose because I didn't show them sufficient sympathy when they were suffering along with everyone else??

S'cuse me. Double standard any?

Yes, this issue steams me, but it's not the rich getting richer that bothers me—that's like the weather—an immutable fact of life. It's the cold-blooded political calculation that's being made here at the expense of real humans— keep the unemployment rate high by keeping the economy in turmoil, block every attempt to mitigate the recession, filibuster everything to make the dems look even more ineffective than they really are, and thusly, get a leg up on the next elections.

But I think I finally am beginning to understand the conservative mindset. Mention that the wealthy are getting richer while everyone else is still struggling, that's class warfare, but throwing working people into poverty, bankrupting the states* and trying to tank the recovery for a political advantage after you've chalked up the biggest deficit in recorded history when you were running the show, that's 'fiscal responsibility.'


* * * * * * *

(* "The rejected bill would also have provided $16 billion in new aid to states, preserving the jobs of thousands of state and local government workers and providing what White House officials called an insurance policy against a double-dip recession." )

Where there's smoke, there's mirrors.
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June 28th, 2010, 14:20
Well, clearly this is getting out of hand, so I'll try to deal with a few issues you bring up and then I'll move on out.

First off, much like I said right out the gate, this is "nice" spending, but your side STILL CAN'T PAY FOR IT. Make cuts somewhere else to follow YOUR OWN "pay as you go" soundbyte and this bill flies thru. YOUR SIDE made up the "pay as you go" farce solely to combat the impression that you couldn't balance a budget to save your lives. It's not our fault that the dems find it inconvenient to live by their own spin.

Second, we already had a nice knockdown-dragout over no less than SAINT BARACK trying to turn Americans against Americans with his class warfare pap, so it rings hollow yet again to complain about comments from a lt. governor, stupid as they may be.

Finally, I think I'm beginning to understand the liberal mindset. Treat the wealthy as some sort of alien species rather than the Americans that they are, and then you're welcome to take what you want from them and insult them while you do it. Line up for the gang rape, and then call her a whore when you're done. Somehow, those American citizens aren't American citizens, so it's OK.

And, as an extra bonus, you can't really drag out the "biggest deficit in history" speech anymore. That title belongs to Barack and Pelosi-ov by a good 20% margin now and they keep coming up with exciting new ways to take the record higher.

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
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June 28th, 2010, 19:26
Yes, it's totally out of hand. You've completely misconstrued my point, jumped down my throat and played the class warfare card on me for the absolute last time. I'm taking my torch and pitchfork and going home.

Where there's smoke, there's mirrors.
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June 28th, 2010, 19:38
DTE, YOUR side under Dubya's grand leadership created the worst deficit in history and handed it to Barack, as well as the worst recession since the Great Depression because of a deregulation mentality…
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June 28th, 2010, 20:53
Let's got over this once again, Thrasher.

1) Glass-Steagal was repealled under CLINTON, not Dubya. You keep forgetting this and I keep having to remind you. I know it hurts to hear the words, little camper.

2) Barack has increased the national debt by roughly $3B (10 to 13), which is roughly the same amount Dubya did (7 to 10), only Barack did it in 1.5 years rather than 8. Your argument simply doesn't stand up to scrutiny, but thanks for playing.

EDIT- thought I'd throw some numbers behind #2 there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_public_debt
I stand corrected. Dubya went 6 to 10 over 8 years, not 7 to 10. Barack went 10 to 13 in 1.5 years. So who's the Debt Master again? Dubya: 0.5T/year Obama: 1.5T/yr

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June 28th, 2010, 21:09
Let's get this clear once again DTE

- As I have corrected you before, yet you conveniently choose to ignore and misrepresent, Glass-Steagall was repealed by Republican congressional led legislation. It was NOT led by Clinton. Next…
- Bush handed Barack this depressed economy, which of course meant that deficit spending SHOULD be rising at a higher rate. Unless ya'all righties want to continue down the path of creating another Great Depression, I suggest this continue. BTW, Bush's spending was with a strong economy and he still managed to rack up a huge debt. Imagine that, from the party that pontificates about fiscal responsibility. It's pure politics - zero integrity…
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June 28th, 2010, 22:18
1) And, as I've corrected you before when you tried to sneak your way out, the bill passed with nearly unanimous support of both parties and was signed without any reservations by Willie. You simply can't run away from your side having their finger in that cookie jar as much or more than my side. I know, it hurts, but keep your chin up, little camper!
2) So then, you're saying that Dubya's policies created a "strong economy"? Even I wouldn't go there, but thanks for the vote of confidence. Can't have it both ways, you know. Otherwise, one might say you're spewing pure politics - zero integrity.

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June 28th, 2010, 23:27
1) Yes, the dems went along with the republicans, but it wasn't the dems idea.
2) No, his policies did not create a strong economy. He inherited the strong economy from Clinton, and managed to sack it.
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June 29th, 2010, 01:55
Children, it's school holidays time, so save your playground scuffles for next term!! Gee, I wonder what these kids will be like when they grow up!!!???!!! lol

If God said it, then that settles it!!

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June 29th, 2010, 10:56
Let's kick out them non-Texans while we're at it.

(Wrong thread?)

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June 29th, 2010, 18:40
Legislation like this certainly is inconsistent with the Republican philosophy that government regulation is bad. Government should only regulate what people do in their bedrooms? Weird preoccupation with sex anyone?
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July 19th, 2010, 19:05
Looks like the GOP is playing self-serving politics once again, rather than really helping the American people. This is consistent with their strategists, who tell them the worse the country is, the better they will do in the elections. Rather sounds a bit traitorous, doesn't it?

GOP Balks on Extending Unemployment Benefits

Never, anytime in the past, that I can remember have unemployment benefit bills been required to paid for by something else. Funny how the wars didn't have to be paid for. GOP grandstanding while the country is suffering due to their failed policies?

Imagine that…
Last edited by Thrasher; July 19th, 2010 at 19:48.
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July 19th, 2010, 19:25
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
This is consistent with their strategists, who tell them the worse the country is, the better they will do in the elections.
From a conspiracy theorist's point of view, this isn't that bad. From a Machiavelli standpoint it is a really good idea. The "Shock Doctrine". People will try to … well, and then came Hitler.

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August 3rd, 2010, 19:16
Athony Weiner got a little cross the other day…

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August 18th, 2010, 14:49
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post
Second, we already had a nice knockdown-dragout over no less than SAINT BARACK trying to turn Americans against Americans with his class warfare pap, so it rings hollow yet again to complain about comments from a lt. governor, stupid as they may be.
What?!? This would be a stretch even for a totally lunatic tea-bagger!

Finally, I think I'm beginning to understand the liberal mindset. Treat the wealthy as some sort of alien species rather than the Americans that they are, and then you're welcome to take what you want from them and insult them while you do it. Line up for the gang rape, and then call her a whore when you're done. Somehow, those American citizens aren't American citizens, so it's OK.
Not at all. You are trying to characterize this as if it were a dispute about ethnic groups or genders with one side blaming the other from sheer bigotry. The actual problem here is not one of 'poor' people or even the middle class hating rich people. It is the fact that the rich CONSERVATIVES have not only been using their obscene resources to to fuck the rest of America in ways I would need to write a book about to detail them all, but THEY have simultaneously done massive damage to our roads and bridges and such(Notice all those potholes and massive cracks in the pavement at intersections and such? That is largely caused by 18 wheelers stopping/braking and starting) and at the same time refusing to pay the taxes necessary to maintain the roads and such.
THAT is why all of our roads and bridges went completely to shit during the last ten years(Clinton shares some blame on this as well but at least he was not pushing the deregulation nonsense so hard and did not go as far as Bush did with tax-cutting suicide.).

Put simply, rich Conservatives have the power to do damned near anything they want, politically, to help themselves and that is what they do. The problem is that they fail to see the big picture. They want the benefits of being Americans but do not want to pay the taxes that enable them to enjoy those benefits. They want to outsource all of our jobs to cheap labor in India and China and Mexico, make heavy usage of our shipping lanes/roads/highways/railways but they don't want to pay for any of it. This degree of greed and selfishness hurts the whole country…NOT because they are evil Nazis or some such but because they are greedy and not very good at seeing the big picture.

of all the 'First world' countries who are in the same economic neighborhood as America(or as America was in their hay day) there are like TWO who pay less in taxes than us(and they have other mitigating factors to make up for having less tax revenue, such as legalized drug usage and prostitution).

And, as an extra bonus, you can't really drag out the "biggest deficit in history" speech anymore. That title belongs to Barack and Pelosi-ov by a good 20% margin now and they keep coming up with exciting new ways to take the record higher.
LOL! Now even IF this were somehow true, Why on earth might Barrack have needed to spend money to try and fix our country? Hmmm…let's think about this for a minute…*taps fingers*.

OH YEAH…because Republicans FUCKED US hard with their policies during Reagan's admin, Bush's admin and Bush's admin(again!)! Reagan drove us to record breaking deficit, Bush continued their absurd "Trickle down" bullshit. Clinton bailed us out(admittedly largely due to the internet/PC boom of the 90s) and then Bush drove us back into the same ditch AGAIN. Now Barrack is trying to save our asses but he has faced unimaginable hate even before he got into office…even when he was bending over backwards to appease Republicans! He quite literally advocated for Conservative policies they were whining that they wanted and they opposed him(remember when The Fox News pundits thought Obama was NOT going to do the "stimulus" thing and they got up in arms over it? Then he decided to give in and do the stimulus thing and…they got up in arms over it!?

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August 18th, 2010, 14:58
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post
Let's got over this once again, Thrasher.

1) Glass-Steagal was repealled under CLINTON, not Dubya. You keep forgetting this and I keep having to remind you. I know it hurts to hear the words, little camper.

2) Barack has increased the national debt by roughly $3B (10 to 13), which is roughly the same amount Dubya did (7 to 10), only Barack did it in 1.5 years rather than 8. Your argument simply doesn't stand up to scrutiny, but thanks for playing.

EDIT- thought I'd throw some numbers behind #2 there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_public_debt
I stand corrected. Dubya went 6 to 10 over 8 years, not 7 to 10. Barack went 10 to 13 in 1.5 years. So who's the Debt Master again? Dubya: 0.5T/year Obama: 1.5T/yr
This is a lot like saying a guy who attacks an innocent man at a bus stop and breaks one of his ribs, but is counter-punched by the innocent guy and has his jaw broke in three places, the 'attacker' is somehow LESS violent/aggressive than the victim.

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August 18th, 2010, 17:09
Nice attempt to spin away the inconvenient truth. You can drag out that tired old "Blame Bush" spiel, but the numbers simply don't back it up. This was a simple case of false statement, refuted with non-partisan numbers, goal horn. You're best to just duck-n-run on this one. Thrasher put you in too deep a hole for you to pull out the miracle save. Goalie's water bottle is already flying.

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August 19th, 2010, 03:30
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post
Nice attempt to spin away the inconvenient truth. You can drag out that tired old "Blame Bush" spiel, but the numbers simply don't back it up. This was a simple case of false statement, refuted with non-partisan numbers, goal horn. You're best to just duck-n-run on this one. Thrasher put you in too deep a hole for you to pull out the miracle save. Goalie's water bottle is already flying.
LOL! Nice try kiddo. But bluffing only works when you are at least playing the hand! Bald assertions, even when written in some pseudo-prose style, do not pass the mustard.

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