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-   -   Help building a charater? (https://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showthread.php?t=455)

Acleacius November 4th, 2006 10:39

Help building a charater?
Hey could use some tips as its been many years since I kept up with the D&D rules.
I tend more towards an all around charater, probably why I like G3 so much. :)

I started a Rogue and not sure I optimised it as much as possible.
Is there any downside to starting as a Fighter and changing to a Rogue at level 2?
My thinking was to get an extra Fighting Perk, plus more Weapon and Armor Skills or do I lose them?

Wouldn't mind playing a Fighter Mage type but I have never been happy with D&D Magic system being so limited, casting what you memorize previously before you ever get to an area, not knowing what spells you will need.
I am much more confortable with Mana based Magic systems.

Everything feels so limiting after playing G3, but I am willing to put some time in. ;)

Thanks. :)

Prime Junta November 4th, 2006 12:02

There are two downsides with multi-classing: an XP penalty, and the fact that some classes (especially spellcasters) get their most powerful abilities at high class levels. You can avoid the former by picking a race with a favored class that suits one of your classes. If you're power-gaming, in general it's best to either:

+ Stick to one class
+ Stick to one class + an appropriate prestige class when ready for it (e.g. fighter -> weapon master)
+ Multiclass with one primary class and 1-4 levels of a secondary class.

IMO ranger-rogue works better than fighter-rogue. Rangers are limited with regards to armor, just like rogues, but get almost all the fighter feats *and* really good two-weapon fighting feats at level 1, and they get the tracking feat as well. One level of ranger won't make much of a difference in your progression as a rogue, and the feats you get from it more than make up for the difference.

If you want to play a spellcaster, it sounds like you might like bards, sorcerers, or warlocks better. They have slot-based spellcasting but no memorization; you have a smaller list of spells you can use, but you can use any of them at any time as long as you have slots free. The gameplay works out rather similar to a mana-based system that doesn't have mana potions or regenerating mana; that is, you have to rest to replenish your spells (which is made very easy, even too easy in NWN2).

A fighter/mage is a bit of a problematic combo IMO since (1) armor restricts arcane spellcasting so you can't really use any, and (2) melee casting is pretty easily disrupted. A fighter/cleric works much better (or plain cleric with high STR and CON and a selection of combat-related feats).

Note that if you're playing with the Hardcore rules, you have to be careful when casting area-effect spells as you can fry your companions or even yourself.

Acleacius November 4th, 2006 12:26

Very useful info and the Ranger/Rogue sounds much better.
Yes, Bards have always been fun combo of Fighting, Casting and Rogue.

Thanks. :)

txa1265 November 4th, 2006 20:16

The manual has very good info on multiclassing. Personally I like to single class exclusively so I've never done that. That is one place where I choose strict role-play over the rule-working involved.

Bhaal November 4th, 2006 21:14

I've made a rogue, and I took two weapon fighting. I'm considering taking a ranger level, but since they get two weapon fighting for free and my rogue already has, would I be able to pick another (rogue) feat instead?

Prime Junta November 4th, 2006 22:21

@Bhaal -- sorry, no.
@txa -- I don't think multiclassing is necessarily opposed to role-playing. You could easily have, say, someone who grew up in the countryside hunting and trapping (read: has a ranger level or three) and then moved to the city and took to relieving people of their extra possessions (became a rogue). I have a hunch there's going to be some role-playing with your party members that could lead to them to multi-class.

Bhaal November 4th, 2006 22:33

Shame :( Would it still be worth it? And at which level(s) would it be smart to take a ranger level or more?

Corwin November 5th, 2006 01:15

In the original, I played a wild-elf. This allowed me to begin with one level of Barb, before I multied into a Sorc. It made the early level MUCH easier!!

txa1265 November 5th, 2006 02:14


Originally Posted by Prime Junta (Post 5248)
@txa -- I don't think multiclassing is necessarily opposed to role-playing. .

True - but what I meant is that because I'm a numbers guy by profession that I have to be careful about getting too submerged in the numbers of games.

bjon045 November 5th, 2006 03:51

Fighter/Mages are quite viable, espically if you make use of the eldritch knight prestige class.

Prime Junta November 5th, 2006 09:19

I think anything's viable, if you set your mind to it. :-)

I'm thinking from the powergaming POV, though: the strength of a fighter is in attack bonus, feats of arms, and combat endurance (through AC or hit points); the strength of a spellcaster is in magic. Mixing the two will yield something that doesn't get the most powerful spells and can't survive in melée very well. If you picked a nice selection of touch-based, buff, and caster-centered spells, though, I'm sure it'd be workable -- but definitely more of a challenge.

@Bhaal -- I can't say whether it'd be worth it without knowing more about your character and where you are in the game. (For example, if you've stumbled on an über magic item that has particular class requirements, it might be worth it to take a level of that class just so you can use it.)

Don't sweat about it too much. Play through the game once just "role-playing" it; you can powergame it the second time around if you feel like it. From a stats POV, it doesn't matter when you pick a level or two of your secondary class. Role-playing through a game is more fun anyway. That's why I picked a lawful neutral tiefling monk with the Troublemaker background. (She has a hard time controlling her demon blood, especially when faced with the prejudice her kind encounters, wherefrom the Troublemaker background, and has only managed it, to an extent, with the iron discipline of her monk's training. I try to let this dichotomy be reflected in her role-playing choices, too; as in, she's easy to provoke into a fight but does not do anything chaotic whenever she manages to keep a cool head.)

Bhaal November 5th, 2006 12:48

@Prime: I'm almost level 5, and I'm at the graveyard now. Nothing of interest has dropped, so I'm not in a rush to get more rogue levels. I picked up the tiefling rogue, but she dies all the time so I don't know how long I'm gonna keep her. ;)

Prime Junta November 5th, 2006 15:03

Equip her with a short bow and keep her as archery support in combat. If you can get her to circle around the flank or the side, she'll get sneak attack bonuses on her archery, which can be deadly.

Acleacius November 5th, 2006 15:09

I decided on strait Rogue, when I rolled up a Ranger to start turns out you don't get duel till second or thrid level and as you mentioned a penatly I was worried about 2nd and 3rd being to long, plus it forces you to choose a god and I was trying to play with no deity.
So I choose Human Rogue, got 2 starting Feats Duel and Duel Defense. ;)

txa1265 November 5th, 2006 15:28


Originally Posted by Prime Junta (Post 5368)
Equip her with a short bow and keep her as archery support in combat. If you can get her to circle around the flank or the side, she'll get sneak attack bonuses on her archery, which can be deadly.

That was going to be my suggestion - I already had two melee, my Paladin and the Dwarven fighter, so it was a natural. Works much better that way as well.

Bhaal November 5th, 2006 15:55

Thanks for the suggestion, I'll try that. :)

Acleacius November 5th, 2006 20:20

Hey I saw in some thread, can't recall atm, someone was changing the AI behavior?
How is it possible to di this I must be missing something obvious, though I have tried Right and Lrgt clicking NPCs, Protraits, Icons and look at the Key Settings in the Main Menu.

Thanks for any help. :)

May have found it in Behavior, with the setting of Puppet mode.

xSamhainx November 5th, 2006 22:05

I always agonize over this aspect of the game far too much. Playing something else while I think about it!

Thx for the help ='.'=

txa1265 November 5th, 2006 22:24

That's right Acleacius, the AI you can change is the party AI like in BG

Acleacius November 6th, 2006 00:25

I just wish it was more intutive, the idea I can't give a simple command, with a Right click menu for Wait or Follow is very annoying.
Its too bad they couldn't (afford?) have full voice acting for all the NPCs. :(

On the upside I am starting to like the game, I have reached the fort and about 1 battle from hitting 5th level.

Anyway to force the camera higher in Driving Mode?
It seems to only mode which will keep the camera behind the player, yet it locks at about 50% height.
Damn they must have worked really hard to Prevent us from actully being able to have the camera work as desired. :rolleyes:

Thanks. :)

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