Grimoire - How to Get Cleve Working

rune_74 said:

To be honest he can release or not release it, he can do whatever he wants really. You all act like he owes you something, when he doesn't. It's his game, he doesn't live off its profits.

I would like him to release it but I'm not going to tar and feather him because he hasn't. Whatever, if it comes it comes.

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I'm not quite sure who this mini-rant is directed towards, but I don't think anyone believes that Cleve owes them anything (unless they contributed to his campaign). The original post by Myrthos was sarcastic, if anything (pretty funny, actually). The fact is that Cleve's campaign was an egregious failure for many reasons, all of which are his fault. $10,600 in 120 days!!! That's pathetic, but considering how poorly he managed the campaign, I would say that he overachieved.

Roq said:

Depends what you think about Bane & Crusaders - two of my #1 games of all time and I don't think I'm unique in that.

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Personally, I enjoyed Bane (finished 3 times) but thought that Crusaders was utter shit (quit several times due to boredom). Grimoire is basically Wizardry 7 with some enhancements, but it is not a true modernization of Wizardry (a la Wizardry 8). Hailing the game as the second coming is a bit silly, in my opinion.

If Grimoire were released in the 1990's on schedule, then I might have been impressed…but not so much in 2013. The truth is that none of us will truly know how good this game will be until it comes out (if it ever comes out). Who knows…there may be some fun to be had there, despite the antiquated mechanics? Personally, I expect there to be massive balance issues and design flaws due to the size and scope of the game.

fadedc said:

You could have made that argument at one time, but now that he has taken people's money with the promise of a finished project, he does in fact owe them something.

I've never personally been convinced that the game exists beyond the bare bones demo released more then 10 years ago. But until he started taking people's money, it wouldn't have mattered that much if I was right, just a harmless hoax or delusion. Now it would be a bit more serious if it wasn't real or was never released.

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Don't agree - look at the videos. That would have to be some pretty elaborate hoax. Plus several people already played the previous demo release and the verdict has been favourable. Sure it's not your common or garden project, but sometimes (not often) even the most jaded old cynic can be surprised. Lets hope this is one of those times.

gozioso said:

Personally, I enjoyed Bane (finished 3 times) but thought that Crusaders was utter shit (quit several times due to boredom). Grimoire is basically Wizardry 7 with some enhancements, but it is not a true modernization of Wizardry (a la Wizardry 8). Hailing the game as the second coming is a bit silly, in my opinion.

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I liked Wiz 8 too - it was a new direction in 3D and a progression to a different type of game that hasn't yet been followed up. But, I don't think that invalidates the approach in Crusaders, which for some is an iconic game (sorry it didn't appeal to you, but I share your respect for Bane).

Grimoire so many years later probably isn't going to be a game with the mass market appeal of the latest FPS, but if it does what Crusaders did with a huge amount of gameplay and improved mechanics (etc.) there will be quite a few happy bunnies of which i will be one. And I have no doubt that if the game has some visibility it will attract a lot of new converts too.

I'm mildy more open minded that it might be a real project now then I was 10 years ago. But the videos don't show much beyond things I remember from the ancient demo, and I don't know any of the few people who claim to have played the demo or exactly what they played or how different it was from what I played so many years ago. So I hope I'll be surprised, but at this point I'm definitely in the jaded old cynic category, and nothing short of the release of the game (or maybe the demo) will change that.

Roq said:

Don't agree - look at the videos. That would have to be some pretty elaborate hoax. Plus several people already played the previous demo release and the verdict has been favourable. Sure it's not your common or garden project, but sometimes (not often) even the most jaded old cynic can be surprised. Lets hope this is one of those times.

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fadedc said:

You could have made that argument at one time, but now that he has taken people's money with the promise of a finished project, he does in fact owe them something.

I've never personally been convinced that the game exists beyond the bare bones demo released more then 10 years ago. But until he started taking people's money, it wouldn't have mattered that much if I was right, just a harmless hoax or delusion. Now it would be a bit more serious if it wasn't real or was never released.

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That's funny that you never believed that, since you know, a few of us have actually played the full beta of the game. Don't believe me? Ask corwin.

gozioso said:

What the hell are you smoking??!! A 1990's blobber RPG with random battles is the best game in development??!! I think not. Quite frankly, I just don't understand the excitement over this game (assuming it even comes out). I've seen the videos, and all I see is an enhanced Wizardry 7 clone. Wasteland 2, on the other hand, I am excited about that one…

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People like different things. Funny how that goes.

Fair enough (sarcasm aside ), but to consider Grimoire to be the most promising game in development seems a little strange, considering some of the high quality titles that are on the horizon:

Divinity: Original Sin
Dragon Commander
Project Eternity
Wasteland 2
Shadowrun Returns
Expeditions Conquistador
Dead State

Grimoire may end up being a good game (assuming that it ever comes out), but I would hardly call it innovative or genre-evolving (I consider it to be a regression, to be quite honest). Some of those aforementioned titles may very spark evolution, though. Time will tell…

gozioso said:

Grimoire may end up being a good game (assuming that it ever comes out), but I would hardly call it innovative or genre-evolving (I consider it to be a regression, to be quite honest). Some of those aforementioned titles may very spark evolution, though. Time will tell…

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Grimoire belongs to an RPG sub-genre that some people like to call blobbers, and it does look like it has plenty of new features compared to the rest of them. Blobbers themselves are mostly a thing of the past and I understand why some would call it regressive to even make them, but some of us still have a taste for them. Right now a new brightly colored blobber that doesn't take itself too seriously and doesn't underestimate the player is something unique indeed with all the simplified grimdark RPG hybrids out there. Not all evolution takes the genre someplace I care to follow it.

Regarding your own list of promising titles, maybe a half of them are interesting to me in the slightest. It's in the eye of the beholder.