Here is an example why iPad can handle complex PC games
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AppleIntimidation
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They are hardcore when compared to other Apple users. They hate freemium for example and micro transactions unlike the casual users or facebook players. Een on their forums they claim they are a minority of gamers on the platform because freemium are usually the highest grossing apps. Many of them will also buy games before they go on sale or free unlike most Apple users.
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Every IOS review site I've ever been to hates microtransactions. I'd hazard a guess that most players of IOS games hate them as well, and that the profits of most freemium games are driven by a small percentage of players who spend a lot of money. Though that is just a guess.
Either way touch arcade is a perfectly good site, although I find they often give really good reviews to games that I feel are kind of mediocre. If I were to recomend a site I'd probably recomend pocket tactics, their reviews and articles tend to be pretty well reasoned and objective, and they focus on more complex games.
Either way touch arcade is a perfectly good site, although I find they often give really good reviews to games that I feel are kind of mediocre. If I were to recomend a site I'd probably recomend pocket tactics, their reviews and articles tend to be pretty well reasoned and objective, and they focus on more complex games.
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I think Touch Arcade and associate gave you a wrong vision of ios gaming population. The forum is overcrowded by hardcore young players but it's far to represent the reality. AI is totally right to pinpoint it Hardcore. And that's also right for the majority of reviewers here. but yeah follow blindly their advices would be risked, I think they have too many friends in the business.
Just check the Apple stats and how sometimes a freemium can be a top in pure income during some time. It means his income through micro transactions beat any sell at that time. I don't think it last long, I don't know but I doubt, but it's still far to be non significant. And that's the clue that Touch Arcade and the forums aren't representative of the global ios gaming population.
Just check the Apple stats and how sometimes a freemium can be a top in pure income during some time. It means his income through micro transactions beat any sell at that time. I don't think it last long, I don't know but I doubt, but it's still far to be non significant. And that's the clue that Touch Arcade and the forums aren't representative of the global ios gaming population.
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txa1265
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hardcore iOS gamers ... important distinction. The focus is on what works on the iOS platform, not a comparison to the PC. Therefore all of the discussions we have had about how EVERY port will be inferior due to controls compromises and so on, are excluded.
KotOR is KotOR, and is an inherently great game. The question we are discussing is whether the controls are 'acceptable' or 'horrific', and there is no one with any opinion better than 'acceptable' (and that was me). The opinions vary based on subjective tolerance to touch controls.
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No I think you don't know Touch Arcade forums, get there and you'll see that there's many Hardcore players quite more Hardcore than anybody here.
Play a lot more games than most, play constantly the same game during many hours per days just to reach a top ten ladder, find any little trick in a game, collect all rewards, and many more weird Hardcore behaviors, you'll find plenty at Touch Arcade forums.
Hardcore isn't related to the game quality or complexity but to the gamer behavior.
EDIT: Many confusion comes from this term of Hardcore because for some reason it got a sort quality label, proud of being a Hardcore player. But it's more complex than that.
Play a lot more games than most, play constantly the same game during many hours per days just to reach a top ten ladder, find any little trick in a game, collect all rewards, and many more weird Hardcore behaviors, you'll find plenty at Touch Arcade forums.
Hardcore isn't related to the game quality or complexity but to the gamer behavior.
EDIT: Many confusion comes from this term of Hardcore because for some reason it got a sort quality label, proud of being a Hardcore player. But it's more complex than that.
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DArtagnan
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I have no confusion. Hardcore gamers are those who invest themselves - and that in itself has no inherent quality or lack of it that we can possibly measure.
I'm sure there are hardcore gamers playing tablet games - but among those, I'd say 9 out of 10 would play KotOR on PC if given the choice.
Why? It's simple. Hardcore gamers care enough to go with the best platform. Casual gamers will go for convenience.
There's no way around that unless you don't understand human behavior.
Unless, of course, you already HAVE played KotOR - and you're just looking for a nice way to get a casual replay. But that's useless when trying to determine the quality of the UI - and we have to compare it to the PC UI.
I'm sure there are hardcore gamers playing tablet games - but among those, I'd say 9 out of 10 would play KotOR on PC if given the choice.
Why? It's simple. Hardcore gamers care enough to go with the best platform. Casual gamers will go for convenience.
There's no way around that unless you don't understand human behavior.
Unless, of course, you already HAVE played KotOR - and you're just looking for a nice way to get a casual replay. But that's useless when trying to determine the quality of the UI - and we have to compare it to the PC UI.
DArtagnan: You are applying a logic on something you don't know (Touch Arcade forums). It's like for you Hardcore gamers are aesthete but an aesthete would be totally stupid to have a Hardcore behavior.
Hardcore isn't to select finely the best games around, it's compulsive playing. Most Hardcore players focus on few games, certainly not the best around. And those suffering of bulimia just chain games in a genre, or on a platform.
No Hardcore gamer isn't aesthete gamer. I know it's how feel it many players, as a sort of medal and a sign of quality, but that's something else.
Hardcore isn't to select finely the best games around, it's compulsive playing. Most Hardcore players focus on few games, certainly not the best around. And those suffering of bulimia just chain games in a genre, or on a platform.
No Hardcore gamer isn't aesthete gamer. I know it's how feel it many players, as a sort of medal and a sign of quality, but that's something else.
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DArtagnan
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No, you're speaking from a position of ignorance regarding human beings and the concept of being a hardcore gamer.
No one here said hardcore gamers finely select the best games around. Otherwise, point it out. You can't? That's because no one said it.
In your fantasy world - we all think hardcore gamers is some kind of bad-ass breed.
In the real world - some people can separate fact from fiction.
Once again, I'll explain what hardcore gamer means:
Hardcore - the concept in relation to being a gamer - is about dedication and level of investment, nothing more. Some might be compulsive gamers and some might not be.
You're generalising and that's weak and useless.
You're confusing what some people think about being a hardcore gamer with what I think about it.
Try to understand that, and we might get somewhere.
No matter how you look at it, it's the time spend that makes hardcore and those who spend the most time go to extreme and are a lot more Hardcore than you think you are.
It's not a matter of quality it's a matter of investment of time, so you can't apply a pure logic of quality as you did it's non sense and erroneous logic.
You tried apply a logic with your personal Hardcore behavior, overall a passionate aesthete. But your category is typically hardcore players growing older AND then less hardcore and changing their way to look at it. But they also become less Hardcore.
Perhaps it's younger players with less money to buy a PC or they can get a ithing from parents and not a PC. Or the ithing is creating a strong attachment to the platform. But no matter the logic you can try apply, the point is IA is right it's quite Hardcore on Touch Arcade and not less than on PC. But well for those who review I don't know, for forums it's very obvious or it was not that long ago.
EDIT: But as I already mentioned there's many hints that this population on TA is totally non representative, it's just a part of igamers.
It's not a matter of quality it's a matter of investment of time, so you can't apply a pure logic of quality as you did it's non sense and erroneous logic.
You tried apply a logic with your personal Hardcore behavior, overall a passionate aesthete. But your category is typically hardcore players growing older AND then less hardcore and changing their way to look at it. But they also become less Hardcore.
Perhaps it's younger players with less money to buy a PC or they can get a ithing from parents and not a PC. Or the ithing is creating a strong attachment to the platform. But no matter the logic you can try apply, the point is IA is right it's quite Hardcore on Touch Arcade and not less than on PC. But well for those who review I don't know, for forums it's very obvious or it was not that long ago.
EDIT: But as I already mentioned there's many hints that this population on TA is totally non representative, it's just a part of igamers.
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DArtagnan
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What is it about the Watch that makes these people who're absolutely incapable of reading flock to it? Is it a new trend that I haven't heard about?
You know, being disturbingly hell-bent on some deludedly single-minded agenda and ignoring every single rational argument against it?
Chien for his whole "RPG IS THIS AND NOTHING ELSE"
Apple for his iPad insanity crusade
Ihate for his "Hardcore gamers is NOT about quality - and I don't care if you haven't said it - I'm still going to repeat it endlessly as if you did!"
What the fuck is up with that?
I have to wonder if there's ever any real life interaction. I have a hard time imagining anyone lasting more than 30 seconds before running far away - and staying there!
You know, being disturbingly hell-bent on some deludedly single-minded agenda and ignoring every single rational argument against it?
Chien for his whole "RPG IS THIS AND NOTHING ELSE"
Apple for his iPad insanity crusade
Ihate for his "Hardcore gamers is NOT about quality - and I don't care if you haven't said it - I'm still going to repeat it endlessly as if you did!"
What the fuck is up with that?
I have to wonder if there's ever any real life interaction. I have a hard time imagining anyone lasting more than 30 seconds before running far away - and staying there!
Well calm down, don't you think? 
Common it's just words and posts. Ok you are totally right, it's ok like that?
Common it's just words and posts. Ok you are totally right, it's ok like that?
What is it about the Watch that makes these people who're absolutely incapable of reading flock to it? Is it a new trend that I haven't heard about?
You know, being disturbingly hell-bent on some deludedly single-minded agenda and ignoring every single rational argument against it?
Chien for his whole "RPG IS THIS AND NOTHING ELSE"
Apple for his iPad insanity crusade
Ihate for his "Hardcore gamers is NOT about quality - and I don't care if you haven't said it - I'm still going to repeat it endlessly as if you did!"
What the fuck is up with that?
I have to wonder if there's ever any real life interaction. I have a hard time imagining anyone lasting more than 30 seconds before running far away - and staying there!
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txa1265
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Well calm down, don't you think?
Common it's just words and posts. Ok you are totally right, it's ok like that?
Actually it is just that you seem like the perverse evil twin of 'appleintimidation'.
I totally agree with everything DArtagnan has said on the subject ... and basically not a single word YOU have said. And I think that is largely true of the crowd here, and likely everyone who has been playing RPGs for years. And since your handle notes you hate RPG, and since you are openly displaying you have no clue about the genre, games, or people ... why bother hanging around here?
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Dart I hate to say it but there is an ignore function for users like this.What is it about the Watch that makes these people who're absolutely incapable of reading flock to it? Is it a new trend that I haven't heard about?
You know, being disturbingly hell-bent on some deludedly single-minded agenda and ignoring every single rational argument against it?
Chien for his whole "RPG IS THIS AND NOTHING ELSE"
Apple for his iPad insanity crusade
Ihate for his "Hardcore gamers is NOT about quality - and I don't care if you haven't said it - I'm still going to repeat it endlessly as if you did!"
What the fuck is up with that?
I have to wonder if there's ever any real life interaction. I have a hard time imagining anyone lasting more than 30 seconds before running far away - and staying there!
txa1265
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Well.. that's certainly subjective.
haha ... point taken.
What I was saying was more that the game is the same one that was almost universally critically acclaimed as one of the top RPGs since BG2, and one of the best Star Wars games ever made.
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Ok not a hard core gamer if you play on the Ipad heh, got it.
So many rules to follow here, what is and isn't an rpg, what is and isn't a hardcore gamer....geez, it's almost like some people are very opinionated and can't see it.
So many rules to follow here, what is and isn't an rpg, what is and isn't a hardcore gamer....geez, it's almost like some people are very opinionated and can't see it.
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I think some things are being lost in translation with Ihaterpg. It's obvious that English isn't his first language, and I don't necessarily think he's trying to troll.
You forgot that it was also Jesus's favorite game, and that it was mentioned several times in the Bible.
You forgot that it was also Jesus's favorite game, and that it was mentioned several times in the Bible.
txa1265
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haha ... just because you have never liked it doesn't mean it wasn't met with universal acclaim that has never really diminished the way it did for so many games (Halo, Oblivion) ... I am not claiming it is some sort of 'truth', just reflecting many of the sentiments of critics through the years. Bottom line - KotOR is KotOR ... no need to review the actual content at this point.
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Thats interesting, because Halo and Kotor have basically the exact same type of meta-scores. Not that it matters, because we both know that so-called "critics" are quite often the least qualified people to give hardcore gamers a review they can relate to.