Microsoft - No More Forced Win 10 Installs

I switched to Win10 right from the beginning, upgrading from Win 8.1. I was never friend of Win 8's start menu overhaul and App philosophy. It never worked well with PCs, but it was at least acceptable with 8.1 and it supported SATA and SSD from the beginning - in contrast to Win 7. Their mixed approach for Win 10 was convincing and the upgrade process worked very well. For me, it was the smoothest transition ever, although at the same time it was my very first day one OS upgrade. It's not that everything would be perfect, but most obstacles imho only occur to power users who are used to work with administrative tools on a regulary basis. Imho, there really isn't anything particulary bad about that piece of software, except the expectable customization cycle that applys to every software. The biggest problem in my perception is, that it is from Microsoft.

At the same time, it's always the same discussion for every new Windows release. Always the complaint about Microsoft spying out or patronising its customers, the affirmation not to shift, the hope for Linux to raise to the top of the OS market. In almost all cases, none of it ever came true. Personally, I went through that cycle with XP, but at some point Windows 2000 simply didn't work anymore. I switched to XP and I wasn't put to jail or waterboarded in an extraterritorial military camp without access to a lawyer. When Microsoft introduced Vista, XP suddenly was the best system ever released. The best example, how people simply don't remember their attitude several years ago or adapted to reality. Now they cling to Windows 7, an OS you get quite a problem if installing it to a SATA SSD.

Of course there are proper examples when an update isn't recommended. For most use cases - and that does not include playing games from the early 2000s with deep level DRM like Safedisc and Securom - Windows 10 works just fine and still you won't get busted or waterboarded in an extraterritorial millitary camp. But my guess is, the whole anti-campaigning is more of an act of defiance against Microsoft's aggressive update strategy. You don't love Windows, you simply accept the fact, that there is a standard OS. Neglecting the update when Microsoft thinks it's about time to release another version, is the small kind of autonomy you have in that cycle, no matter how rational or irrational that seems.

At the bottom line, I don't think Microsoft's strategy was smart. But the crowd isn't smart either. Everytime I recognise the market share of XP I get the impression it is even partly foolish. Microsoft has a serious interest to also convince the foolish ones, because a network of zombie computers with an old Microsoft OS has an impact on their reputation. Apple and Linux use that security argument constantly to campaign against Windows. So I understand why Microsoft took that path, even if I don't agree to their methods. And I think you should consider if you're only reacting unwillingly to that pressure or if it's some kind of laziness (upgrading of course still means there is some work to do). Windows 10 is a stable OS and it will be the standard for PC gaming in the future, so most of you are going to switch anyway. Linux won't be the savior, when even Valve only showed lackluster support for the steam machines and in fact didn't change anything.

I didn't have any problems installing my Win 7 on SATA SSD. What problems are you talking about?

Originally Posted by Archangel
No you didn't. You used number of people using Win10 to boost your argument and I destroyed it with my post.

If you insist. Please go on with your ideas and let me go on with mine.

It is quite obvious that within a couple of years Windows 7 users will be in the same situation as Windows XP users today. Windows 7 is about 43% of the market as of now. Windows 10 is at 20%. Windows XP is at 7%. There's also about 13,5% of Windows 8 installations. And no, there'll be no Windows 11, so skipping Windows 10 is not an option.

Why do you think there will be no Win 11?
And if we don't plan to play DX12 games, why is ignoring Win10 not an option?

It does nothing else better except hogs more resources, sends your usage date back to micro$oft and tries to limit hardware usage with their deal with Intel.

I promise you that every mobile phone sends more and more intimate data about you to Apple/Google. If they really wanted, they could even evaluate when you've been on toilet and how much time it took.

Originally Posted by Avantenor
I promise you that every mobile phone sends more and more intimate data about you to Apple/Google. If they really wanted, they could even evaluate when you've been on toilet and how much time it took.

Considering I keep wireless and mobile data transfer off until the moment I want to check something on the internet I doubt it.

But yes, I agree that having a gmail account and being logged into Chrome keeps google in loop with my internet usage and where I am using it at any time.

But at least it does not go through my whole computer and internet usage and records and sends everything. Maybe I cannot completely control what companies know about me, but I can control some and choosing Win7 is part of that control.

I guess I'll be "that guy" who says I upgraded and like it far more than 8. Not quite Windows 7 for functionality (I hate this whole clunky 'app' trend), but I'm relatively pleased with Windows 10. *shrugs*

hmm 10k almost makes me wish I hadn't went into the registry to make all the w10 nonsense to go away, only almost though!

Windows 10 works great on my main update to date system. I like it better than Win 8. However, I had to rip out the Windows 10 update tentacles from a laptop that would not support it. The manufacturer listed the laptop as not supporting Windows 10 and would not be issuing drivers. Of interest a couple of printer do not fully function with Windows 10 and Windows automatically picks drivers that do not work, had to pick the drivers manually to get the printers to print (yet to find a driver from the manufacturer or Microsoft that will allow scanning).

I mentioned (in a reddit thread) that how Microsoft was handling the update was invasive and perhaps criminal. Nice to see the courts agreed.

Maybe the fine was enough as it changed their behavior but in the larger scheme of things they basically got away with it. The fine is basically ~5 seconds of revenue lost to Microsoft (depends on year of course). If you got the same fine at $15/hr for 2000 hours your fine would be $0.004.

The funny thing is apple has been doing automatic updates for a very long time, but I guess their users are used to abuse so they don't complain.

I didn't expect MS to sink to their level though as they did. Regarding the lawsuit, if one has been successful more are bound to come.

Originally Posted by Archangel
Or we get it for free later. I have been using pirated windows since beginning of time and I don't plan to stop any time soon. And still I don't want that malware called win 10 on my computer.

So, you admit to being a thief, and then have the stomach to complain about a product you stole? I'll disregard your arguments from now on.

Originally Posted by GothicGothicness
So, you admit to being a thief, and then have the stomach to complain about a product you stole? I'll disregard your arguments from now on.

You would be too if you were born in my part of the world, don't you worry

Your comments mean as much to me as if a guy on a golden horse complained to a beggar in his path about him stealing some food.

While mostly illegal piracy is not theft.
Not a necessity for survival either but I have no qualms about the proclaimed trillions of dollars lost due to just me downloading things for free. Yes that is how much they will demand when I get caught.

Not true, in modern world knowing and using computers is part of every human and you depend on it to get a job and maybe some day have a more luxurious life.
And paying 250$ for Windows in most countries around the world is just something we will not ever do. Even Windows does not care about that, they only care about selling Microsoft Servers and MS SQL to companies and enforce legal buying of that.

Originally Posted by Archangel
Your comments mean as much to me as if a guy on a golden horse complained to a beggar in his path about him stealing some food.

…except that you don't need video games to survive, like food, so the moral argument also breaks down as a result. I guess I'm not sure I buy the justification that "my life is tough, I live in a shitty place, so therefore I'm entitled to steal video games".

Not trying to start a fight, seriously, but help me to understand. Where do you draw the line with regard to taking what you can't otherwise gain legitimately?

I paid for my Windows; but…

Winning through piracy -- Microsoft in China Today Gates openly concedes that tolerating piracy turned out to be Microsoft's best long-term strategy. That's why Windows is used on an estimated 90% of China's 120 million PCs. "It's easier for our software to compete with Linux when there's piracy than when there's not," Gates says.

Here’s Why Microsoft Is Giving Pirates the Next Windows for Free Bill Gates was famously sanguine about the rampant theft of Microsoft’s intellectual property in China. “As long as they’re going to steal” software, he said during a 1998 town hall at the University of Washington, “we want them to steal ours.”


Bill Gates on Piracy: "They'll get addicted, and then we'll collect"

Etcetera, etcetera, etcetera…

__

Originally Posted by six
While mostly illegal piracy is not theft.
Not a necessity for survival either but I have no qualms about the proclaimed trillions of dollars lost due to just me downloading things for free. Yes that is how much they will demand when I get caught.

1. Piracy is theft.


2. The only way to enjoy a product in ice age barbaric country is piracy because antifear, antiprejudice and antiphobia products are banned.

2.1. It is described well how pirating VHS tapes helped getting rid of a tyrant in Romania, "Chuck Norris vs Communism":
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2442080/

2.2. Piracy is the only way to play Dragon Age Inquisition in India.

2.3. Piracy is the only way to watch cult classic movies in Australia and China that are disturbing, but their point *is* to be disturbing as they serve as a warning.


3. Videogames are luxury and entertainment is not free. If there is no free option covered with advertisments or something (Crunchyroll for example), then instead of theft, one may play cards with friends or something.


While we can go discuss these points in another thread generally, as maybe I'm wrong on some count, IMO there is no excuse to pirate windows 10. It's currently a free upgrade of existing windows 7 or windows 8.
Windows 7 or windows 8 key last time I checked was obtainable on key reseller sites for 20-30 bucks. Yes, a whole operating system is cheaper than a videogame!

What's even worse in this story is that people pay more than $1000 for iPhone without any second thought, but buy $300 worth PC then expect it to perfrom as supercomputer and don't want to pay for operating system. Go figure.
It's like gangsters, generally into theft but have to buy the most expensive cars.

Originally Posted by joxer
1. Piracy is theft.

Feel free to point me to a law in any country that count piracy as theft.

Can't, I'm not a lawyer. I'm guessing you are codex' lawyer though well versed in international laws.

Originally Posted by ChaosTheory
…except that you don't need video games to survive, like food, so the moral argument also breaks down as a result. I guess I'm not sure I buy the justification that "my life is tough, I live in a shitty place, so therefore I'm entitled to steal video games".

Not trying to start a fight, seriously, but help me to understand. Where do you draw the line with regard to taking what you can't otherwise gain legitimately?

I talked about Windows in this case, I could make a good argument about games as well but not a topic about games.