Cyberpunk 2077 - What to expect?

Originally Posted by BoboTheMighty
Nothing wrong with game having "cinematic" dialogue…it immensely adds to the flow and immersion when executed right.
Fallout IV going for it was a mistake for different reasons: animations, camera and direction, voice work, dialogue writing…these things are simply there done not well.

Take a more thorough look at what's behind it…honestly, simply saying it will be just another AAA blockbuster is, to be blunt, basically ignoring it's entire core foundation.
Witcher coming from directly books, was stylized more for adventure game with set protagonist and playstyle than crpg.
Even in basic thematic run this is an opposite from typical player super empowerment , so I think there would be a lot more "gravitas" to player choices and style of roleplaying than even coming from games like Daggerfall and Morrowind.

I don't think "cinematic" dialogue adds to immersion or "flow" at all. It kind of does the opposite, IMO. That's one reason I like how TES games have done "cutscenes". The "cutscenes" that do occur happen directly in the game and stay in first-person, thus keeping you "in the game" the whole time and not making it feel like you're watching a movie.

As for your analysis, we'll see. I know the Cyberpunk world has deep pen and paper rules, etc. I'm just guesstimating that in CDPR's position currently,, this is going to be their big swing. If I'm proven wrong and it's got dice-rolls for combat, deep/complex stats, etc., I'll be happy to be proven wrong.

Ironic that you talk about wanting more stats and "depth" yet you use TES as an example. Those games haven't had anything close to complexity since Morrowind.

Originally Posted by JDR13
Ironic that you talk about wanting more stats and "depth" yet you use TES as an example. Those games haven't had anything close to complexity since Morrowind.

Seems you kind of misread that. Bobo mentioned Cyberpunk bringing back "strong RPG mechanics" from earlier TES games like Daggerfall and Morrowind. That is his quote, and that is also what I'm skeptical of.

You don't have to tell me about the streamlining in TES games, I'm well aware of it.

Well having strong mechanics doesn't mean needing dice rolls for combat. I'd rather not have that in a first/third person game, and I don't think it would end up being a popular choice.

Also, TES was never designed from any PnP game. Maybe you're confusing it with something else. In fact, TES 1 originally wasn't even going to be an RPG.

Originally Posted by JDR13
Well having strong mechanics doesn't mean needing dice rolls for combat. I'd rather not have that in a first/third person game, and I don't think it would end up being a popular choice.

Also, TES was never designed from any PnP game. Maybe you're confusing it with something else. In fact, TES 1 originally wasn't even going to be an RPG.

I didn't say strong mechanics = dice-rolls for combat. I was again specifically talking about Morrowind and Daggerfall, which Bobo brought up. Of course it wouldn't be a popular choice to include dice-rolls for much of anything anymore, just like heavy stat implementation probably wouldn't be a popular choice, either (hence my skepticism that the game is going to be that type of complex RPG).

I don't think TES was "designed" from a PnP game, but I thought I remembered Todd Howard saying that the original setting was heavily influenced by D&D and Ultima.

Regardless, Morrowind had complex rules and stat interactions that resembled more of a D&D-style pnp game. A lot of that has obviously been streamlined now with the later TES games (which is what I suspect Cyberpunk will look like).

Originally Posted by Fluent
I didn't say strong mechanics = dice-rolls for combat. I was again specifically talking about Morrowind and Daggerfall, which Bobo brought up. Of course it wouldn't be a popular choice to include dice-rolls for much of anything anymore, just like heavy stat implementation probably wouldn't be a popular choice, either (hence my skepticism that the game is going to be that type of complex RPG).

I don't think TES was "designed" from a PnP game, but I thought I remembered Todd Howard saying that the original setting was heavily influenced by D&D and Ultima.

Regardless, Morrowind had complex rules and stat interactions that resembled more of a D&D-style pnp game. A lot of that has obviously been streamlined now with the later TES games (which is what I suspect Cyberpunk will look like).

You said the original TES games were D&D campaigns which they weren't. No need to backpeddle, just admit your mistake. The devs were indeed big fans of PnP RPGs though, and they've also said that Ultima Underworld was the primary influence for Arena.

As far as streamlining goes, it's far too early to say anything about Cyberpunk yet. I expect it to be a pretty complex game overall though.

I just find it interesting that you gush about TES, but you claim Cyberpunk needs to have complex PnP style elements in order for you to check it out.

Originally Posted by JDR13
You said the original TES games were D&D campaigns which they weren't. No need to backpeddle, just admit your mistake. The devs were indeed big fans of PnP RPGs though, and they've also said that Ultima Underworld was the primary influence for Arena.

As far as streamlining goes, it's far too early to say anything about Cyberpunk yet. I expect it to be a pretty complex game overall though.

I just find it interesting that you gush about TES, but you claim Cyberpunk needs to have complex PnP style elements in order for you to check it out.

You're assuming things again and putting words in my mouth (which you always do, by the way). I don't care for the futuristic/cyberpunk setting, and that's more of a turn-off than anything to me.

And yeah, others have said TES was originally built in a D&D campaign, but I can't find any info on that online except some other people on forums repeating it. So if that's incorrect then yes I was wrong.

Originally Posted by Fluent
You're assuming things again and putting words in my mouth (which you always do, by the way). I don't care for the futuristic/cyberpunk setting, and that's more of a turn-off than anything to me.

Originally Posted by Fluent
Do you really think this game is going to bring back RPG elements and complexity like D&D, etc., or go for a more accessible, "cinematic experience"? If it is some crazy RPG with all the pnp-style elements you could ever want that will be great and I'll check it out then.

Ok Fluent.

It's understandable if you simply don't like that setting, but that's what you should have said to begin with. It wasn't.

I don't think "cinematic" dialogue adds to immersion or "flow" at all. It kind of does the opposite, IMO.

I didnt mind KotOR I-II style of dialogue…. also the first Dragon Age and Mass Effect

and Ofc CD RED.


it can be cool


on a sidenote , the trailer for Ghost in the shell live action is out so get your cyberpunk fix

Originally Posted by JDR13
Ok Fluent.

It's understandable if you simply don't like that setting, but that's what you should have said to begin with. It wasn't.

I'm more of an orcs and goblins kind of RPG guy, but if the game has a bunch of cool RPG elements that I enjoy I'll play it and "put up with" the setting.

Originally Posted by luj1
I didnt mind KotOR I-II style of dialogue…. also the first Dragon Age and Mass Effect

and Ofc CD RED.


it can be cool

Yeah, it is neat in those games. I generally prefer the first-person "in-game/in-engine" style of TES, though. If TES were to switch up I would be disappointed.

As for "cinematic experience", Cyberpunk will likely have CGI-style cutscenes, etc. Which are fine for some games, I just don't know the last RPG I played that had those. I think in-game cinematics can be taken too far, but if the gameplay is right that's what matters to me.

Why would you assume Cyberpunk is going to have CGI cutscenes?

Originally Posted by JDR13
Why would you assume Cyberpunk is going to have CGI cutscenes?

The last 2 Witcher games had them. Is Cyberpunk going some different route? Or do you think they will double down on the style of RPG they've already made?

Originally Posted by Fluent
The last 2 Witcher games had them. Is Cyberpunk going some different route? Or do you think they will double down on the style of RPG they've already made?

Almost all of the cutscenes in the Witcher games use the in-game engine. The only cutscenes that I can think of that were CGI were the intros and endings. You do understand what CGI is right?

Originally Posted by JDR13
Almost all of the cutscenes in the Witcher games use the in-game engine. The only cutscenes that I can think of that were CGI were the intros and endings. You do understand what CGI is right?

CGI was the wrong word. I just meant it would likely have a cinematic cutscene style.

Ah ok. You said "in-game/in-engine" style which is exactly what those games use.

*Edit* I know you prefer first-person, but you obviously can't have first-person cutscenes if the character's view isn't first-person to begin with.

Originally Posted by BoboTheMighty
Pretty damn odd that some Bethesda fans here aren't more enthusiastic about this…if done right, this would bring back actual strong role playing and mechanics that older Bethesda games had, along with production and technical values they always lacked.

Last I heard, Cyberpunk was going toward twitch shooter mechanics with multiplayer (and from the grant request, not limited to the co-op kind). While I've seen lots of Bethesda's fan request these things in TES games on the Internet, I don't think the ones who do hang around RPGWatch.

I totally expect the Cyberpunk ruleset to be watered down a lot as well, nothing CDR have said suggest they care one bit about the D&D-like gameplay of the ruleset (with permadeath, a very brutal combat system with its very unique damage system….Cyberpunk is not what anyone be it action dudebros or D&D grognards are used to). It's all about ambiance and story.

"Last I heard"? Ready to back up your claims with some sources? What does your "deep throat" in CDPR HQ says?

Originally Posted by zahratustra
"Last I heard"? Ready to back up your claims with some sources? What does your "deep throat" in CDPR HQ says?

"Last I read" might be more accurate than "last I heard"…and by that I mean all the little info I could find about the game compiled by the various CDPR interviews since 2012 (they always call this an action game), their lead gameplay designer job opening asking for action/RPG and/or shooter experience (they hired this guy for that job) and their grants request a few months go (which mention seamless multiplayer).

Then you add Mike Pondsmith (the Cyberpunk creator who is rather involved in 2077 development) who said "And Grand Theft Auto 3 is basically cyberpunk minus the hardware" and how it's more about the right atmosphere in this interview.

Originally Posted by Farflame
So the most important features for future RPGs are…
- cute super realistic hair
- generated city
- sex cards
- cyber sex…

Anything else?

In all honesty, all I want from that game is not to be MMO.
Lately seems I can't get a title without multiplayer rubbish at all and I don't want to pay for that thing included any more as I never use it.