Queen's Wish: The Conqueror - Vogel Kickstarter

HOLY CRAP, almost funded! He will make 3x times the money he asked for if this pledging craze continues. :-OoOo

Honestly, this kickstarter presentation was so bad, it makes me hate that I bought a couple games from him in the past. That is how bad it is. I'm now kicking myself that I ever bought a game from this clown, I mean, from this living legend.

Ok, so I'm trollin' a little here, and saying this stuff tongue in cheek to an extent, but yea, I'd say there is at least some half truth to what I describe above, its not all hyperbole on my part.

Anyway, he asked for so little, I'm not surprised he got it. Now, if he manages to reach 100 thousand, then that would impress me. And maybe instead of pocketing a large portion, he would actually put the money into modern age graphics…oh well, a man can dream…

Originally Posted by Arkadia7
Anyway, he asked for so little, I'm not surprised he got it. Now, if he manages to reach 100 thousand, then that would impress me. And maybe instead of pocketing a large portion, he would actually put the money into modern age graphics…oh well, a man can dream…

According to an online presentation earlier this year he claimed he made over one million dollars on Steam. So I have to ask where the money went? Any guesses anyone?

Link - https://www.gdcvault.com/play/102494…-The-Spiderweb

Originally Posted by Couchpotato
So I have to ask where the money went? Any guesses anyone?

Salaries for himself and his employees? He's been on Steam for what, around 7 years? If he's only made a million dollars on Steam total over that time period (I'm not sure about this, couldn't find the claim in the video?), and has 3 fulltime employees plus freelancers, as mentioned in the video, that's not that much money for people who are based in the US.

Originally Posted by Stingray
Salaries for himself and his employees? He's been on Steam for what, around 7 years? If he's only made a million dollars on Steam total over that time period (I'm not sure about this, couldn't find the claim in the video?), and has 3 fulltime employees plus freelancers, as mentioned in the video, that's not that much money for people who are based in the US.

Yes it's mostly him who does all the work, but he does hire freelance workers.

Hmm what does it cost for freelance work? Is it a one lump payout or a contract? Just curious as I see offers as low as $50, and up for artwork used in games.

Originally Posted by Stingray
Salaries for himself and his employees? He's been on Steam for what, around 7 years? If he's only made a million dollars on Steam total over that time period (I'm not sure about this, couldn't find the claim in the video?), and has 3 fulltime employees plus freelancers, as mentioned in the video, that's not that much money for people who are based in the US.

So he claims. Who are the 3 full-time employees and what do they do exactly? How come we've never heard about them until now?

Given his pitch, I'm flabbergasted that he's raised this much money already. Are there really that many people out there willing to prepay for something that looks so mediocre?

Originally Posted by JDR13
So he claims. Who are the 3 full-time employees and what do they do exactly? How come we've never heard about them until now?

Given his pitch, I'm flabbergasted that he's raised this much money already. Are there really that many people out there willing to prepay for something that looks so mediocre?

If you followed Jeff’s postings over the years I think you would have heard about the 3 several times. IIRC, it’s Jeff, his wife, and another person whose details I don’t remember offhand.

Originally Posted by Stingray
If you followed Jeff’s postings over the years I think you would have heard about the 3 several times. IIRC, it’s Jeff, his wife, and another person whose details I don’t remember offhand.

So he's counting his wife and himself as 2 of the 3 employees? Ok

In the context of salaries discussion, of course. Why wouldn't he? The point is he has 3 fulltime employees worth of salary that needs to be paid out. Doesn't matter if one of them is himself and another is his wife. If his wife got a job working somewhere else, he'd have to pay some other random person to do whatever she's doing on his games instead. It doesn't change anything.

He has 3 fulltime employees worth of salary that need to be paid out… because he says so?

How about being a little more specific? Anyone can claim they have x amount of employees, etc. Most Kickstarters introduce the people involved in the project.

Also, I just watched the video again and didn't see that mentioned. At what point in the video does he say that?

Originally Posted by JDR13
He has 3 fulltime employees worth of salary that need to be paid out… because he says so?

Yep, exactly. It's his company so he can do whatever the hell he wants anyway. I'm not even sure what you're arguing.

I responded because Couchpotato seemed to indicate there was some grand conspiracy in play because he had earned "a million dollars!" on Steam. A million dollars from Steam, over 7 years, isn't even all that great pay for 1 self-employed person (in Jeff's field and of his age) in the US once you pay all the self-employment taxes, health coverage, etc etc. Much less a couple, plus a 3rd person.

Also, I just watched the video again and didn't see that mentioned. At what point in the video does he say that?

Which thing? There was some point in there where he said he had 3 fulltime employees. Couch is the one who said that he said he'd made a million dollars on Steam, I couldn't find that so I just took Couch's word for it. Maybe it's wrong. Personally I would have expected the number to be much higher than a million dollars total from Steam over 7 years.

Best part of this whole pitch…The lack of BS.

You know what to expect. You might not like it, but at least hes not selling hopes and dreams of an RPG "old school" revival guaranteed to recapture your childhood.

Originally Posted by Stingray
Yep, exactly. It's his company so he can do whatever the hell he wants anyway. I'm not even sure what you're arguing.

I responded because Couchpotato seemed to indicate there was some grand conspiracy in play because he had earned "a million dollars!" on Steam. A million dollars from Steam, over 7 years, isn't even all that great pay for 1 self-employed person (in Jeff's field and of his age) in the US once you pay all the self-employment taxes, health coverage, etc etc. Much less a couple, plus a 3rd person.

I'm not arguing anything. I'm just skeptical that he has 3 full-time employees plus multiple freelancers. If he does, I'd be curious to know exactly what they do. Like I said, most Kickstarters introduce the team members working on the project. I don't think he has any real full-time employees other than himself.

There's no conspiracy here. Just a subpar kickstarter which, imo, is nothing more than a money grab.

Originally Posted by Stingray
Which thing? There was some point in there where he said he had 3 fulltime employees. Couch is the one who said that he said he'd made a million dollars on Steam, I couldn't find that so I just took Couch's word for it. Maybe it's wrong. Personally I would have expected the number to be much higher than a million dollars total from Steam over 7 years.

I've watched it twice now, and he doesn't say that anywhere in the video.

You mean the million dollar thing, right? If so, dunno. Couch lying to us!

Re-reading Couch's orig post, he did say "over one million" anyway, so maybe that isn't inconsistent with my suspicion that he's probably made a fair bit more than a million on Steam… Still no clue where it is in the video tho.

I hope some folk here are right. I really hope that this gameplay footage is just a "placeholder". Because if not, I don't know exactly what is "the legend" doing on KS asking for money to buy the art for the game. I mean if it is the same recycled art there is no point in KS.

My opinion about SS games that I have played is that they have a decent storyline and a decent combat system. In the other hand the art and the animations, oh god… They do make the game more difficult to enjoy IMO.

Originally Posted by gabrielarantest
I hope some folk here are right. I really hope that this gameplay footage is just a "placeholder". Because if not, I don't know exactly what is "the legend" doing on KS asking for money to buy the art for the game. I mean if it is the same recycled art there is no point in KS.

My opinion about SS games that I have played is that they have a decent storyline and a decent combat system. In the other hand the art and the animations, oh god… They do make the game more difficult to enjoy IMO.

Yeah, the new project really looks… dated. I hope he will put the KS money to good use there. Though, I can live with dated graphics if he innovated somewhere else. Didn't hear any specifics in the vid, though. I was hoping for a fresh setting and not some samey fantasy world.

What all the Spiderweb games I played did very well was exploration and risk vs. reward. It was always satisfying to win a hard battle above your pay-grade and then reap the rewards.

Originally Posted by Darkheart
Yeah, the new project really looks… dated. I hope he will put the KS money to good use there. Though, I can live with dated graphics if he innovated somewhere else. Didn't hear any specifics in the vid, though. I was hoping for a fresh setting and not some samey fantasy world..

Yeah the graphics don't bother me but I'd like to hear more about the mechanics and what makes the setting unique. So far there's not much to go on. The base building stuff doesn't interest me (amd might put me off if it is grindy/obligatory). I'm hoping he says more about this stuff in updates.

Originally Posted by Arkadia7
Now, if he manages to reach 100 thousand, then that would impress me. And maybe instead of pocketing a large portion, he would actually put the money into modern age graphics…oh well, a man can dream…

He'll reach a lot more than 100k. It'll be 200k at least I guess.

Originally Posted by Pongo
Yeah the graphics don't bother me but I'd like to hear more about the mechanics and what makes the setting unique. So far there's not much to go on. The base building stuff doesn't interest me (amd might put me off if it is grindy/obligatory). I'm hoping he says more about this stuff in updates.

Exactly, I said in the pre-Kickstarter thread that the main thing Vogel needs to improve on isn't his graphics or his writing, it's his mechanics. And the entire KS pitch shows exactly zero on that topic.

Having said that, these graphics look like a downgrade though. Wasn't expecting that at all.

Originally Posted by JDR13
I'm not arguing anything. I'm just skeptical that he has 3 full-time employees plus multiple freelancers. If he does, I'd be curious to know exactly what they do. Like I said, most Kickstarters introduce the team members working on the project. I don't think he has any real full-time employees other than himself.

To be fair I think his wife handles almost all of the administrative, financial, and marketing work. And that's an important and extremely unglamarous part of having a game company, and it is also the part that sinks a lot of indie developers. Many of the failed kickstarter projects have either mismanaged their money or failed to market their games properly.

BTW: He's funded now, without an update, or a proper Kickstarter pitch. I wonder if he'll even bother doing more updates. Eventually he may be forced to do one when he reaches 75k.