The Elder Scrolls - A Promise Unfulfilled

I never played Daggerfall myself, but talk of the numerous bugs (game-breaking or otherwise) were enough to diminish any potential interest I had in it. I give it thought at times, but I stick by rule of "content over size" these days, and I hear more about Daggerfall's size more than I do it's content.

Originally Posted by Fluent
Still waiting for someone to take a modern swing at a Daggerfall style RPG. A large amount of handcrafted content sprinkled in a large procedurally generated world like Tanriel. With modern advances and tricks something interesting could be done.

I too like the idea but am unsure how doable it really is. I think that with tech advances the levels of higher fidelity achieved feeds the expectation of just that being the norm. I doubt the kind of highly varied and interesting to the player content can be done by generation. I'd be happy for that to wrong tho. A while ago when I played a lot of MW one of my dream game ideas was hand crafted locations in a client generated world - the game has x towns, y villages and z dungeons, all hand crafted which don't change much and that are linked by the story. Each time you start however you can gen the world space around and in between those locations. Haven't thought about that for a long time.

Daggerfall is ok, the ambition is laudable. I too vividly recall seeing the box - I remember thinking it looked kind of weird. I don't remember exactly why I didn't get it, I don't thing it ever really dawned on me that it was perhaps the kind of 3D rpg-adventure I'd often thought about. I was much more into simulations and shooters back then though.

Procedural generation I'm fine with secondary aspects, but leave it out of world, quests, important npcs, etc.
Something similar to Nemesis system to give ordinary mooks/npcs more presence and "awareness" in the world.

Originally Posted by KaosWarMonk
I too like the idea but am unsure how doable it really is. I think that with tech advances the levels of higher fidelity achieved feeds the expectation of just that being the norm. I doubt the kind of highly varied and interesting to the player content can be done by generation. I'd be happy for that to wrong tho. A while ago when I played a lot of MW one of my dream game ideas was hand crafted locations in a client generated world - the game has x towns, y villages and z dungeons, all hand crafted which don't change much and that are linked by the story. Each time you start however you can gen the world space around and in between those locations. Haven't thought about that for a long time.

Daggerfall is ok, the ambition is laudable. I too vividly recall seeing the box - I remember thinking it looked kind of weird. I don't remember exactly why I didn't get it, I don't thing it ever really dawned on me that it was perhaps the kind of 3D rpg-adventure I'd often thought about. I was much more into simulations and shooters back then though.

Well to be fair, and I could be wrong about this, but my understanding is that Daggerfall has just as much handcrafted content as Morrowind or any typical TES game, it's just spread out more. There are handcrafted dungeons and so forth, usually the ones related to quests, and the main quest is entirely handcrafted. The trick would be to spread the large amount of handcrafted content out greatly but also try and lead the player in just the slightest way that they'd be able to find it while also enjoying the solid to good procedurally generated content and interesting exploration.

The advances in procedural dungeon designs, "radiant" quests and the basic TES pillars seem vast compared to the time Daggerfall was made, so I think there could be things done in that area that Bethesda only dreamed they could do back then. I also think if any company is to take a crack at it, Bethesda are the only ones who could do it, IMO. They have the money, desire & resources, they can release the games they want to make and they have intimate knowledge of the systems and theories behind Daggerfall and their previous games. They'd have a huge head start.

I'd like to see it personally, so maybe it's wishful thinking but I really don't think it's out of the realm of possibility today. My gut feeling still says we're going to see some really surprising things when TES VI info starts leaking. If not Daggerfall big, I think it will have some elements of procedural generation building on Skyrim's Radiant Questing system and also a much larger landmass. I think the Morrowind/Oblivion/Skyrim style is going to look like an old model when we start learning about the new game. Can't wait for more info, though.

Originally Posted by Darth Tagnan
Daggerfall and Elite 2 Frontier both taught me the value of actual content over size and numbers. I've never looked back, really.

But to each his own.

A lot of people have never stopped being impressed by big numbers. When No Man's Sky was talking about its "billions of worlds" it was games like Daggerfall that I thought of. Why anyone would think you can procedurally generate a gamespace on that scale and still have anything worth exploring, I don't know.

Never got to DaggerFall, instead I remember playing through BattleSpire.

The game was janky even for the time but also compelling. 3D was a burgeoning new world back then. Quite difficult too from memory - the kind of difficulty where kiting enemies was often necessary.

Also, the game featured an 'adult' mode where some female sprites were topless.
I remember that - not sure why the documentary didn't mention it - might be the only time a Bethesda game featured nudity outside of mods.

Originally Posted by JFarrell71
A lot of people have never stopped being impressed by big numbers. When No Man's Sky was talking about its "billions of worlds" it was games like Daggerfall that I thought of. Why anyone would think you can procedrually generate a gamespace on that scale and still have anything worth exploring, I don't know.

I feel you

I have no idea why people enjoy "content" generated by simplistic algorithms so much, but there it is.

I enjoy Daggerfall for what it is, and I really hope that guy finishes the Unity port. It's not a game I'd spend 100 hours on, but I'd still like to play through the main quest someday.

IIRC, the main quest is mostly bespoke content - so I might enjoy that as well.

But I'm not big on playing vastly outdated archaic games. I do like the thought of completing games, though.

But there are literally hundreds of great old CRPGs that I never completed, and Daggerfall is very low on my list of games I'd want to complete, if I ever had that kind of time.

To each his own, though.

Well, no one is ever going to accuse you of being a completionist, that's for sure.

At least I know I'm not

But, your method of getting rid of your video card is interesting. I might try that one

I think you lost us there, Dart.

That's called "skillfully diverting attention" JDR

It doesn't require much skill to divert your attention, guys

I got tired of falling through the floor into the world ocean in Daggerfall for the umpteenth time. OK, it was kind of cool to look up and see the twisty dungeon hanging over your head when that happened.

Are you playing the original version?

ARENA and Skyrim were the best, hands down.

The only Elder Scrolls game I can say I really really played was Oblivion. I've sunk hours into it, using an assortment of mods, both widely known (OOO, Qarl's Texture Pack, Unofficial Patches, among others) and not-so-much (Bag of Holding). I played Skyrim like 10 minutes or so, then I cannot say I played it. And I also played a good chunk of Nehrim and I can't remember why I gave it up.

I watched the whole video, I like the backstage stories behind the older Elder Scrolls games. I even bought all TES games available at GOG expecting to play them, but everytime I see a video regarding Daggerfall, I feel less and less inclined to even install it, to a point I really hope the Daggerfall Unity project sees the light of the day.

Enderal is best that came out of that rusty heap of engine. ( Plus sex mods! )

Originally Posted by BoboTheMighty
Enderal is best that came out of that rusty heap of engine. ( Plus sex mods! )

SureAI never disappoints, and all the sex mods are plentiful.

Just proves juvenile perverts are a huge target for mods.