Elder Scrolls VI - Still in Design Phase

Putting characters ahead of the story is a sure way to fail. It's practically guaranteed.

Originally Posted by Carnifex
Putting characters ahead of the story is a sure way to fail. It's practically guaranteed.

Characters = story.

Tell me a story that doesn't involve characters.

I'd say that character is an essential part of story, but not that it equals story. I think there is a big difference between narrative and character. You definitely get writers who state that it's all about character, and they're not even interested in narrative, whereas you get others who are very keen on shaping and pacing a narrative, which must involve a bit more contrivance with the characters. I think it's interesting, and I reckon it's about the balance.

Originally Posted by Ripper
I think it's interesting, and I reckon it's about the balance.

Well, Bethesda doesn't have any balance issue there imo. They're equally bad at writing characters and story.

Originally Posted by Ivanwah
I really hope they are designing a new engine but I know that's not going to happen.

Originally Posted by JFarrell71
Yes, it is. They've said so.

Creation Engine 2 which was upgraded for Starfield. So no it's not a new engine just a more improved one. Bethesda will never get rid of this engine for both ES and Fallout.

Next will be creation Engine 3 and so on till it's reworked and renamed once again.

They're always going to call it "Creation Engine" whatever. Doesn't mean it's not new. Iteration on what you've done before isn't strange.

Originally Posted by Ripper
I'd say that character is an essential part of story, but not that it equals story.

Yeah, I didn't mean they're the same thing. I mean they're equally important and can't have story without characters. I agree that you need both, though I think in games you need characters more since the story in an RPG is fluid by nature (and let's be honest: the plots are rarely anything to crow about)

Originally Posted by JFarrell71
They're always going to call it "Creation Engine" whatever. Doesn't mean it's not new. Iteration on what you've done before isn't strange.

He's still not wrong it's not a completely new engine made from scratch. That's what a new engine means you design something completely different not with the same code.

Link - https://www.reddit.com/r/GamingLeaks…date_reloaded/

The creation engine was built on the gamebyro code base and so forth as well.

I get what your saying but many want a new engine not just the same upgraded, and like I said it will probably never happen. I probably wont live long enough to see it.

Since it takes 6-10 years for every new Fallout or Elder Scroll game.

Characters should never equate to the story. They are certainly part of it, and can convey much, yet the onus should always be relating the story first and foremost. This remains true across all forms of entertainment. Well, I'm assuming you want the story to be lucid, if not, do as you will.

Talking about upgraded engines I hope they can finally fix the physics and random ctd's errors that plague their games. As both are meme's at this point in time.

Originally Posted by Couchpotato
Talking about upgraded engines I hope they can finally fix the physics and random ctd's errors that plague their games. As both are meme's at this point in time.

I actually thought FO 4 was a big improvement in that way. I still saw some wonky things from time to time, but I don't recall having a single CTD. I wasn't using a lot of mods though so that's probably why.

Yeah it's usually mods even when said mods aren't in conflict with anything. Having said that I stil get some random CTDs even on unmodded play-throughways.

Nothing more annoying than a random ctd with no error. Just boom game closes.

This seems to be random with every player who posts about the problem and most fixes don't stop it. I've narrowed it down to corrupt saves or broken/corrupted game cells.

Only FN:V has mods that stooped the random CTD's for me.

Originally Posted by Carnifex
Characters should never equate to the story. They are certainly part of it, and can convey much, yet the onus should always be relating the story first and foremost. This remains true across all forms of entertainment. Well, I'm assuming you want the story to be lucid, if not, do as you will.

I'm of the same opinion.

If you put the character before the story, it means you really focus on the psychology of that character, which doesn't make it a bad experience for a book or a movie, but it's usually harder to appreciate because it's more static, "nothing happens". The story is lighter and its main purpose is to trigger the interesting thoughts and sentiments, and describe them at length. I'm not sure it would translate well to a game. Even for books and movies, that's usually not for the mass market.

If you put the story before the characters, the focus is on the actions and it gets shallower, maybe even cliché. Most action games are in that category. Nothing wrong with it, but not my preferred type for RPGs.

When both the story and the characters are important, it gets interesting. IMO a game should keep enough story to give a purpose to the player, then develop the characters to give it enough depth and keep the motivation of the player to achieve the purpose. Of course those characters must be compatible with the story, they must be somewhat tailored to it, so the player believes the companions have the same purpose, and the antagonists have the same "anti-purpose". If they've got deep personalities but are completely unrelated to the story, it won't stick.

So I think it should be somewhere between story+char and story, where exactly is just a personal preference.

Yeah, story is almost a non-factor for me. I like loot, an open world, and lots of fun game systems to mess around in. It's why I enjoy Skyrim much more than The Witcher 3. W3 tried to tell me a story I had no interest in at all. Same with DOS 1/2. I'm an avid reader, so the stories that games try to tell almost always bore me to tears due to simplicity. They can also bore me, even if good, if they take up time I could be leveling, looting, and casting spells everywhere (Planescape Torment).

If I want story time, I read a book. Well, honestly I stare at a Kindle Fire, Kindle Cloud Reader, iphone, RoyalRoad website, etc

P.S. I loved the Witcher story on Netflix; at least the first season. Not sure if more have been made….

Originally Posted by crpgnut
Yeah, story is almost a non-factor for me. I like loot, an open world, and lots of fun game systems to mess around in. It's why I enjoy Skyrim much more than The Witcher 3. W3 tried to tell me a story I had no interest in at all.

TW3 has all of those things plus good writing. I think you're just allergic to stories in games.

Originally Posted by crpgnut
P.S. I loved the Witcher story on Netflix; at least the first season. Not sure if more have been made….

Season 2 releases on Dec 17th.

Up until Kingdom Come: Deliverance, the Witcher three had my vote for likely being the single player open world game that I'd most likely return to play in the future. In the end, both are really excellent at what they do, and any Elder Scroll game that comes even close to that level will be one worth playing. I'm still waiting for that.

Id Software should help Bethesda make a new engine for Elder Scrolls 6!

Originally Posted by SirJames
Id Software should help Bethesda make a new engine for Elder Scrolls 6!

Fuck no the game would be over 1TB with their engine.

Also Bethesda ruled the ID engine out because it couldn't handle the amount of some details. You can't even mod that engine and it would piss of the modders.

Well, that's true. They do rely heavily on mods to fix their games. TES6 might as well just be a map editor.

Originally Posted by SirJames
Well, that's true. They do rely heavily on mods to fix their games. TES6 might as well just be a map editor.

There is a major kernel of truth to this. While I enjoy vanilla TES very much, it doesn't light a candle to the games that can be played with mods active. Without modding, my hours played would be in the 200-300 range, not 2000+