Sex and maturity in The Witcher

holy crap they had nudie tradin' cards in medieval times. damn i know where i'm headin' with my time machine.

by the way i don't think Sorcha is a feminist as magerette points out, in fact "Shrapnel" if you knew more about people you were attacking you would find that she's posted lots of quality artwork on this site, with fantasy exagerrated male and female bodies. i think the argument of what is a nude trading card mini game doing in a mature story is appropriate. haven't played the game yet myself, though while i wouldn't mind seeing some scantily clad maidens in the witcher the whole trading card thing seems vary out of place. in gothic however something simple like a rolled up "map" with a simple drawing seemed both appropriate and fiting to the setting. the whole concept of trading cards though is very modern and to me doesn't belong in a game setting that takes place in a parallel past.

The sex cards minigame might be a little tacky, but sex is not mandatory - it can be avoided, and the game isn't misogynistic - the society in the game largely is, but it's only because it's based on the medieval society much more closely than most fantasy/RPG settings. But I definitely wouldn't call Geralt a misogynist. It's like saying that a game set in the American South in the 19th century is racist, because the society portrayed in the game is.

Anyway, Geralt's main love interest in the books was Yennefer. They had an on-and-off relationship with each other and had other sexual partners while in the relationship. I'm sure the in-game relationship with Geralt doesn't stop Triss from having other partners either - I guess witchers, sorcerers and sorceresses aren't into monogamy. In the Witcher books/game it's not only a male thing. Dorceresses like Yennefer and Triss have a similar attitude towards men that Geralt has towards women - would you also oppose a game where you play a sorceress who can potentially have sex with many men and collect cards with their nude portraits?

I wouldn't oppose any of it, Ausir--my generation was rather fond of a concept called "Free Love." Of course, as we grow up, we tend to find out that nothing is really free..in the sense of "without cost"…

But that's beside the point. It's not the sex, it's not the totally appropriate use of the position of women in medieval times, it's the trading cards guys--and please note that I personally have no objection to them, because to me they are more amusing than anything else. I could have bought a censored version and never seen them, so I don't understand anyone making a big deal out of it at this point in time. When Sorcha made her statement it was either before or right at release, she was just saying that it didn't sound like her kind of game--but her post is taken out of context and portrayed as a "feminist flag" trying to pervert the nature of male enjoyment in the "male video game realm." It chapped my derriere, and I vented. I've read some of the (to me) idiotic and hostile real feminist stuff at the official forums, and I can understand why it got on people's nerves--it's silly and the arguments you and Shrapnel have raised about taking things out of context are perfectly valid returns to that --but this post was about the trading cards, and as curiously undead said, last I looked, they didn't have a thriving trade in technicolor dirty postcards during a time when everything was enscribed on sheep's vellum with a nibbed quill.

Taking your example, if you're asking for my personal preference of course I would be quite happy to play as a sorceress free to fool around, but I really don't think I'd be off trying to complete a card collection--though a nice little memento of Geralt to fold in a lace handkerchief and put away in a drawer scented with lavender would work for me.


I think as I've said before somewhere that the Witcher handles male/female relationships in a way that allows some real roleplaying, and you certainly have the choice not to collect a single card, so for me it's a non-issue. I just don't like to see someone flamed for quietly stating an opinion.

Edit; And thanks for the material about Yennefer. Hopefully someday we'll have Sapkowski here in the US.

Well, at least she didn't compare collecting the cards to collecting severed heads of Blacks and Jews like some idiot at RPG Codex did. If she thinks those things are comparable, her sex life must suck hard.

Edit; And thanks for the material about Yennefer. Hopefully someday we'll have Sapkowski here in the US.

You'll have it in May:

http://www.amazon.com/Last-Wish-Andr…dp/0316029181/

Unless you're willing to import the book from the UK, then you can have it now.

Originally Posted by Ausir
Well, at least she didn't compare collecting the cards to collecting severed heads of Blacks and Jews like some idiot at RPG Codex did. If she thinks those things are comparable, her sex life must suck hard..

Perhaps literally. I hate drama queens. First of all, most times a woman runs around in her underwear asking for presents, she's fully aware what she's going to be delivering in appreciation of them. Second of all, that's just silly.

You'll have it in May:

http://www.amazon.com/Last-Wish-Andr…dp/0316029181/

Unless you're willing to import the book from the UK, then you can have it now.

I was at one time thinking about it, but decided to wait for the US version. I hope they found a good translator. I can tell the writing is full of native references and humor-I'd learn Polish but my memory is barely able to deal with my English vocabulary--half my time is spent on dictionary.com anymore.

Three of the Witcher short stories are available online.

http://fallout.scifi.pl/The_Witcher.pdf

This is an excellent translation by Michael Kandel, the man who translated most of Stanislaw Lem's books to English as well, it was translated for some anthology and later sent out by CD Projekt as promotional material. Unfortunately, Kandel, while otherwise great, took much liberty with proper names - that is, he completely changed most of them, while the translators of the game and the book chose to stick to the original or only change it slightly to make it easier to pronounce. Kandel, for unknown reasons, changed:

Foltest to Hrobost
Vizima to Klosthur
Temeria to Kra
Velerad to Ethmond
Medell to Demell
striga to gomb
Mahakam to Apiph
Ostrit to Osrugh
Pontar to Fonzor
so you need to remember that while reading.

http://fallout.scifi.pl/A_Grain_of_Truth.PDF

This one is an excerpt from the translated book, and the translation here is more faithful to the original, but the language used is much more bland (it was translated by Danusia Stok, a Pole, not by a native speaker of English). Kandel would be a much better choice, although they probably would have to tell him to be less creative with proper names.

http://www.sme.sk/datahry/683/shortstoryLesserEvil.pdf

A fan-made translation, which was officially released some time ago by CD Projekt.

For the rest of the stories you'd have to buy the books. The first book has been published in the UK and will be published in the US next year. More books are forthcoming. You can read more here:

http://witcher.wikia.com/wiki/Witcher_series

Thanks very much Ausir. I had read The Lesser Evil, but the other two are new to me. Printing them out as we speak. Looking forward to the whole book, and hopefully a few more before it's all over.

Unfortunately, the British publisher decided that since novels sell better than short story collections, they'll publish "Blood of Elves" (the third book and first novel) and skip "The Sword of Destiny" (the second book and short story collection), even though the stories in "The Sword of Destiny" introduce many of the characters and themes that are important to the novels. The US publisher is likely to do the same, since they probably just buy the translation from the UK one. Oh well…

As a Cuban gentleman I once worked with used to say--"Algun es mas que nada."(At least I think that's what he said. )
Something is better than nothing.

Algun es mas que nada

Maybe you should get the Spanish edition? They've translated almost all of the books already.

Wonder if they'll consider making a game from the PoV of a female sorceress?? It might work just as well.

It's just me - but really I don't know why everyone calls it as collection of cards/trading cards. You don't have them in your inventory, you don't have them store somewhere together, you can watch them all at one time, move them, sort them ect . All you have is adittional painting of character in your journal - I treat it as a MEMORY of Gerlat.

If some guys treat it as collection or trophy - time to get a real not virtual girl .

I agree with you zima--that's exactly my take on them. If the game was all about that, it would be different. To me they're mementos of Geralt's human side, and also a bit sad at times.

All in all, a big fuss over nothing.

Originally Posted by magerette
All in all, a big fuss over nothing.

Couldn't agree more!!! Sometimes I think people, journalists, poloticians (not sure if they are people, yet) should take a step back and think about what they are getting upset about. It's a game, its not the devil incarnate come to send everyone to hell.

The cards are stupid, I don't mind the sexual content but I don't need a little trading card to go along with it. I'm not going to stop buying a great game because there is one part of a game that is just lame but hey, that's just me

Hell, I liked my first card (triss merigold). I took a screenshot and put it as my desktop!

Just like with Sacred, if there was a quick and easy way to tweak it to the uncensored version I probably would, but I'm sure not going outta my way to do it. I'm fine with it like it is, I'll collect my cutie cards n be happy tiger w/ new desktop now n then.

Immature? Dumb? Sure! That's the glory of it! So what, it's a little bit of puerile fun for the boys.

There is one card that I'm dying to get, but man she is playing hard to get like you wouldnt believe!

Hey Sammy, I didn't realise you had a 'thing' for CM!!

It's a medieval world where women are socially second class citizens. It's not a new idea and has been visible in rpgs since the seventies. A fictional world that is sexist doesn't mean the people who developed (or play) the game are. It's not like you can bed every woman in the game and they become such a minor part of the game-play that you can quite easily brush them aside.

These cards are just part of The Witcher as an experience in this world. I guess you could see them as an expression of how Geralt relates to women, but one of the great thing about games is the ability to choose the outcomes. So I believe any available choices in rpgs are generally a good thing.

Originally Posted by xSamhainx
There is one card that I'm dying to get, but man she is playing hard to get like you wouldnt believe!

You should see her *without* the makeup.

*Puts yet another check mark down for Corwin on his special list!*