|
Your donations keep RPGWatch running!
RPGWatch Forums » Comments » News Comments » Opinion - What Kingdom Come can teach Elder Scrolls

Default Opinion - What Kingdom Come can teach Elder Scrolls

February 26th, 2018, 12:16
Gamespot opine on what Elder Scrolls games can learn from Kingdom Come: Deliverance.

loading…


Kingdom Come: Deliverance is in many ways a more realistic survival take on The Elder Scrolls series and we think there are some lessons future Elder Scrolls games could learn from it.
More information.
Silver is offline

Silver

Silver's Avatar
Spaceman
RPGWatch Team

#1

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 5,705
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)

Default 

February 26th, 2018, 13:35
My "opine" is that Gamespot doesn't know what are they talking about:
We're left thinking, “Wow, this really is a lot like an Elder Scrolls game.”
Say what?

KCD and TES games have only two things in common: utter buggyness and no hairworks.
Everything else is totally different and I don't see why should one learn from another. KCD is trying to be storydriven game with meaningful sidequests and without godlike trashmobs, TES games are supposed to be nostory grinders with instant trashmob respawns and dumb fetch quests. As both have their audience, let's just keep 'em as they are.
--
Toka Koka
joxer is offline

joxer

joxer's Avatar
The Smoker
RPGWatch Donor
Original Sin 1 & 2 Donor

#2

Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 19,259
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)

Default 

February 26th, 2018, 13:49
@joxer
I don't know if they can't learn something from each other. Although yes they have different aims. I like that you can be interupted while fast travelling. That could be cool in an elder scrolls game. It would definitely work in a fallout game so why not.

Other things I like are the more involved combat system. Elder scrolls has a joke of a combat system and really needs to step up its game here. Also I can't count the number of times I was carrying useless stuff and just spam consuming food to raise my health in combat. Its lazy really. Also story and character writing need significant work compared to Kingdom Come.

Having said that Elder Scrolls is quite a fun world for just larping about and creating your own fun. It would be nice if the world they created supported that more through.
Silver is offline

Silver

Silver's Avatar
Spaceman
RPGWatch Team

#3

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 5,705
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)

Default 

February 26th, 2018, 19:17
Yes there are people who play FPS games in survivalist mode, and that's fine for them. For a fantasy setting though, I'd rather have the game abstract that component and focus on other elements.
rjshae is offline

rjshae

rjshae's Avatar
Periapt vs Paronomasia
RPGWatch Donor

#4

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Seattle
Posts: 4,347
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)

Default 

February 26th, 2018, 19:23
Originally Posted by joxer View Post

KCD and TES games have only two things in common: utter buggyness and no hairworks.
Everything else is totally different
Same Oblivion like underlivering NPCs.
--
Backlog:0
ChienAboyeur is online now

ChienAboyeur

SasqWatch

#5

Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,267
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)

Default 

February 26th, 2018, 19:36
Perhaps the thing KCD can learn from TES is how to approach save games.

My life is my own and when a game makes me play extra just to save my position because wifey, my daughter or some important call comes up just is not going to work for me. So any game that does not let me save when I want or have save, I say . . . F em.
Dajjer is offline

Dajjer

Dajjer's Avatar
SasqWatch
Original Sin Donor

#6

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 1,597
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)

Default 

February 27th, 2018, 03:26
Which is why they are looking at putting in a save-on-quit feature, @Dajjer. You probably don't want to buy until they put it in.

"…and really needs to step up its game here" - I see what you did there, @Silver
--
The very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they alter the facts to fit their views….
-- Doctor Who in "Face of Evil"
Zloth is offline

Zloth

Zloth's Avatar
I smell a… wumpus!?

#7

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 5,787
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
+1:

Default 

February 27th, 2018, 04:54
@Zloth
At least someone noticed.
Silver is offline

Silver

Silver's Avatar
Spaceman
RPGWatch Team

#8

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 5,705
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)

Default 

February 27th, 2018, 05:39
Originally Posted by joxer View Post
KCD and TES games have only two things in common: utter buggyness and no hairworks.
Hairworks has to be the biggest waste of processing power ever added to a game.

Originally Posted by joxer View Post
Everything else is totally different and I don't see why should one learn from another.
Everything? They're both first person? They're both RPGs? They both have skills? They both have inventories? They both have leveling up? They both have a world map? They both have movement by foot, mount or fast travel? They both have lockpicking? They both have chests with treasure?

I could probably carry on listing things they have in common all day. Did you really not notice these things? The differences are subtle. I'm not saying subtle differences are unimportant, but these are both 1st person RPGS and I'm sure my non-gamer mother couldn't tell them apart.

Originally Posted by joxer View Post
KCD is trying to be storydriven game with meaningful sidequests and without godlike trashmobs, TES games are supposed to be nostory grinders with instant trashmob respawns and dumb fetch quests. As both have their audience, let's just keep 'em as they are.
TES games always have a story? KCD trashmobs also respawn? KCD also has dumb fetch quests?

Like, sure, you love KCD. But, damn, you sound so full of shit like a classic fanboi who can't see anything objectively.
SirJames is offline

SirJames

SirJames's Avatar
SasqWatch

#9

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,742
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)

Default 

February 27th, 2018, 06:14
You forgot being openworld.
What you deliberately don't want to accept is there are openworlds and there are openworlds. Different ones.

When it comes to bugs, bugs are not design decision nor differentiate between titles (or genres).
GPU processing power is waste, sure. On Nintendo Gameboy.

I am fanboi of polished products made for PC. I'll continue being full of shit as long as retarded designs restricted by inferior hardware appear on PC. That's definetly subjective and I will never say it isn't.
See, I'm not consolegames company CEO selling garbage by presenting bullshit as if it's made of gold.
I will never change. Unless a superior platform that can do better than PC appears. Sorry about that.

EDIT:
Your non-gamer mother could tell them apart any day. All you need is to show her this just once and say which game it's from, she'd recognize that game later anywhere:

loading…
--
Toka Koka
joxer is offline

joxer

joxer's Avatar
The Smoker
RPGWatch Donor
Original Sin 1 & 2 Donor

#10

Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 19,259
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)

Default 

February 27th, 2018, 06:39
Awww, man. Now I'm even more confused.

You said bugs both games have "utter buggyness" in common, but now you're implying that KCD is a "polished product", and polish comes after bug squashing. Polish is finishing touches that are not required but bug squashing is definitely required!

I mean, I agree that Bethsoft have been very focused on consoles ever since the xbox360, but so has everyone. Even Larian before they officially announced Divinity 2 they were talking about their "next-gen console game". To skip every game that also has a console release would be to skip all AAA games!

There's open worlds and open worlds? Isn't Skyrim actually bigger than KCD? It's also packed full of locations to visit?

Gameboy specs =
Central Processing Unit (CPU) 8 Bit, Clock frequency: 4.19 MHz, RAM: 8 Kbytes

It would take thousands of gameboys to run hairworks without witcher3 being attached!

I've never seen spiders behaving like that in Skyrim or any TES. It's probably a bug from some mods they have installed.
SirJames is offline

SirJames

SirJames's Avatar
SasqWatch

#11

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,742
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)

Default 

February 27th, 2018, 06:48
Where did I say KCD is polished? It's not. It's bug-o-rama.

I have no idea which game is bigger. What interests me is quality and not quantity. But you know what I think about endless respawns already.

Over years I learned not to blame mods nor modders for anything. Without modders SkyUI and norespawn would never exist.
Nor would the unofficial patch I never used but apparently it creates illusion that the game was not left in pisspoor state by it's developer.

Posted the video I used in the past, lemme remind you of another one good to teach non-player mothers how to recognize Skyrim:

loading…
--
Toka Koka
joxer is offline

joxer

joxer's Avatar
The Smoker
RPGWatch Donor
Original Sin 1 & 2 Donor

#12

Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 19,259
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)
+1:

Default 

February 27th, 2018, 07:15
@joxer
hehehee, two can play at that game!

I showed my NGM this and she thought it was a skyrim spider!
loading…
SirJames is offline

SirJames

SirJames's Avatar
SasqWatch

#13

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,742
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)

Default 

February 27th, 2018, 16:45
Originally Posted by Silver View Post
Its lazy really.
IMO, this is the single thing worth saying about the Elder Scrolls.
They make tons of money doing what they're doing, so naturally that's what they're going to continue to do.
screeg is offline

screeg

screeg's Avatar
floating head

#14

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 1,879
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
+1:

Default 

March 1st, 2018, 19:32
The 2 games are nothing alike. I had over 200 hours in Skyrim and about 75 now in KCD.

Yes, KCD is buggy, but it's still a very fun game with tons of stuff to do. The game world is beautiful. I have to give Warhorse some credit here, I backed this game on Kickstarter way back when, like what, 5 years ago? No less than a year ago, I was
convinced the game would never be released. The beta was a completely unplayable mess.

And then they actually pulled it off and released a good game. Now they have lots of work to do patching up all the bugs. Still playable and still fun. I guess since I played through the first 3 Gothics, there's not any amount of bugs I cannot endure as long as I somehow get past them.

And the combat in KCD is hard and much more mechanically complex than in Skyrim. You need a bow to survive early on, but later you can get good at melee.
Hyperion is offline

Hyperion

Sentinel

#15

Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 253
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)

Default 

March 1st, 2018, 19:35
Originally Posted by Dajjer View Post
Perhaps the thing KCD can learn from TES is how to approach save games.

My life is my own and when a game makes me play extra just to save my position because wifey, my daughter or some important call comes up just is not going to work for me. So any game that does not let me save when I want or have save, I say . . . F em.
You do know there is a save game you can download and install from Nexus in about 2 minutes, right? You can save anytime you want.
Hyperion is offline

Hyperion

Sentinel

#16

Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 253
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)

Default 

March 1st, 2018, 23:02
Originally Posted by Hyperion View Post
You do know there is a save game you can download and install from Nexus in about 2 minutes, right? You can save anytime you want.
Yup, I am aware of that. But when I do, do mods. I do them after completion of the vanilla game. I simply wont play a brand new game that needs a mod to work. I come from the days when you had to config sys a brand new game for a couple hours just to get it to run. And this was the norm not the special case. Matching audio cards and graphic cards and hi mem or no high me and the special CD just to get the game to start. Sorry but those days are far in the past and when I have to do more than figure out what avatar name I am going to use when I start up a new game, well, . . . . NO.

Now obviously KCD is no where near close to those old school relics. But save game is a critical feature for me and when developers have the mind set that they are building a save feature to prevent gamers from gaming their game. . . . Not only does my Spock eyebrow raise, but my spidey senses start tingling and my BS meter is swinging way to the end of the scale.

KCD looks like an interesting game and when the developers get the save system right I will partake. Until then, the RPG playing field is way to vast for me to waste any time on a game that will have my wife hitting me over the head with a frying pan for playing a game instead of being at the family dinner table.


hyperbole much . . . . yes
Dajjer is offline

Dajjer

Dajjer's Avatar
SasqWatch
Original Sin Donor

#17

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 1,597
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)

Default 

March 2nd, 2018, 10:35
Yeah, I usually prefer to play games in a "pure" manner initially, but I simply had to get that mod. It was just driving me crazy.
Maylander is offline

Maylander

SasqWatch
Original Sin Donor

#18

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bergen
Posts: 7,132
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Send a message via MSN to Maylander
RPGWatch Forums » Comments » News Comments » Opinion - What Kingdom Come can teach Elder Scrolls
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT +2. The time now is 14:09.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright by RPGWatch