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Default NWN - Enhanced Edition Coming Soon

November 22nd, 2017, 15:39
It's been an interesting thread.

As a Mac gamer who was forced to run the Windows versions of all the original games that Beamdog has released (the original mac editions have long since stopped working), these enhanced editions have been worth the money. I can understand the point of view of people who don't find them worth the money, though. The thing is, as has been said before, they can just not buy them as they clearly already own them in a format that suits them. So I find the anger puzzling. But, whatever.

I certainly don't see this, or any of the EEs, as a "cash grab." Unless by cash grab you mean "attempting to make mony so we can stay in business." And if people want to spend a few bucks for a portrait pack that the rest of us don't need, then I say let them. In the case of the upcoming NWN:EE, I think their intent is to use it as a content platform for future modules which, so long as the quality is top notch, should be worth paying for. I think this will ultimately be a very good thing for classic RPGs in general, and I welcome it.
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November 22nd, 2017, 15:44
FYI:

When I say something is a cash grab, I mean whatever you're selling doesn't reflect the work you put into it - or the value of said product. As in, the price and your expected profit margin does not reflect the original concept of a fair trade.

To me, that is.

Oh, I know capitalism and greed has all but eroded the concept of a "fair trade" and it's all just a free market - where opportunism is a positive regardless of long-term consequences for the market. That's not quite my line of thinking, though.

Also, it's not so much a cash grab as an attempted cash grab.

Finally, I can call something a cash grab from an exceedingly emotionally neutral position. There's zero anger involved - and I rarely get emotional about the industry. I lost that level of investment years and years ago.

It's more of a brain working thing than a heart response thing. Not everyone has that - I know

As for their "intent" - I hope they end up doing something worthwhile. Not sure why anyone would just assume that, but whatever.

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November 22nd, 2017, 15:53
Understood. But from my point of view, the act of porting the game to multiple platforms and maintaining all three versions going forward is enough to justify the price. Clearly Windows gamers are going to see less value in that. But I suspect they've put more effort into this project than most people suspect, and clearly intend to keep doing so.
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November 22nd, 2017, 15:56
Originally Posted by Clocknova View Post
Understood. But from my point of view, the act of porting the game to multiple platforms and maintaining all three versions going forward is enough to justify the price. Clearly Windows gamers are going to see less value in that. But I suspect they've put more effort into this project than most people suspect, and clearly intend to keep doing so.
Which is completely fair. I have no reason to interfere with the position of other people.

If you think it's worth the price and that they've worked enough on it to justify charging 20$ for a slightly modified game other people developed 15 years ago - then that's cool.

No issue with that.

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November 22nd, 2017, 16:04
Originally Posted by crpgnut View Post
I did that once with a wedding ring
Agreed 100%. Mine was super expensive and was only ever used once.
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November 22nd, 2017, 16:26
Ever-increasing, repugnant business practices thrive because of foolish consumer habits. And vapid nostalgia in this case.

You would expect blind acceptance from a 14-24 year old demographic (they don't know any better), but to see it in what are 30+ year olds is demoralizing. The corporate future is bright indeed.
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November 22nd, 2017, 16:47
Originally Posted by Drithius View Post
Ever-increasing, repugnant business practices thrive because of foolish consumer habits. And vapid nostalgia in this case.

You would expect blind acceptance from a 14-24 year old demographic (they don't know any better), but to see it in what are 30+ year olds is demoralizing. The corporate future is bright indeed.
If you find my willingness to buy NWN:EE demoralizing, then this must have been a GREAT year for you.
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November 22nd, 2017, 16:54
To me, what Beamdog is doing is the equivalent to flipping a house. I just don't have a problem with their business model. Clearly there's a demand for the updated version of the games, and Beamdog is supplying the skills to make it happen. Those who object seem to want something for nothing, which they're probably use to getting from the modding community. Well, modding is a hobby, not a useful model for a sustainable business… unless we all decide to go communist for some reason. But I kind of like to eat, so I'll stick with capitalism.
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November 22nd, 2017, 17:14
There are those who see value in the proposition, and those who don't, but I don't think this belongs in the same basket as micro transactions and clearly anti-consumer practices. That stuff is, IMO, a clear case of turkeys voting for Christmas, but I don't see this in the same light.
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November 22nd, 2017, 19:05
I don't mind paying a reasonable price for the EE with all premium content, but to segregate and charge decade old content for $39.99 I find difficult to accept? Is this EA 2.0 by any chance?
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November 22nd, 2017, 20:14
Originally Posted by NewDArt View Post
When I say something is a cash grab, I mean whatever you're selling doesn't reflect the work you put into it - or the value of said product. As in, the price and your expected profit margin does not reflect the original concept of a fair trade.
I agree. God forbid they actually have to work hard for money. I like capitalism as well, but that doesn't mean I have to like the company/people who abuse the system unfairly (at least in my opinion). Others can call it smart, whatever else, that's their opinion.


Finally, I can call something a cash grab from an exceedingly emotionally neutral position. There's zero anger involved - and I rarely get emotional about the industry. I lost that level of investment years and years ago.
I'm getting there too. Not angry about these things anymore. Rarely anyway. I will rather spend time and effort playing the originals I love and support other developers/games that interests me like Pathfinder
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November 22nd, 2017, 20:16
Originally Posted by SpoonFULL View Post
I don't mind paying a reasonable price for the EE with all premium content, but to segregate and charge decade old content for $39.99 I find difficult to accept? Is this EA 2.0 by any chance?
I believe that the $40 price tag includes additional premium content which has been very difficult, if not impossible, to obtain legally until now. The $20 price is for the base game, both addons, and several premium modules; basically everything you get in the Diamond Edition, plus an updated engine and cross platform support.

Sounds like a win to me.
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November 22nd, 2017, 20:18
I agree. God forbid they actually have to work hard for money. I like capitalism as well, but that doesn't mean I have to like the company/people who abuse the system unfairly (at least in my opinion). Others can call it smart, whatever else, that's their opinion.
No one has to work hard as far as I'm concerned. I just don't think the money system can work indefinitely as long as people find ever easier paths towards profit based on not really creating anything - because it will create a very strong imbalance in the overall economy.

Well, that's obviously already very, very much too late.

Still doesn't mean I have to support it.

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November 22nd, 2017, 20:28
Originally Posted by Clocknova View Post
I believe that the $40 price tag includes additional premium content which has been very difficult, if not impossible, to obtain legally until now. The $20 price is for the base game, both addons, and several premium modules; basically everything you get in the Diamond Edition, plus an updated engine and cross platform support.

Sounds like a win to me.
The $40 version also include 2 soundtracks ( one with all NWN Jeremy Soule's music + one for the premium modules) and the new portraits pack.
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November 22nd, 2017, 20:55
Originally Posted by Clocknova View Post
As a Mac gamer who was forced to run the Windows versions of all the original games that Beamdog has released (the original mac editions have long since stopped working), these enhanced editions have been worth the money.
Originally Posted by NewDArt View Post
If you think it's worth the price and that they've worked enough on it to justify charging 20$ for a slightly modified game other people developed 15 years ago - then that's cool.
That is the value question for me:
- Will I play this game again?
- Can I play the currently available versions on my current computers?
- Is the replay worth what is being charged.

I prefer playing games on my MacBook Air over my Samsung Galaxy Book (MS Surface clone), and NWN no longer supports the Mac. NWN is a game that I *love* and replay fairly often, so I will absolutely replay. I have owned it physically (Mac & PC versions), digitally on a couple of platforms … so if I can now get back to playing it on the Mac for $20, that is a fair price for me.
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November 22nd, 2017, 20:57
Which poses an interesting question.

If you think it's worth the price based on your personal needs and resources - does that inherently mean they've earned that money and that it represents a fair trade?

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November 22nd, 2017, 21:11
Originally Posted by NewDArt View Post
Which poses an interesting question.

If you think it's worth the price based on your personal needs and resources - does that inherently mean they've earned that money and that it represents a fair trade?
According to free market capitalism, yes.
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November 22nd, 2017, 21:14
Originally Posted by Clocknova View Post
According to free market capitalism, yes.
Which is the definitely the first source you check for reliable answers

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November 22nd, 2017, 21:23
Originally Posted by NewDArt View Post
Which poses an interesting question.

If you think it's worth the price based on your personal needs and resources - does that inherently mean they've earned that money and that it represents a fair trade?
In the most simplistic terms I would say 'yes'. But there are multiple angles - my resources are greater than many, allowing my assessment of 'value proposition' to be warped compared to a lot of people. I also like to replay games more than many people, which again changes the balance sheet. But the whole 'play on Mac' is a very specific use case in which I think that the value is fairly easy to demonstrate … if this was just about Windows … well, I was fine playing NWN Diamond as it exists now just a couple of months ago.

================

Oh also - there is the wild card here, the possibility that they will assess sales and release this on iPad like they've done for every other EE. Which would be awesome and an insta-buy for me. Because as you and I both know, playing games designed for keyboard & mouse on an iOS interface is the way they were REALLY intended to be experienced!
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November 22nd, 2017, 21:26
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
In the most simplistic terms I would say 'yes'. But there are multiple angles - my resources are greater than many, allowing my assessment of 'value proposition' to be warped compared to a lot of people. I also like to replay games more than many people, which again changes the balance sheet. But the whole 'play on Mac' is a very specific use case in which I think that the value is fairly easy to demonstrate if this was just about Windows well, I was fine playing NWN Diamond as it exists now just a couple of months ago.

================

Oh also - there is the wild card here, the possibility that they will assess sales and release this on iPad like they've done for every other EE. Which would be awesome and an insta-buy for me. Because as you and I both know, playing games designed for keyboard & mouse on an iOS interface is the way they were REALLY intended to be experienced!
Playing NWN on an iPad would be the ultimate punishment for hipster tablet owners

As for my question, yes - that's it exactly. People look to their own needs and measures - and I guess they should at that.

Well, maybe they shouldn't - but it's hard to blame them when I do it too.

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