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July 24th, 2020, 08:41
A lot of RPG lovers are jaded veterans that have a hard time to feel excited about anything, possibly me included. It's not a thing unique to RPGWatch, it's just the way it is, because RPGs are a special kind of game that usually draws interest from a more intellectual crowd, more critic and harder to please while for example you can make the same FIFA as last year, copy/paste everything save for updating the player names to take into account new acquisitions in each team, and your target audience will be drooling happily and clapping with their ears.

I mean, you just have to see how a Baldur's Gate game is being made, so loved and highly anticipated for 20 years, developed by the most successful RPG makers of this generation, and yet it is getting all kinds of flak and skepticism.

The fact that Obisidian can't hype a RPG crowd is their own doing too. Opinions aside, PoE sold badly, Tyranny was meh, and The Outer Worlds was a standard piece of mediocrity where the whole plot was the most asinine cliche "corps are dumb and mean". I mean, really? I think people will be more excited once they can see some actual gameplay, for now, like most here, I'll withhold judgement with low to moderate expectations.
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July 24th, 2020, 09:07
I can't believe the person who posted that complaint about this forum and also named No Mutants Allowed and the other gaming site, didn't also name RPG Codex in his rant…lol. Maybe he considers them much higher and superior to rpgwatch in terms of gaming critique and culture? (sarcasm)
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July 24th, 2020, 09:18
Originally Posted by Arkadia7 View Post
I can't believe the person who posted that complaint about this forum and also named No Mutants Allowed and the other gaming site, didn't also name RPG Codex in his rant…lol. Maybe he considers them much higher and superior to rpgwatch in terms of gaming critique and culture? (sarcasm)
He wouldn't last a day at the Codex.
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July 24th, 2020, 11:26
I am happy that Obsidian is making another RPG. What I saw in trailer looks OK to me. There is not much, so I have high hope that it will be something special.

Would love that Obsidian got the opportunity to make BG3 though. Although we know that it would not be perfect, it would be much better (imho) that what Larian will produce… I lost all interest in BG3 after Larian presented the game, which is unbelievable for me as BG games are what brought me in RPGs back in 98.
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July 24th, 2020, 12:13
I personally don't start criticizing a new RPG Project just because of a few given facts, as long as i know nothing about it's Storyline or general game depth, because i don't mind if it's Isometric or First/Third Person.
To be honest everything that's not hitting the turn based Band Wagon lately is getting plus points from me, even better if it has a enjoyable Storyline and lengthy Gameplay. I'd kill for a new Gothic 1/2 or Morrowind like game!
I'm willing to give Obsidian the benefit of doubt, because i haven't played a single shitty game from them yet, and i did even enjoy the mediocre PoE2 for it's setting.

Btw, the day this site turns into NMA or Codex i'm gone for good!
I still know a couple of guys from the NMA boards from the past and they still haven't changed their attitude at all over time, it's like your reading posts from a Grinch/Ebeneezer Scrooge hybrid after he run out of toilet paper on the sink.
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July 24th, 2020, 13:39
If it has as good as modding as Skyrim, I'm all in. First person open world crpg's are the most expensive to make I thought, so this game better sell well for Obsidian. If they were cheap why don't we have a million Skyrim clones and Elder Scrolls 6?
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July 24th, 2020, 14:05
Obsidian continues to FOOL people and make trash games. This one is another example. They were only able to create edible games, when they were Black Isle. Now they are just helping money laundering, by burning toxic money for the IRS to see their investors are legitimate..
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July 24th, 2020, 15:02
Originally Posted by Hastar View Post
If it has as good as modding as Skyrim, I'm all in. First person open world crpg's are the most expensive to make I thought, so this game better sell well for Obsidian. If they were cheap why don't we have a million Skyrim clones and Elder Scrolls 6?
MS has the money and Obsidian has the means to turn it into a good game. The lore of PoE is already on par with TES. The question is: Is MS willing to drop enough dough to make this a TES competitor or will it remain in mediocrity?
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July 24th, 2020, 15:14
I don't think it's a matter of money, but of talent. I don't think Obsidian can deliver, because they struggle not with the graphics, effects or character animations, but with the writing and design of their characters and story arcs and the implementation of mechanics that feel fun and engaging. And that comes from someone that has invested more hours than it's healthy in both PoE games.

Now if that money is invested into hiring a better creative team, then we're talking, but it takes courage to admit that's what you need in order to improve what you have been offering for the last decade.
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July 24th, 2020, 15:19
Originally Posted by mercy View Post
Obsidian continues to FOOL people and make trash games. This one is another example. They were only able to create edible games, when they were Black Isle. Now they are just helping money laundering, by burning toxic money for the IRS to see their investors are legitimate..
Thats a bit of a Tinfoil Hat statement.
The same level of toxic bashing that NMA users like to put out on to Bethesda for example.

@Nereida

The problem nowadays consists with most creative teams in the RPG sector.
Bioware lost their creativity after ME3, even Obsidian had a lot of staff members changing in the last couple of years.
No writer likes to keep on writing the same Books for Decades, even George R.R. Martin said once he'd like to write something new not related to GoT.
I can't blame them to try to keep their same level of writing and storytelling, but if you can't get a some fresh talents and let them try out new things, you won't get back to your old glory.
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July 24th, 2020, 15:23
Originally Posted by Vindicator View Post
I hope you're not letting your hate of Microsoft taint your view of MS owned studios such as Obsidian, inXile, and Playground Games. I'm not the biggest fan of Microsoft either, but they've been doing better lately. Their newest console is basically just a higher-end 4K gaming PC (nearest equivalent: Ryzen 7 3700X, RTX 2080 Ti, 16GB, 1TB SSD) so porting should be easy.

I suggest waiting until there's a new release you want to try (e.g. Avowed, Fable 4, Wasteland 3, Flight Sim 2020, STALKER 2) and join for only $1 and play a full-length demo for a month before you buy it to own on Steam. You can then cancel and simply rejoin for $5 when there's something new to play.

Most games stay on Game Pass for about a year then get rotated off.
However, MS owned studio games will probably stick around indefinitely.
IMHO XBOX PC Game Pass does have good games. My only "complaint" is that they don't put DLCs into the Pass, at least not for non-Microsoft games (e.g. Metro Exodus, before it was rotated out of service, didn't have its DLCs). But even so it is still a good program, I'm using it to play Gears: Tactics
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July 24th, 2020, 15:49
Originally Posted by Nereida View Post
A lot of RPG lovers are jaded veterans that have a hard time to feel excited about anything, possibly me included. It's not a thing unique to RPGWatch, it's just the way it is, because RPGs are a special kind of game that usually draws interest from a more intellectual crowd, more critic and harder to please while for example you can make the same FIFA as last year, copy/paste everything save for updating the player names to take into account new acquisitions in each team, and your target audience will be drooling happily and clapping with their ears.
I like RPGs as much as anyone here, but this bit sounded exactly like that Rick and Morty copypasta going around the net. A little humility, please.

I agree, though, that there's not nearly enough information to judge the game yet, unless one's absolutely averse to first person. Time will tell.
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July 24th, 2020, 15:58
Originally Posted by mercy View Post
Obsidian continues to FOOL people and make trash games. This one is another example. They were only able to create edible games, when they were Black Isle. Now they are just helping money laundering, by burning toxic money for the IRS to see their investors are legitimate..
Oh I eagerly await your released game….this will be so fun.

There has been zero indications that the company is no longer making good rpgs. Is the only proof is that microsoft bought them? Seems a very easy and weak arguement.

Let me know when they release a game that isn't at the very minimum a good rpg.
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July 24th, 2020, 16:00
Originally Posted by henriquejr View Post
IMHO XBOX PC Game Pass does have good games. My only "complaint" is that they don't put DLCs into the Pass, at least not for non-Microsoft games (e.g. Metro Exodus, before it was rotated out of service, didn't have its DLCs). But even so it is still a good program, I'm using it to play Gears: Tactics
I love game pass….they get good games and they are for both the xbox and pc. Very little draw back to the program other then the no DLC included.
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July 24th, 2020, 16:03
Originally Posted by Gwydden View Post
I like RPGs as much as anyone here, but this bit sounded exactly like that Rick and Morty copypasta going around the net. A little humility, please.
You are putting your human emotions in statistics because for whatever reason it rubs you wrong that RPG players attract a more intellectual crowd in average than sport game players, same as people who make a hobby out of playing chess are an averagely more intellectual crowd than those who make a hobby out of throwing firecrackers at stray dogs. Humility, or lack of thereof, is not a factor here, whether you like it or not.
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July 24th, 2020, 16:11
Originally Posted by Gwydden View Post
I agree, though, that there's not nearly enough information to judge the game yet, unless one's absolutely averse to first person. Time will tell.
I'm not averse to first person, it's just not what I wanted from a new Pillars of Eternity game. But yeah if it looks good I'll pick it up. I've found Obsidian reliable over recent years in terms of games I enjoy.
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July 24th, 2020, 17:48
Originally Posted by revjwh View Post
Where is this crowd of RPG enthusiasts?
I dunno, probably playing KOTC2.
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July 24th, 2020, 17:48
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
He wouldn't last a day at the Codex.
Where do you think they came from?
I mean, that was an obvious trolling failure.

Originally Posted by Nereida View Post
The fact that Obisidian can't hype a RPG crowd is their own doing too. Opinions aside, PoE sold badly, Tyranny was meh, and The Outer Worlds was a standard piece of mediocrity where the whole plot was the most asinine cliche "corps are dumb and mean". I mean, really? I think people will be more excited once they can see some actual gameplay, for now, like most here, I'll withhold judgement with low to moderate expectations.
Why opinions aside? Here's mine - past BlackIsle.

Kotor2 - almost a masterpiece!
NWN2 - bullshit advertised as videogame
Alpha Protocol - checkpoints avoidware
F:NV - yet another almost a masterpiece!
Dungeon Siege 3 - coop bullshit
South Part TSoT - the third almost a masterpiece!
Eternity - the fourth almost a masterpiece!
Skyforge - mmo bullshit

Till this point Obsidian was making either a fanstastic game or something I would want to forget it existed. Nothing in between.
But then something, company politics I guess, shifted:

Pathfinder Adventures - wtf?!
Tyranny - undercooked and underdeveloped
Eternity2 - same as above
The Outer Worlds - a superb base game abused to sell hundreds of upcoming DLCs
Grounded - wtf?!


So forgive me for no happy dance as the trailer shown in this thread can easily be a phonegame or mmo. Or another paradoxoid DLC:The Game.
Wouldn't surprise me. Any of it.
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July 24th, 2020, 18:03
Originally Posted by joxer View Post
The Outer Worlds - a superb base game abused to sell hundreds of upcoming DLCs
Or, you know, two. But don't let reality derail your point.

That's objectively true. On the subjective front, POE2 was imo not undercooked in the least. It was as fully realized as the first game, with a more interesting setting. Some of the individual locations were admittedly underwhelming, especially in the late game, but the overall amount of content in the game was substantial and as far as systems go there were no gaps.
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July 24th, 2020, 19:18
Lots of opinions about this particular game but as someone whose been playing video games for about 40+ years now, I'll just say this… I'm not certain I've ever seen more choice in RPGs than there's been in the last half dozen years or so, so from my perspective I'm just happy that Obsidian is making another RPG to add to the pot.
Last edited by SSIGuy; July 25th, 2020 at 04:30.
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