Scars of War - Creating Game Religions

Corwin

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Gareth, over at his SOW Blog has a great article on creating Religions for a game world. He not only discusses out how he perceives most game developers have missed the whole point, but offers clear ideas on what he believes needs to be considered. Here's a clever outline of what he sees as the main approach/failings of most developers:

You see, when most CRPG writers sit down to write up the religious lore for their game they generally do something like the following.
1. First, cycle through the basic elements or principles of existence, creating funny names and assigning Gods to those elements. Gods of Fire, Light, Nature, Being Mean to People, etc etc
2. Assign two dimensional personalities to these Gods based around their particular element. Fire Gods are quick-tempered, Life Gods are compassionate, Being Mean to People Gods tend to enjoy stealing your lunch money and kicking puppies.
3. Assign each God to a race. Because nothing says 3 dimensional lore quite like assigning a single overarching principle to an entire racial group. But hey, Elves are already scraping the bottom of the creativity barrel, why not go all out and assign a nature deity to them, one that is neutral even! Tradition demands it.
3. Make up some sort of creation myth involving these Gods. Something about how they get together in the beginning of time and create the world then each goes off and creates the initial members of their favored race. Later they probably all squabble with the God of Being Mean to People. And then maybe the other Gods triumph over him and lock him away where he can’t possibly escape, unless the Orcs or Necromancers or whoever find his tomb and conduct a ritual requiring 5 pieces of a magic amulet/crystal/staff. Which get scattered across the world, instead of being safely locked away in the divine wall safe.
4. Done! Creativity redefined! Now you only have to assign spell lists to priests, which is easy ‘cause the Gods are already cleanly divided into neat categories.
Check it out.
More information.
 
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I actually want to see some of the game though....has theer been any videos etc?
 
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He put out a FREE playable pilot demo a few months ago so that he could get feedback on what people did and didn't like. He's using that to make improvements in all areas. I'm sure the demo is still available. I really enjoyed it, though along with many others I found the controls very clunky. This has now been rectified. Check out his site, or wait till he visits here; he's quite regular.
 
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Come to think of it, how many games can you think of that had religion but did not treat it in this kind of clichéd, stupid way? How many fantasy books, even?

Let's see.

* VtM:B. This worked Judeo-Christian lore into the vampire world rather nicely IMO, with Cain and Lilith, and those Bible-thumping vampire hunters.
* Frozen Heart, a mod for the Ambrosia Software game Escape Velocity. In it, you played a Christian interstellar missionary. The plot was really well done, with genuinely complex ethical dilemmas, a highly unusual game protagonist, and all kinds of nice stuff.
* MotB. This had gods with complex motivations and dilemmas; three completely different death gods, with one of them dealing with highly conflicting decisions.
* PS:T. This was interesting IMO in that there *was* no overt "religion" in the fantasy sense, and the religion of the one main character who deeply professed it turned out to be... not what it seemed; instead, everything was suffused with religious and philosophical thinking. This, IMO, sets the standard.
 
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The greatest takes on religion in videogames I know of are Gothic 3 and Final Fantasy X.

After playing G1 and G2 I thought the choice in G3 was natural and I thought I saw it coming, then Xardas came in and put the situation in a completely different angle together with an important message to the real world.

FFX didn't just deal with religion but also all forms of beliefs, how you relate to them, sacrifice, zealotry, doubt, the relationship between hope and shaky beliefs, abusing fear for power, scapegoating, the natural existence of pain and suffering and how it can be diminished through unity. etc. etc.
 
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In two of my short stories I just greated two deities which differ so much from all cliché that people seemed to have problems to understand them altogether.

In one example, I received the remark (at least I understood it so) that it would be unrealistic for a deity to actually know what the taste and form of a jelly would be.
That was, because the deity in that one story gave herself a form that reminded her of jelly.

I won'r elaborate on that, because I'm sure people would call this story being "cheesy"and boring.
 
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The Ultima series is the best example of religion in games and is probably the reason why the companies making rpgs feel obligated to put religion in their games even if they don't want to put any effort into it.
 
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Gareth certainly does have a point, and I'm looking forward to reading his next article where he discusses the religions he's imagined.

He has an interesting take on religion, one that I have to admit I'm not quite following. I don't see how all religions are faiths, for instance. And it seems to me that the ones that are usually have most of their emphasis on gods, not worshipers.

I'm a big fan of Steven Erikson and his "Malazan Book of the Fallen" series. The gods he's imagined are unique and I think very interesting. I wouldn't be surprised to learn he was an old RPGer, because many of them ascended from lowly mortals.
 
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Gareth certainly does have a point, and I'm looking forward to reading his next article where he discusses the religions he's imagined.

He has an interesting take on religion, one that I have to admit I'm not quite following. I don't see how all religions are faiths, for instance. And it seems to me that the ones that are usually have most of their emphasis on gods, not worshipers.

I'm a big fan of Steven Erikson and his "Malazan Book of the Fallen" series. The gods he's imagined are unique and I think very interesting. I wouldn't be surprised to learn he was an old RPGer, because many of them ascended from lowly mortals.

Sounds like an interesting series thanks for the tip - just looked it up and going to order the first book after reading about it.
 
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He put out a FREE playable pilot demo a few months ago so that he could get feedback on what people did and didn't like. He's using that to make improvements in all areas. I'm sure the demo is still available. I really enjoyed it, though along with many others I found the controls very clunky. This has now been rectified. Check out his site, or wait till he visits here; he's quite regular.

Aren't you confusing it with the Frayed Knights demo by any chance? I might be wrong, but I don't recall ever having seen anything from Scars of Wars except these blogs, while there is a demo of Frayed Knights who was advertised as a "pilot". I remember well that particular demo, since my old PC died while playing it.

I'm a big fan of Steven Erikson and his "Malazan Book of the Fallen" series. The gods he's imagined are unique and I think very interesting. I wouldn't be surprised to learn he was an old RPGer, because many of them ascended from lowly mortals.

Actually, Erikson is a RPGer, and the world of Malazan was the world he gamed with, along with Ian C. Esslemont who also write novels in that same world. No wonder it's such a detailled setting.
 
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Sorry, my bad, I did confuse it with Frayed Knights, I read the 2 blogs one after the other. :blush:
 
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He has an interesting take on religion, one that I have to admit I'm not quite following. I don't see how all religions are faiths, for instance. And it seems to me that the ones that are usually have most of their emphasis on gods, not worshipers.

From the point of an atheïst it makes perfect sense. Worshipers build churches or temples in the name of their gods, they write books and guidelines in the name of their gods, they wage holy wars in the name of their gods. It''s all about worshipers believing their gods instructing them to act in a certain way. Or if you want to be cynical about it: it's all about non-believing religious leaders who use the faith of groups of worshipers to do their bidding. There is no need for a god to really exist to make this mechanism work.
 
What's these deities like?

Creatures - or rather: entities - of their own kind. I didn't even bother explaining where they come from.
They're just there, cannot die, and can assume every form they wish to. And they act rather human-like, with differences, of course, because they aren't humans.
 
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I was going to say corwin...hehehe I usually know when the polots are released and try them:)
 
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The Ultima series is the best example of religion in games and is probably the reason why the companies making rpgs feel obligated to put religion in their games even if they don't want to put any effort into it.
I'd say it just comes naturally with the setting. If you think fantasy, you think Middle Ages (except if you live in Japan, then you think of the future too ;)), and those are generally laced with belief in all kinds of beings or deities.
 
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Creatures - or rather: entities - of their own kind. I didn't even bother explaining where they come from.
They're just there, cannot die, and can assume every form they wish to. And they act rather human-like, with differences, of course, because they aren't humans

I'm struggling to see why you think this is so unusual and non-cliched that it'd stretch the boundaries of people's comprehension. Isn't this kind of... every fantasy deity, in general terms, ever?
 
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From the point of an atheïst it makes perfect sense. Worshipers build churches or temples in the name of their gods, they write books and guidelines in the name of their gods, they wage holy wars in the name of their gods. It''s all about worshipers believing their gods instructing them to act in a certain way. Or if you want to be cynical about it: it's all about non-believing religious leaders who use the faith of groups of worshipers to do their bidding. There is no need for a god to really exist to make this mechanism work.
I would call that Western thinking. To me that describes a Judeo-Christian point of view more than an atheistic one.

Read the Tao Te Ching (Dao De Jing) and then explain how its a faith in god. While you're at it explain how true Buddhism, a religion with many thousands of gods that doesn't accept the actual existance of gods, is a faith in god. Its view of all that is, IMO, superior to yours (no offense intended).

Religions all require a certain amount of faith, of course. But the amounts can be vastly different. Some require not much more than commitment and an expectation. That's not what I would consider a faith. More to the point, it's not what Gareth apparently would either. But he does anyway, and that's where I become confused.
 
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