Thorvalla - Update #2, An Overview

crpgnut said:

I'm not sure what the answer is, to be honest. I know that for the most part, I ignore any kickstarter that requests $1,000,000 unless I've seen recent crpgs from them that I played and enjoyed. So far, only Obsidian matches that criteria. I just can't see investing in these used-to-be's who are jumping on the bandwagon with super vague concepts. So no to Wasteland 2, Shaker, Thorvalla, etc, at least for me. I'd rather attempt to get a Sui Generis instead and I invested in that one. Wasteland 2 had a very strong identity right from the beginning, so it stands out from all these other $1,000,000 projects.

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I can't see how Thorvalla is "super vague" or anything like Shaker. Nor do I understand intentionally ignoring a dev that has actually delivered brilliant games in favour of a combat tech-demo that has no idea about the content.

Hi Gothic, what do you think the need on that page? I can relay to them what people would like to see on there, of course it has to be something they can actualy present. So no demo but what else?

GothicGothicness said:

A pity, that kickstarter page is not anywhere near what is needed to raise that much money IMHO, but that guy made brilliant games for sure.

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I think that Neal Hallford should be in the Thorvalla kickstarter video somewhere, explaining how he worked on Betrayal at Krondor(showing a shot of the Betrayal at Krondor game box)and other games, and that he is a part of the dev team working on Thorvalla with Guido. Also, when the narrator mentioned in the video that Guido was producer of planescape torment, the narrator should say right after that that he was also the face of the nameless one, and show a shot of the box cover of Planescape torment which shows the face of the nameless one(his face). Also in the video, Guido should also talk about some of the things which he's written about in the 3 updates he's done so far.
If I remember right, Hero-U changed their kickstarter video a couple times over the course of a month, wouldn't hurt for Thorvalla to put up a new kickstarter video with these improvements, the sooner the better.

I think they should at least have something more than half done concept art and a game concept. It could have been so easy to make, I guess now it is too late, but they should have made an initial effort to have something to show, it could just be a video concept "demo" a long with some music, or at the very least some a bit more finished concept art. Yes their ideas are sure to be good, but those kind of things have a hard time to attract that many people as needed to make such a pledge and raise a hype and so on.

Hi Gothic, what do you think the need on that page? I can relay to them what people would like to see on there, of course it has to be something they can actualy present. So no demo but what else?

Originally Posted by GothicGothicness
A pity, that kickstarter page is not anywhere near what is needed to raise that much money IMHO, but that guy made brilliant games for sure.

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I know they already said they wouldn't, but the only real, tangible, useful advise anyone can give at this point is can it and try again later. And approach it more carefully next time. Tighter pitch, better set-up day-one press coverage, using of industry contacts, etc.

Henkel wrote in the comments that they had actually reached out to the press before launch, but especially the NA outlets simply didn't cover it.

Yes, they should can it, find a smaller game concept based on Thorvalla which can be made for 400k$, prepare a better campaign and try again. Or really try to get the Krondor license and push for 1M$.

Or the RoA license… that would rock.

(BTW: are you "None", BN?)

The RoA license probably won't work. I assume that they won't give it away unless there is a close cooperation, which is hardly possible while Guido is in the US.
Besides that the RoA license comes with tons of restrictions and rules resulting in a back and forth making the whole thing even more time consuming. That said, the biggest market for RoA is still Germany. But due to different payment methods in Germany the support on Kickstarter itself will be rather small (in comparison).

Brother None said:

Tighter pitch, better set-up day-one press coverage, using of industry contacts, etc.

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I'm p. sure he tried to use his industry contacts as best he could; but it should be kind of hard after spending 10 years away from the PC market. As far as press goes he's said they were mostly utterly uninterested (not surprising considering their niche product).

Sacred_Path said:

I'm p. sure he tried to use his industry contacts as best he could; but it should be kind of hard after spending 10 years away from the PC market. As far as press goes he's said they were mostly utterly uninterested (not surprising considering their niche product).

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And considering the presentation video and the presence of the name in the US.
And I guess it also makes a difference in how "big" the sucess the game already is.

If Thorvalla got 200k in the first two days, a snowball-effect would have set in. With 30k after 4 days, news sites probably don't want to make a news about that "joke".

GhanBuriGhan said:

(BTW: are you "None", BN?)

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Hmmm?

Sacred_Path said:

I'm p. sure he tried to use his industry contacts as best he could; but it should be kind of hard after spending 10 years away from the PC market.

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Yes. Getting coverage isn't easy. Fargo was kind of a forgotten name too, but he made sure to get interviews to get himself back into the public eye. This Kickstarter wasn't as well-prepped. It takes a lot of work and prep. If he doesn't have the necessary contacts anymore, than $1 million is probably an unrealistic amount at this point.

I have no idea how much work he put in, but the results are underwhelming? Did he ask successful Kickstarter people like inXile and Obsidian for feedback, tips and contacts? Did he set up day-1 interviews? Did he promote his teasing in any way other than tweeting about it? It doesn't seem so, but maybe he tried to and was just ignored at every stage.

Kordanor said:

But due to different payment methods in Germany the support on Kickstarter itself will be rather small (in comparison).

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Maybe use indiegogo instead? I guess they did Paypal from day 1 anyway. Though Paypal is kind of a scary gamble for a project so far from funding.

Brother None said:

Hmmm?

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A vocal guy on the Thorvalla comments section. Guess not then.

GhanBuriGhan said:

A vocal guy on the Thorvalla comments section. Guess not then.

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Nope, indeed not. I pledged, but I don't think I've ever commented on a Kickstarter comments segment. Prefer to stick with forums or just mailing devs directly.

Brother None said:

Fargo was kind of a forgotten name too, but he made sure to get interviews to get himself back into the public eye.

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And don't underestimate his excellent timing either.
Even if people aren't tired of kickstarter yet, I'm sure they are at least satisfied with what they expect they will get from all the projects that have already succeeded.

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But one thing I believe this is missing is backers enthusiastic enough to throw huge amounts of money at it. I might be wrong but I assume that the momentum such people cause is necessary for the success of such expensive projects. Those of us who have less interest and less to spare may hesitate until enough people show their trust by pledging thousands, and those that will be interested enough to do that will know about the project even if publicity is nonexistent. (And of course, if a project attracts the attention of big spenders publicity will follow on its own anyway)