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Default Kingmaker - Review and Interview

October 10th, 2018, 10:37
I stopped playing right after chapter 2. I experienced no bugs or lag in chapter 1. Suddently right after chapter 2 lag is everywhere. I changed graphics to low (from high) but nothing.
I decided to wait for all the patches and then i'll continue. The game should go out after 6 months.
It's sad, because i really like this game. Right now i'm back to PoE2 (for my first run) and it's mediocre
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October 10th, 2018, 11:38
Playing it in small doses for few days and didnt yet make it out of first chapter. It seems just yesterday evening I stumbled upon my first serious bug and now I cannot get rid my main character of fatigue. I hope that loading save position before this bug occured will solve the problem. Anyway, so far I enjoy game more then any recent isometric RPGs including PoE2. I dont mind RTwP and I think Owlcat managed its implementation well. But I liked RTwP in old Infinity games as well and I think that is not considered being very high standard. Nevertheless, I would really like to see solid, turn based cRPG. Without epic story about world saving chosen one, with less but well desinged encounters, that would be really nice.
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October 10th, 2018, 12:22
Originally Posted by Couchpotato View Post
Hmm are sales that good though as official numbers are hard to get?

Anyway what I would like is more evil companions to help run my Kingdom, and quest with. Maybe some new content in future expansions also, if that's possible of course.

I would like them to optimize the game code in future patches also.
For a AA game from unknown studio they are pretty good. Game was top 5 selling on Steam before its release and whole week after release. Certainly did better than BT4 and probably better than PoE 2.
And it certainly cost less to make than BT4 or PoE 2.
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October 10th, 2018, 12:56
Originally Posted by Archangel View Post
For a AA game from unknown studio they are pretty good. Game was top 5 selling on Steam before its release and whole week after release. Certainly did better than BT4 and probably better than PoE 2.
And it certainly cost less to make than BT4 or PoE 2.
I miss steamspy

According to steam charts,

All-time peak
Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire - 22,639
Pathfinder: Kingmaker - 22,536
The Bard's Tale IV: Barrows Deep - 2,071

Average playtime
Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire - 30 hours, 52 minutes
Pathfinder: Kingmaker - 21 hours, 58 minutes
The Bard's Tale IV: Barrows Deep - 6 hours, 39 minutes

So Pathfinder: Kingmaker a less than month old game is doing much better than PoE2 which is now more than 6 months old…

Sad state of affairs for BT4…
Last edited by lostforever; October 10th, 2018 at 13:08.
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October 10th, 2018, 13:07
Originally Posted by Archangel View Post
For a AA game from unknown studio they are pretty good. Game was top 5 selling on Steam before its release and whole week after release. Certainly did better than BT4 and probably better than PoE 2.
And it certainly cost less to make than BT4 or PoE 2.
Doesn't that make you guys, uhh, plebs and casuals? I mean Top 5 bestseller, common man, that's a bit going too far.
If you want I can send you some ripped jeans and Bieber albums. ( not mine, of course )
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October 10th, 2018, 13:33
Originally Posted by BoboTheMighty View Post
Doesn't that make you guys, uhh, plebs and casuals? I mean Top 5 bestseller, common man, that's a bit going too far.
If you want I can send you some ripped jeans and Bieber albums. ( not mine, of course )
I'll send you my address BOBO.

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October 10th, 2018, 13:34
Originally Posted by BoboTheMighty View Post
Doesn't that make you guys, uhh, plebs and casuals? I mean Top 5 bestseller, common man, that's a bit going too far.
If you want I can send you some ripped jeans and Bieber albums. ( not mine, of course )
Hey, just because some of the games I enjoyed a lot were super niche (Underrail) it does not mean I only play such games
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October 10th, 2018, 14:23
I enjoy turn based games more but of all the RTwP games I've played I enjoy the combat in Kingmaker the most. It's been buggy and some of the realm building is confusing and poorly implemented but the game is just fun to play. I have 45 hours played and I'm in chapter 2 still.

Class building and character creation-A

Magic items and use for gold-A

Exploration-A

Monsters and villians-A

Story-B

Bugs-D

Realm Building-C+

Need to implement a better way for creating your own mercenaries. 24000 gold if I want to create one at lvl 7 or 8 is stupid. This pisses off about 1/3-1/2 your player base. I would love to create my own party from day 1. I will overlook this because I enjoy most the other parts of the game.
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October 10th, 2018, 16:56
Originally Posted by purpleblob View Post
I actually thinks devs are right and the game is 120 hours on a completionist run. Can you imagine if this is TB? I'd say it will be over 200 hours then with 150 hours of combat.
I'm going to save even *more* time!
Because I'm not going to play it, because it's RTWP.
I don't play RPGs because I want to save time.
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October 10th, 2018, 17:10
Screw Rockpapershotgun. PF is close to being GOTY for me.
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October 10th, 2018, 18:59
Originally Posted by Gwendo View Post
Why make a turn based game into a real time one?
Table-top games use turn-based out of necessity. Turn-based is great, but it doesn't scale well. RTwP is better for larger parties and battles, particularly when you're battling a horde of enemies.
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October 10th, 2018, 19:13
Originally Posted by rjshae View Post
Table-top games use turn-based out of necessity. Turn-based is great, but it doesn't scale well. RTwP is better for larger parties and battles, particularly when you're battling a horde of enemies.
I prefer TB but RTwP can be good too. Dragon Age:Origins is still a favourite of mine and it had RTwP. What made it so good imo, was that you could queue up actions for each character. That meant that I had to pause far less - and as a result, battles felt smoother and went a little quicker, while still being completely under my control.

I'm not certain if any RPGs have had that queuing mechanic since? Playing the first PoE felt like such a grind with constant pausing to micromanage my crew.
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October 10th, 2018, 19:32
I just want to know why other games that need gargantuan knowledge, like certain simulation games, don't get the same knock in reviews because of it. Those games seem to be a joy to learn to play, but when an RPG does it's like a blasphemy because they are supposed to easy to play. I don't get it. I know I'm repeating myself but I think that's a real double standard for some reason, maybe expectations from recent easy RPGs have left reviewers think they don't need any knowledge to play the genre. I'll call it Skyrim Syndrome.
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October 10th, 2018, 19:39
Originally Posted by purpleblob View Post
I've been playing Kingmaker for over 50 hours and I'm still in chapter 3. Mind you, I haven't had chance to explore all the maps so far either. I actually thinks devs are right and the game is 120 hours on a completionist run. Can you imagine if this is TB? I'd say it will be over 200 hours then with 150 hours of combat.
No. It would of course have been balanced very differently if it was TB.

I'm thinking TB works better for games who aren't really as large-scale as this, if you have several smaller scenarios TB is probably the way to go + of course almost no trash mobs etc.
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October 10th, 2018, 19:43
Originally Posted by akarthis View Post
I stopped playing right after chapter 2. I experienced no bugs or lag in chapter 1. Suddently right after chapter 2 lag is everywhere. I changed graphics to low (from high) but nothing.
I decided to wait for all the patches and then i'll continue. The game should go out after 6 months.
It's sad, because i really like this game. Right now i'm back to PoE2 (for my first run) and it's mediocre
I was getting lag and also choppy audio at one point. Once I restarted my computer it went away.
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October 10th, 2018, 21:21
Originally Posted by lostforever View Post
So Pathfinder: Kingmaker a less than month old game is doing much better than PoE2 which is now more than 6 months old.
How do you come to that conclusion?
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October 10th, 2018, 21:26
Originally Posted by rjshae View Post
Table-top games use turn-based out of necessity. Turn-based is great, but it doesn't scale well. RTwP is better for larger parties and battles, particularly when you're battling a horde of enemies.
You're right that it doesn't scale using any of the current systems. Does that mean no one could come up with a system that works at scale?
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October 10th, 2018, 21:26
With respect to the turn based vs. real time debate: I can live with both.

But I think you could do something like Baldurs Gate or Kingmaker in a turn based fashion, without having to turn down the trash encounters / size of battles.

In fact, I do not completely buy the turn-based-is-slower argument. It's often the case in practice, but that's due to poor implementation not due to the potential of the system. If you really invest some time into convenience / quality-of-life features, turn based fights can potentially be even faster than real time.

For instance, many turn based games have the option to deactivate attack and move animations. In that case, a trash mob battle can be over in the time it takes to click two or three times.

What you really loose with turn-based fights is immersion. Real time has the huge advantage of a more smooth and realistic battle.
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October 10th, 2018, 21:33
Originally Posted by TheRealFluent View Post
I just want to know why other games that need gargantuan knowledge, like certain simulation games, don't get the same knock in reviews because of it. Those games seem to be a joy to learn to play, but when an RPG does it's like a blasphemy because they are supposed to easy to play. I don't get it. I know I'm repeating myself but I think that's a real double standard for some reason, maybe expectations from recent easy RPGs have left reviewers think they don't need any knowledge to play the genre. I'll call it Skyrim Syndrome.
That's a good point. With strategy games, there's some very accessible ones, and others that revel in taking weeks to get to grips with. Reviewers just note the difference, but they don't treat the hardcore ones as problematic.
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October 10th, 2018, 21:33
The game most definitely gets some lag as you play on, but I think the longest I've played yet in one sitting was slightly under three hours, and while it was noticeable it didn't stop me from enjoying it.
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