Sounds like a guy who can't separate concepts for the purposes of communication.
Your heart is part of your reason(ing), whether you like it or not. Without feelings there's no sense.
Your emotional bagage is needed to being able to differentiate between good and wrong decisions. What you felt in the past in certain situations is guiding you in the present: shame, guilt, pity, pride, joy, betrayal, etc.
I don't think I've said we have no emotions, so that's your first misconception. I specifically said you should be using your heart as the motivation for your words and actions.
But the heart will betray you, if you rely on it for fairness. Why do you think those who love the most are those who lash out the most?
Have you ever broken up with a loved one? The challenge of being kind and fair in that situation is almost insurmountable.
That's why you should not let your heart rule your mind. Your mind needs to rule if you want to be fair.
If you don't want to be fair, that's another matter - of course.
You can not know anything but yourself. You're the center, you are the key. You can only relate to things, recognize things, that you have experienced yourself. A person that was born blind has a different perception of the world than someone who can see. A person that thinks XX people are worse than cockroaches, won't feel pity when he kills them. And you can only understand the why if you feel the same way.
Feeling, recognition, understanding. You have to turn inwards in order to know the (your) outer world.
I don't know about you, but I don't live inside my own body. I have senses, including sight, sound and smell. I learn things based on experience - and that includes things about the outside world. External stimuli, if you will.
Again, you fail to separate concepts. I'm not saying we should abandon emotion - I'm not saying we should be cold and without empathy.
I'm saying it takes much more to not rely entirely on emotions and to use them as underpining for what you consider cold and rational decision making.
I don't think a thought is cold at all, because - as you say - emotions are part of thinking. They just shouldn't rule.
One primary reason people keep blaming others is, precisely, because of the cold government of the mind: "THEY have done something to me, ergo THEY should correct it, meaning THEY should pay". And then a fight starts.
I can't agree at all. They do this because they're hurt and they can't let go of the feeling. They refuse to think clearly - and they're being irrational. They're letting their minds be ruled by the power of the heart - and that's what I'm talking about as the easy and most destructive path.
Thinking along your "government of the heart": that's not about focussing on others and on other peoples behavior but about focussing on your own feelings, I should think. Facing the inner turmoil - the only way to prevent the inner voice becoming louder and louder BTW. Seeing/admitting that you are hurt - it all comes down to pain (in case of negative feelings of course) and getting that pain acknowledged, preferably by another human being. That will silence the inner voice. And ease the pain.
No, I don't agree. Focusing on your own pain and having it be eased is not hard. It's natural, yes, and it's the easiest choice.
Focusing on the pain of others - and the bigger picture - in the face of your own pain, that's the hard part. That's what takes real strength, and what so many fail to do.
That also includes not saying what people want to hear - or trying not to hurt them. Because that's not necessarily the best way to heal - and it's not necessarily the way to help the most.
So it's much more effective and honest - though a scary thing - to say: "I feel pain, can you understand that, could you help me ease the pain?" Feeling, recognition, understanding, bridges being built, peace getting a chance.
I've never found that so hard, but then again - I'm not full of shame or guilt. I've been raised by loving parents who knew that shame and guilt are wasteful emotions.
So, if I'm in pain - I find it easy to acknowledge and I have no problem sharing it when I need help. But I don't focus on it - and I don't let my pain be the pain of others unless it becomes unbearable.
But I do agree that if you really are in pain so much of the time, you'd do well to understand why - and share it.
In that case, though, I recommend not giving out advice on how to approach life - as it would seem your own way needs work and you've yet to really deal with it.
I'm not saying that's you, it's just that you keep orbiting this idea of being in pain - and that's not what I consider a healthy place to be, emotionally and mentally. You're not, by chance, Aubrielle?
The big problem here is that others do not see that many people react hostile when they are hurt someway or another (flee or fight). Responding to that pain with non-emotional coldness, will only inflame the fire: "He is attacking me with arguments, must be telling me I am wrong, denying me… my right %#$#!"
That is unwise and counter productive.
You must be confused. Because at first you claim that emotions are part of rational thinking - and yet you continue to claim that anything rational is non-emotional and cold.
That seems a profound conflict, don't you?
In any case, being hurt is not something to fear. It's part of life and it's part of learning. What you should fear is living a life based on avoiding pain - because that's a stagnant life and one where people are unable to show you the truth, as you don't want to hear it.
When reaching out to pain, when acknowledging the pain, people will calm down. You don't even have to UNDERSTAND their pain. And instead of being caught in a fight people might even end up doing what you want them to do, so there could be mutual benefits.
Acknowledging the pain does nothing by itself. You have to deal with the core of it, and that - in itself - is painful. The way out of it is the mind, not the heart.
O I agree, in terms of the effort and personal price involved, it (emotional turmoil) takes far, far more to remain calm and rational. Worst of all are those calm and rational people who never seem to crack, who try their utmost, right until the vulcano explodes, and then you get all sorts of shit in your face: all is broken, damage beyond repair. Frankly speaking I'm suspecting those people are acting this calm and rational way merely out of fear to loose all self-control when they loosen up a bit.
I don't think anyone can ever claim not to have cracked. But I still don't think that's an argument against remaining calm. If you're promoting that emotions should always rule as some kind of superior position, then I don't think you know what human beings are like without control. It's not a pretty sight.
Everyone has control and everyone tries to remain calm in a variety of situations - even those who're in constant pain and turmoil.
The point is that if you want to be fair and you want to help people the most, you must remain calm and you must remain rational. That's not the same as having no emotions and being cold. Why would people ever crack if that was the case?
When feeling unfairly treated it can reach out, when being unfair it can be reached - as long as a robotic, inhumane mind is not first in command. When opened up it can lift solitude. Who wants to be alone and in the cold?
And thinking about Damasio: who wants to loose their reason?
I don't know anyone who's robotic or inhumane. I know a few people who seem that way, on the outside, but I also know they're not really like that.
What I'm talking about is to remain calm and rational, and to let go of your own pain as the center of the universe.
To me, there's nothing robotic about that. But it can be a struggle and it can be hard.
Certainly much harder than to lash out and indulge in immediate emotional responses.
I see little in your arguments that makes sense, frankly.
In any case, we're clearly speaking from two very different positions in life - and I don't think we're going to get far going in circles about it.
Certainly, I feel like I'm already repeating myself.
So, I'll agree to disagree. Thank you for the exchange
