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I wouldn't expect much C&C, but otherwise I think it will be a winner.
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KoA: Reckoning - Trailer
- Thread starter Dhruin
- Start date
I wouldn't expect much C&C, but otherwise I think it will be a winner.
I agree. I like realistic loooking settings like Skyrim but I also liked the cartoonish art direction of WoW. I also think I'm the only person on the planet who enjoyed the art direction of Zelda Wind Waker.
Actually, RPGWatch is a great place. Lot's of heated debate but very little trolling and guttersniping. If this place is too rough for you, NEVER go to the codex…
I'm concerned with EA's involvement as well. Mostly concerned with pressure EA is liklely applying as it relates to ship date. EA has never demonstrated that they appreciate the development differences between a RPG and sports game.
I ALWAYS hope for this in every CRPG. Sadly this aspect of gameplay is rarely implemented. But I'm still interested in KoA for the features it does claim to offer.
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Well, they've been playing up the loot aspect. Which, personally, I think is great. Give me tons of awesome and varied loot!
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I am going to quote myself for emphasis as apparently someone missed this sentence:
Of course the game could suck with lame quests, empty filler content and they could be exaggerating everything.
I see no need to be speculate in that regard though hence my somewhat postive approach to the game based on taking what has been said at face value. Of course those folks, and there have been a few of you, that don't like the art style then thats fine … of course if you don't like the style its a turn off to the game overall.
Its just that I have seen posts that seem to be going off a very small amount of exposure to the game and thats what I was addressing. If people want to speculate about whether they are lying or its all PR and hype or just misleading thats fine to; I just don't see any reason to be that pessimistic at this point - certainly not with a new company.
Just a few random quotes from the KOA team that I am, granted, basing some assumptions on:
http://forums.reckoning.amalur.com/showthread.php?1334-Weekly-Community-Q-amp-A-Archive
Anyhow I could go on. There are also numerous previews by other agencies that have confirmed some of this … while others have disputed some of the statements. I am not going to cut and paste all the previews as they are easy enough to track down.
The end result being its hard to say until the game is played. I happened to love DAO which had horrible marketing IMO.
So I remain optomistic while also keeping in mind that the over the top combat and some other statements bring to question how true the other statements are.
Of course the game could suck with lame quests, empty filler content and they could be exaggerating everything.
I see no need to be speculate in that regard though hence my somewhat postive approach to the game based on taking what has been said at face value. Of course those folks, and there have been a few of you, that don't like the art style then thats fine … of course if you don't like the style its a turn off to the game overall.
Its just that I have seen posts that seem to be going off a very small amount of exposure to the game and thats what I was addressing. If people want to speculate about whether they are lying or its all PR and hype or just misleading thats fine to; I just don't see any reason to be that pessimistic at this point - certainly not with a new company.
Just a few random quotes from the KOA team that I am, granted, basing some assumptions on:
http://forums.reckoning.amalur.com/showthread.php?1334-Weekly-Community-Q-amp-A-Archive
Anyhow I could go on. There are also numerous previews by other agencies that have confirmed some of this … while others have disputed some of the statements. I am not going to cut and paste all the previews as they are easy enough to track down.
The end result being its hard to say until the game is played. I happened to love DAO which had horrible marketing IMO.
So I remain optomistic while also keeping in mind that the over the top combat and some other statements bring to question how true the other statements are.
Someone? Next time I´d prefer to be addressed directly, thx
.I haven´t missed anything. It should be quite obvious that I wasn´t addressing it as your opinion, but as the devs´ statements.
When devs say there are tons of quests in the game, I have no reason to believe it´s otherwise, but I also have no reason to automatically take it as a good thing, etc.
Precisely.
I do, probably because I usually don´t take devs´ statements at face value.
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CountChocula
Keeper of the Watch
Are there any "pure" RPGs released anymore other than by indie devs?
My understanding is that excluding Arena and Daggerfall, all the games in such hallowed franchises asTES, Gothic and dragon age, etc., are also considered "Action RPGs" - is this not the case?
Nerevarine
Keeper of the Watch
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I guess I'll join the "cautiously optimistic" group, as it appears to have quite a few promising elements. I enjoy action-based combat if it has at least some form of a cerebral side and/or player involvement - meaning that the player can't just win by mashing the attack button Diablo or God of War style (yes, I realize that GoW is one of the influences on combat, but the videos I've seen make it seem like there is more depth than that particular game, and without heavy-handed level-scaling, I imagine some fights will require a bit of strategy and timing). It's a bit too action-y/cartoony/"unrealistic" for my tastes, but at the same time it looks like it might still be enjoyable.
Character-building looks like it has an appropriate amount of depth and flexibility, which is great for a game of this nature. I don't agree with the ability to respec with no penalty or become a "jack of all trades," but this is entirely optional and can easily be avoided.
The few side-quests I've seen in previews actually look fairly interesting in terms of throwing little twists and unexpected events at the player, which is reminiscent of Divinity 2; if this is approach is consistent throughout the game, then I imagine side-questing will be highly enjoyable. At this point it's impossible to tell if the final game will have too many of these non-generic side-quests, but it's encouraging nonetheless to see that the developers are at least aware of how important it is to not simply throw hundreds of mindless fetch quests at the player and call it a day.
What I'm mostly worried about is that the developers seem half-way obsessed with making a game that will please everybody. Simply put, this never works. They can take a page from Skyrim in this regard, which applied a "Field of Dreams" philosophy: "If you build (a great RPG), they will come." Skyrim, The Witcher 2, and Deus Ex: HR proved this year that you won't scare everyone away if you make a game with a fairly high level of complexity, consequences, and challenge. If the game is good enough (and is backed with decent marketing), a high number of people will play it. It's too soon to fairly judge which approach KoA has taken, but I'm a little concerned with how they come across as a bit too "crowd-pleasing."
Another concern I have is the QTE's; I find this an incredibly shallow gameplay mechanic that appears to finally be outdated, yet appears in this RPG anyway. I can deal with optional or minimal QTE's, but KoA appears to have made these mandatory judging from the gameplay videos that have been released. Ah, there's nothing more immersive than mashing a button as fast as you can until something awesome happens…
edit: A later post mentions that QTE's are indeed optional. Whew!
I'm mostly fine with the art direction/presentation, though I wish they would tone things down a little bit (such as the over-sized weapons, shields that appear out of nowhere because it apparently "doesn't look cool" to actually have them equipped, over-the-top finishing moves, etc.). Although I will always have a very strong preference for a more realistic approach, I can keep an open-mind to other styles so long as it's not too ridiculous. KoA is walking a thin line, but I don't find it a huge turn-off, and not every game has to fall exactly in line with my personal preferences to be enjoyable. I do wish there was less flash though…it's almost as if the devs feel that they have to create a spectacle every chance they can in order to keep players interested, and this concerns me in terms of how this will affect the rest of the game's design.
I don't think I'll be able to tell simply from researching different previews/reviews whether I will like this game or not, as it seems that for every aspect that impresses me, there is an equally concerning element that gives me reason to doubt the game's direction. "Fable on steroids" is the lasting impression I have of this game right now, and this isn't necessarily a bad thing; I enjoyed the first two Fables for what they were, and KoA certainly looks like a much bigger, meatier Fable.
Character-building looks like it has an appropriate amount of depth and flexibility, which is great for a game of this nature. I don't agree with the ability to respec with no penalty or become a "jack of all trades," but this is entirely optional and can easily be avoided.
The few side-quests I've seen in previews actually look fairly interesting in terms of throwing little twists and unexpected events at the player, which is reminiscent of Divinity 2; if this is approach is consistent throughout the game, then I imagine side-questing will be highly enjoyable. At this point it's impossible to tell if the final game will have too many of these non-generic side-quests, but it's encouraging nonetheless to see that the developers are at least aware of how important it is to not simply throw hundreds of mindless fetch quests at the player and call it a day.
What I'm mostly worried about is that the developers seem half-way obsessed with making a game that will please everybody. Simply put, this never works. They can take a page from Skyrim in this regard, which applied a "Field of Dreams" philosophy: "If you build (a great RPG), they will come." Skyrim, The Witcher 2, and Deus Ex: HR proved this year that you won't scare everyone away if you make a game with a fairly high level of complexity, consequences, and challenge. If the game is good enough (and is backed with decent marketing), a high number of people will play it. It's too soon to fairly judge which approach KoA has taken, but I'm a little concerned with how they come across as a bit too "crowd-pleasing."
Another concern I have is the QTE's; I find this an incredibly shallow gameplay mechanic that appears to finally be outdated, yet appears in this RPG anyway. I can deal with optional or minimal QTE's, but KoA appears to have made these mandatory judging from the gameplay videos that have been released. Ah, there's nothing more immersive than mashing a button as fast as you can until something awesome happens…
edit: A later post mentions that QTE's are indeed optional. Whew!
I'm mostly fine with the art direction/presentation, though I wish they would tone things down a little bit (such as the over-sized weapons, shields that appear out of nowhere because it apparently "doesn't look cool" to actually have them equipped, over-the-top finishing moves, etc.). Although I will always have a very strong preference for a more realistic approach, I can keep an open-mind to other styles so long as it's not too ridiculous. KoA is walking a thin line, but I don't find it a huge turn-off, and not every game has to fall exactly in line with my personal preferences to be enjoyable. I do wish there was less flash though…it's almost as if the devs feel that they have to create a spectacle every chance they can in order to keep players interested, and this concerns me in terms of how this will affect the rest of the game's design.
I don't think I'll be able to tell simply from researching different previews/reviews whether I will like this game or not, as it seems that for every aspect that impresses me, there is an equally concerning element that gives me reason to doubt the game's direction. "Fable on steroids" is the lasting impression I have of this game right now, and this isn't necessarily a bad thing; I enjoyed the first two Fables for what they were, and KoA certainly looks like a much bigger, meatier Fable.
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First off. what is this C&C that people keeps referring to? Command and Conquer???? Please explain to this long time gamer who now feels like a nube.
Secondly, the cartoon art style does not bother me in the least. I loved Venetica and hope they do a sequel. But all the flash associated with the combat moves has me concerned.
And finally, this game has QTEs?????? At first I was surprised but then I recalled a while back when they were in the initial stages of developing this game, they were talking about making an RPG that had Tekken/ Mortal Combat tendencies. So while the evolution to QTEs seems like a reasonable result, I am now firmly in the wait and see mode
Secondly, the cartoon art style does not bother me in the least. I loved Venetica and hope they do a sequel. But all the flash associated with the combat moves has me concerned.
And finally, this game has QTEs?????? At first I was surprised but then I recalled a while back when they were in the initial stages of developing this game, they were talking about making an RPG that had Tekken/ Mortal Combat tendencies. So while the evolution to QTEs seems like a reasonable result, I am now firmly in the wait and see mode
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The QTEs are used for one specific (optional) purpose, and only come into play when you want them to. Here's the low-down as I understand it.
When you kill beings, you gain fate energy. The story behind this fate energy is that since you are outside the bounds of fate, killing something means they have died when they weren't supposed to, and that causes some dangling threads of fate that you are able to absorb.
When you have collected enough fate energy (ie, a bar is filled in the UI), you can go into a powerful Reckoning mode that slows time and increases your attack power. While in this mode, you don't kill things, but rather render them helpless, at which point you can initiate a fate-shift kill. It's during these fate-shift kills that the QTE is activated, and mashing a single button will grant you an xp bonus that counts to 25%, then 50%, then 75%, etc, before the move is finally finished. So that's ALL that a QTE provides, is an xp bonus. So it's completely optional. Either you can simply never go into Reckoning mode, or if you do, you can simply initiate the fate-shift kill and then ignore the QTE and just watch the cool animation.
Personally, I plan to do the latter. My biggest concern with big open-world, non-linear games like this is that my completionist nature means I'll likely hit the level cap prematurely, so the last thing I want is bonus xp. I plan to do at least one fate-shift kill against every type of creature, just so I can see the neato effects (it's a unique attack for each creature type), but otherwise I plan to not worry about this aspect of the gameplay if I can help it…
When you kill beings, you gain fate energy. The story behind this fate energy is that since you are outside the bounds of fate, killing something means they have died when they weren't supposed to, and that causes some dangling threads of fate that you are able to absorb.
When you have collected enough fate energy (ie, a bar is filled in the UI), you can go into a powerful Reckoning mode that slows time and increases your attack power. While in this mode, you don't kill things, but rather render them helpless, at which point you can initiate a fate-shift kill. It's during these fate-shift kills that the QTE is activated, and mashing a single button will grant you an xp bonus that counts to 25%, then 50%, then 75%, etc, before the move is finally finished. So that's ALL that a QTE provides, is an xp bonus. So it's completely optional. Either you can simply never go into Reckoning mode, or if you do, you can simply initiate the fate-shift kill and then ignore the QTE and just watch the cool animation.
Personally, I plan to do the latter. My biggest concern with big open-world, non-linear games like this is that my completionist nature means I'll likely hit the level cap prematurely, so the last thing I want is bonus xp. I plan to do at least one fate-shift kill against every type of creature, just so I can see the neato effects (it's a unique attack for each creature type), but otherwise I plan to not worry about this aspect of the gameplay if I can help it…
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SpoonFULL
SasqWatch
Thank you for the detailed explanation. May I ask where did you read all this description from? I would like to read more about this myself.
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I think it probably has the most potential from what I have seen so far. If it lives up to what they want it is the next big rpg after skyrim...I hope I get a fraction of the time I got out of skyrim.
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Okay now that the QTE thing was explained, the game has been bumbed up a bit as far as anticipation. Still in a wait and see mode but the QTE thing had placed the game in maybe buy it when it gets cheap mode.
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This is what I've gathered from watching virtually every gameplay video that's been put out since the first one at last year's PAX East (well, at least up to a few weeks ago, when they started allowing dozens of web journalists some hands-on time and they all look pretty much the same now). The QTE has always only come into play to give an xp bonus on a fate-shift kill. It's possible it shows up in other places, but I vaguely remember an interview where a dev confirmed that the QTEs were optional (I had no luck finding this in a search, as there are now so many previews and interviews).
Disclaimer: I'm pretty much in fanboi mode about this game. I'm looking more forward to this than I have for a game in a really, really long time. I've been playing CRPG's for over 25 years now, and consider myself pretty hardcore, but I was also a pretty damn good Street Fighter II player at the local 7-Eleven back in high school, so I guess this concept of quality, well-executed action combat in a large and deep RPG just pushes all my buttons.
YMMV, of course. I can easily see why some people will be turned off by some of what they're showing, and that's fine, but I try to at least keep folks informed of the factual info about this game...
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Ball_Breaker
Sentinel
Every time I see a trailer of KOA:R, I still think that this could what Fable has never been...
From what I can see I'd enjoy the combat, the art direction, the lore; what I wouldn't like to see in this game is:
- Fast travel: I've much preferred a carriage system, with limited fast travel between buildings of the same faction for example (e.g. Morrowind);
- 300 quests: I really hope that not all will be fed ex, killing or saving people; I can stand them, but not too much. But anyway, let's wait and see if at least they'll be entertaining.
- Dungeons design: I know, there won't be any sunken dungeon (too bad), but I really like to see different entrances, multiple levels, LOTS of secrets to justify points invested in the Find Hidden ability (or what is called).
- Loot: okay, I can stand with a loot Diablo-like system as long as I'll find the gameplay enjoying, but apart of equip, I really hope to not be overwhelmed by ingredients and other crafting stuff; just let me find few but significant crafting materials, especially in the end game.
- Crafting: very pleased of it if they remember to put things like smelting unused armors, combining weaker potions/poisons to make stronger ones, and overall I'd like to see more "sinergy" between professions (e.g. maybe I can craft my own arrows with smithing, then I can choose to imbue them with poison or elemental magic).
From what I can see I'd enjoy the combat, the art direction, the lore; what I wouldn't like to see in this game is:
- Fast travel: I've much preferred a carriage system, with limited fast travel between buildings of the same faction for example (e.g. Morrowind);
- 300 quests: I really hope that not all will be fed ex, killing or saving people; I can stand them, but not too much. But anyway, let's wait and see if at least they'll be entertaining.
- Dungeons design: I know, there won't be any sunken dungeon (too bad), but I really like to see different entrances, multiple levels, LOTS of secrets to justify points invested in the Find Hidden ability (or what is called).
- Loot: okay, I can stand with a loot Diablo-like system as long as I'll find the gameplay enjoying, but apart of equip, I really hope to not be overwhelmed by ingredients and other crafting stuff; just let me find few but significant crafting materials, especially in the end game.
- Crafting: very pleased of it if they remember to put things like smelting unused armors, combining weaker potions/poisons to make stronger ones, and overall I'd like to see more "sinergy" between professions (e.g. maybe I can craft my own arrows with smithing, then I can choose to imbue them with poison or elemental magic).
D
Deleted User
Guest
The only problem with this game, is that it may be released around the time the DLC comes out for Skyrim. Which means I have incredibly tough decisions to make about which game I will play. Maybe by February the Skyrim fever will have subsided and a new game can be played, at least for a little while.
Thrasher
Wheeee!
Well, it very doubtful I will by this on release. It's seems far from a sure thing.
D
Deleted User
Guest
Oh, this game is a day one purchase for me, for sure, even if I still am enthralled by Skyrim at the time. Reckoning looks great in it's own right, and while I would be foolish to expect another masterpiece like Skyrim, I am definitely expecting something great. I've been following the game closely for awhile now, even before there were gameplay videos out, and I'm convinced it's going to be good. How good though? We'll just have to wait and see.
If you're truly an RPG fan though, why wouldn't a game like Reckoning be an instant purchase for you? There's not enough great RPGs out there to warrant passing on something like Reckoning. Sure we may not all absolutely adore the art direction, or care much for the combat, but like many RPGs before it, the whole will be greater than the sum of it's parts most likely. I just can't see an RPG fan passing on Reckoning, based on what we know so far about it. But I guess to some, the things I consider "minor details", could be big and gamebreaking to somebody else.
If you're truly an RPG fan though, why wouldn't a game like Reckoning be an instant purchase for you? There's not enough great RPGs out there to warrant passing on something like Reckoning. Sure we may not all absolutely adore the art direction, or care much for the combat, but like many RPGs before it, the whole will be greater than the sum of it's parts most likely. I just can't see an RPG fan passing on Reckoning, based on what we know so far about it. But I guess to some, the things I consider "minor details", could be big and gamebreaking to somebody else.
Thrasher
Wheeee!
Because I already have enough excellent games to play, and why would I take a chance on a dev that has never delivered an RPG that I have liked before, much less any other game I have liked? I don't like to waste money on flops...
D
Deleted User
Guest
Fair enough I suppose. I just don't see Reckoning being a flop. There's too much going into it for that to happen (in my opinion). It's like a sure bet that it's going to at least be somewhat fun, and good. When you have Ken Rolston working on it, I mean comon, it's got to at least be somewhat interesting, right? I don't see how a game can epic fail with 300-some odd quests, 6 factions, quests involving multiple choices to get to the ending, a story where you have been raised from the dead (the only person in history to have had that happen), a world in size comparison to Oblivion, over 900 NPCs, a Diablo-style loot system, 120 hand-crafted dungeons, etc. Plus plenty of previewers said the game is fun to play. I just can't see this game being a flop. But if you have other games to play and are still cautious about it, then just wait for some reviews to roll in, and you should be good to go.