Jeff Vogel - Innovation is not the only Path

Silver · March 20, 2018

@GamesIndustry Jeff Vogel shared his thoughts at GDC on how to survive making indie games.

In his 24 years of continuous indie game development, Spiderweb Software's Jeff Vogel has learned a few things. In a talk at the Game Developers Conference Independent Games Summit today, he shared some of those things, with the caveat that they may only apply to him and his career, may not be true forever, and may not even be true now.

"Video games are young," Vogel stressed. "Nobody knows anything. We're still scrambling to figure out, 'How do we design these things? How do we create these things? How do we test these things? How do we sell these things? How do we market these things? How do we add loot boxes to our $100 million project without causing it to blow up on the launch pad?'"

Vogel framed his talk as a walk through his personal career in game development, including the creative genesis of his very first video game project.

"It didn't take me long," Vogel said. "I came up with an idea. I loved these games as a kid, so what I'm going to do is I'm going to go to every single game I liked as a kid, and steal the single best idea from every one. And in my crasftsman way, I'm going to amalgamate them into what I hope is a cohesive and satisfying whole."
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beldurax · March 20, 2018

"I was getting really sick of everyone telling me, 'Your graphics suck. Your graphics suck. Your graphics suck,'" Vogel said. "So I spent some actual money. I hired actual artists and get graphics that are somewhere on the same continent as the standard graphics of the time. The result of course, was that every day people told me, 'Your graphics suck. Your graphics suck. Your graphics suck.' That was the last time I ever made the mistake of making an effort."

Need I say more about Spiderweb Games for the past 20 years ? 'Nuff said.

ToddMcF2002 · March 20, 2018

Yes you are really missing the point if you focus on his graphics for the last 20 years.

rjshae · March 20, 2018

Absolutely. There's nothing wrong with using tried and tried methods. Too many critics focus on innovation when the story should be the main target.

Carnifex · March 20, 2018

Let the silly people keep whining about poor graphics, I'll simply keep buying them and gifting as well. I've never failed to get at least my moneys' worth from a Spiderweb product to date.

Kordanor · March 20, 2018

Just want to point out another quote which somewhat gives a counterweight to the sentence quoted as headline:

'Oh yeah, you always have to be growing as a human, man. And have you ever looked at your hands?' No. You have to be growing as an artist, and this is hard-nosed, practical advice," he said. "Because for the most part, we're toy makers. We sell amusements. We sell things that tickle people's brains. We sell surprise. And complacency and predictability and repetition are the death of that. If you want to write a sequel, great. But your sequel better do something new. And it better introduce that new thing early. Because if people go, 'Yeah, I've done all this and I don't need to do all of this,' you're going to start bouncing checks."

mbpopolano24 · March 20, 2018

No kidding. "Hey Jeff, stop being so creative" said absolutely nobody ever.

The guy should be in the Save The Planet Committee, nobody can recycle the same thing better than he does.

rune_74 · March 21, 2018

beldurax said:
"I was getting really sick of everyone telling me, 'Your graphics suck. Your graphics suck. Your graphics suck,'" Vogel said. "So I spent some actual money. I hired actual artists and get graphics that are somewhere on the same continent as the standard graphics of the time. The result of course, was that every day people told me, 'Your graphics suck. Your graphics suck. Your graphics suck.' That was the last time I ever made the mistake of making an effort."

Need I say more about Spiderweb Games for the past 20 years ? 'Nuff said.

So...he copied current graphics and found that he was lacking behind the bell curve when he finally released so he said, screw it, why bother?

I mean doesn't he know that you can still be somewhat modern without being the next graphics beast?

I call BS on his comments...he literally rehashed all his games because he was scared to try something that may not generate sales.

rune_74 · March 21, 2018

rjshae said:
Absolutely. There's nothing wrong with using tried and tried methods. Too many critics focus on innovation when the story should be the main target.

So, taking the same story and telling it at least 3 times for each game is the way to go?

rjshae · March 21, 2018

rune_74 said:
So, taking the same story and telling it at least 3 times for each game is the way to go?

What do you feed a straw man argument? Manure, of course. A steaming pile of poo. Here you go...

joxer · March 21, 2018

Silver said:
Jeff Vogel - Innovation is not the only Path

So thanks to his "wisdom" phonegames shovelware can't stop multiplying.
Good to know who ruined gaming.

Kordanor · March 21, 2018

You mean he's the industry leader everyone is following?

txa1265 · March 21, 2018

Wow ... what a harsh bunch ... personally I have thoroughly enjoyed his update/rewrites of the Avernum games, really liked Avadon series ... and look forward to whatever he has coming next.

BoboTheMighty · March 21, 2018

This is pure gold. His interviews are worth more than games he makes.

Arkadia7 · March 21, 2018

I guess as long as there are enough people to keep buying his endless retreads, then he can keep pumping them out. It's like a band that was a one hit wonder and keeps doing tours every year because some people want to hear that one song, lol. Over and over and over and over... :biggrin:

rune_74 · March 21, 2018

rjshae said:
What do you feed a straw man argument? Manure, of course. A steaming pile of poo. Here you go…

I don't think you know what that means.

Vindicator · March 21, 2018

Yes, his graphics do suck, but so do the early Ultimas and that doesn't stop me from replaying them every decade or so.
However, I can't imagine anyone under 30 playing Ultima IV and enjoying it. At least Jeff makes an effort to update his greatest hits every few years with minor graphic and interface upgrades. While I do repurchase them, I doubt he's really growing his audience.

ToddMcF2002 · March 21, 2018

txa1265 said:
Wow … what a harsh bunch … personally I have thoroughly enjoyed his update/rewrites of the Avernum games, really liked Avadon series … and look forward to whatever he has coming next.

Everything seems to be called trash here these days. This place is has changed alot and not for the better. Anyway I'm gearing up to start Avadon 2. I really liked the first one.

Pongo · March 21, 2018

I haven't played the Avadon series yet but I thought the three Avernum games were great. If he does a Kickstarter I'm chucking money at it.

SirJames · March 21, 2018

Yeah, I thought his graphics, even in Exile 3, were pretty good. Not even CGA or EGA or some legitimately bad colour palate! Kids these days are so spoiled!

Jeff Vogel - Innovation is not the only Path

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