Top 10 CRPGs of all time

Pretty sure I replied to this before, but my totally subjective favourites would be:

Gothic 1, Gothic 3 (I've actually replayed it far more times than the other Gothics), Kotor 2, Baldurs Gate, Baldurs Gate 2, Alpha Protocol, Fallout: New Vegas, Morrowind, Pool of Radiance, and Arcanum.

10 - Lands of Lore 1
09 - Baldur's Gate 1
08 - Wizardry 1
07 - Arx Fatalis
06 - Divinity: Original Sin
05 - M&M 7
04 - Divine Divinity
03 - Witcher 3
02 - Gothic 2 NotR
01 - Ultima Series, Particularly 3, 4, 5, 6 & 7

1. Easiest…Witcher III + expansions. As a whole, it puts many game series to shame…incredibly detailed and organic world, story, emotionally engaging, side quests, ambiance, characters, visuals, sounds, music, art, Gwent, plus good c&c, lore, game play, replay value, char building, exploration, and so on. Incredible amount of quality content as a whole…not without flaws, but as a whole package, Imo nothing quite on the same level.

After this:

Baldur's Gate trilogy ( real sense of protagonist journey from beginning to end, though expansion was a bit lack luster)
New Vegas ( best rpg mechanics in an open world),
Arcanum ( best char building, good story, great take on fantasy setting)
Kotor II ( even with all it's issues, really interesting take on SW)
Alpha Protocol ( like that cheesy B-hollywood movie you adore, takes a few replays to really appreciate it)
Mask of Betrayer ( one of most interesting stories in any rpg, actually compelling "evil" route)
NWN modules( Dance with Rogues in particular)
FF VIII( best damn love story in an rpg)
Morrowind ( best lore in any rpg).

Honorable mentions: Gothic II (rated it higher previously, but Imo didn't age that well), Fallout I/II/Torment( good worldbuilding and writing), Deus Ex, Witcher I/II, Mass Effect I/II, Diablo II, Bloodlines, NWN II( really goes all over the place with quality, bit bloated, but still very much enjoyable).

Well I like what I like:

1. Divine Divinity
2. Dragon Age: Origins
3. KotOR 2
4. Fallout 3
5. Baldur's Gate 1&2
6. Pillars of Eternity
7. Neverwinter Nights 2
8. Temple of Elemental Evil
9. Drakensang
10. Oblivion

rjshae said:

Well I like what I like:

1. Divine Divinity
2. Dragon Age: Origins
3. KotOR 2
4. Fallout 3
5. Baldur's Gate 1&2
6. Pillars of Eternity
7. Neverwinter Nights 2
8. Temple of Elemental Evil
9. Drakensang
10. Oblivion

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That's an interesting list!
No Morrowind or Skyrim, but Oblivion. No Fallout 1/2 or even New Vegas, but Fallout 3. DAO rated above BG. I like your #1 spot though.

Lots of chuckles in this thread ... I despise Top n lists ... <sigh>

wiretripped said:

That's an interesting list!
No Morrowind or Skyrim, but Oblivion. No Fallout 1/2 or even New Vegas, but Fallout 3. DAO rated above BG. I like your #1 spot though.

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Maybe in general people who consider themselves hardcore Fallout fans prefer New Vegas, but Fallout 3 was in fact a more acclaimed game. And though Oblivion is criticized by fans of both Morrowind and Skyrim, it does in fact have its own fanabse, and was also a very critically acclaimed game on its release. That doesn't mean these games are for everyone, but they certainly are not weird choices in my opinion.

SMcM said:

Maybe in general people who consider themselves hardcore Fallout fans prefer New Vegas, but Fallout 3 was in fact a more acclaimed game. And though Oblivion is criticized by fans of both Morrowind and Skyrim, it does in fact have its own fanabse, and was also a very critically acclaimed game on its release. That doesn't mean these games are for everyone, but they certainly are not weird choices in my opinion.

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I never said his choices were "weird", I said they were "interesting".
They seem to deviate from the more common preferences of the "average" Watcher. Or that's my impression, at least.

I'm playing KotOR2 currently. It is pretty good still but jeez, it's been a long time since Bioware's hyper-aggressive-party-AI burned me. Let's just say the Spirit of Christmas was not present when my melee guy went darting off to the next spawn point at the "end" of a hard fought battle. NeverWinter and Baulder's Gate can do that, too, but it's easier to toggle off the AI and rope them back in in those games.

P.S. ALL Watchers are above average. Even when you just compare with other Watchers!

CRPGs means no JRPGs, right?

In no particular order:

1) Gothic 1-2
For the most immersive world there is, the only flaw is that it's impossible to not be a guy.

2) Baldur's Gate 1-2 with expansions
For the greatest combat there is. I think I liked BG1 better, but both are amazing.

3) The Witcher 1-2
For storytelling that shines. Otherwise, not a fan of Geralt and harems or TW3 (horrible story).

4) Deux Ex + Deus Ex: Invisible War (if they're considered CRPGs)
They were special and unique. Conspiracies, being lied to, unexpected twists. For creative game design, too. My character once died because he smoked at low health.

5) Dragon Age, all three
For best characters. Not a fan of battle mechanics in DA2 and Inquisition.

6) Divine Divinity 2: Ego Draconis
I can't even put my finger on it, but this game has a very special place in my heart. I could never understand why everyone hates it.

7) Neverwinter Nights 1-2 with all expansions for 1
For great combat. NWN OC was the game that taught me D&D combat, I played it with a wizard without a companion and without summons on Nightmare (but there was one moment when I HAD to use a summon). What a way to learn! The expansions were great. And NWN 2 was my second RPG so I have fond memories of it even if I know it's nothing to write home about.

8) Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines
For best locations. The house with walls all in blood and mad dogs and a tzimiche (sp?); the Ocean Mansion; the Hospital. No other RPG did such locations.

9) Jade Empire
For being the only RPG with the martial arts.

10) ?
Reserved for some RPG I haven't played yet. (That doesn't mean I haven't played any other RPGs except those above, the others I've played just don't deserve to be TOP10)

Witcher 3 bad story!?

I really hear the Jade Empire comment. The fighting game genre is basically dead with respect to originality. All they seem to do now is add more sex and/or gore, up the polygon count, and try to add a new fighter that isn't too similar to the other 30+ fighters they already have. We've got tons of shooter/RPG hybrids, strategy/RPG hybrids, puzzle/RPG hybrids, dating game/RPG hybrids, but extremely few fighting/RPG hybrids. Pull the deep mechanics of fighting games out and stick'm in an RPG!

Who hates Divine Divinity 2?? I wouldn't put it on my top 10 but it was fun!

Zloth said:

Witcher 3 bad story!?

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Beware, typically TW3 fans tend to agree with me after I explain my opinion. What TW3 does good is TES-like exploration and simulation of a witcher life. It has nice side stories. What it does bad is main story. For the major part of the game the main story is "Find Ciri". And steps we take for that are really boring. Don't tell me you enjoyed exploring that underground structure with Keira Metz, this was one of the most boring main story quests I've ever done.

So, for the large part of the game we go somewhere to look for Ciri, learn that she isn't there, then rinse and repeat. Then we finally find her and she saves the world. Nice main story there, so creative, so many unexpected twists! ((

Compare to TW1. I will always remember Chapter 2 as a genuine detective chapter fortunate enough to creep into an RPG. The story in TW1 wasn't a continuous overarching kind, it was more a set of stories. TW2's story was continuous and very well done.

And I can't help but comment that the game turns Ciri into Mary-Sue and employs the 'save the world' trope, which is horrendous. I could spoil the books for you, but I'll just say here that the books thrived on shattering tropes. If you aren't afraid of spoilers, here:

The fighting game genre is basically dead with respect to originality.

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Yakuza is another good fighting game. It's not an RPG, but a heavily plot-driven adventure\fighting mix.

Who hates Divine Divinity 2?? I wouldn't put it on my top 10 but it was fun!

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Whenever I heard it being mentioned, people always sounded severely disappointed with it, comparing it to previous games as a failure. I didn't play the previous games, because I thought they were Diablo clones, so I don't know if they're right or wrong. On its own it was a real nice game, the roaming reminded me strongly of Gothic\Risen, and it was great to be a dragon and have a stronghold and hire people. Maybe it was no ageless masterpiece, but still a good game.

Elel said:

Whenever I heard it being mentioned, people always sounded severely disappointed with it, comparing it to previous games as a failure. I didn't play the previous games, because I thought they were Diablo clones, so I don't know if they're right or wrong.

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I love all of the Divinity games ... and it is interesting because I was uninformed and assumed that Divine Divinity was just going to be a Diablo clone as well, so I was thrilled with the depth and breadth of the game, along with the humor exemplified by the infamous 'existential skeletons' in the first dungeon ...

Elel said:

Beware, typically TW3 fans tend to agree with me after I explain my opinion. What TW3 does good is TES-like exploration and simulation of a witcher life. It has nice side stories. What it does bad is main story. For the major part of the game the main story is "Find Ciri". And steps we take for that are really boring. Don't tell me you enjoyed exploring that underground structure with Keira Metz, this was one of the most boring main story quests I've ever done.

So, for the large part of the game we go somewhere to look for Ciri, learn that she isn't there, then rinse and repeat. Then we finally find her and she saves the world. Nice main story there, so creative, so many unexpected twists! ((

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Sorry but I have to disagree.
TW3 is totally opposite from TES. Also, I'm unsure if Ciri will save the world in any case.

TheMadGamer said:

10 - Lands of Lore 1
09 - Baldur's Gate 1
08 - Wizardry 1
07 - Arx Fatalis
06 - Divinity: Original Sin
05 - M&M 7
04 - Divine Divinity
03 - Witcher 3
02 - Gothic 2 NotR
01 - Ultima Series, Particularly 3, 4, 5, 6 & 7

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A list that would be very close to mine.

I actually played the demo for Divine Divinity, thought it seemed like a Diablo clone, and skipped it. I liked Divinity 2 much more. I remember thinking "this is the direction Tomb Raider should have gone."

You can always boil a story down to the point where it's boring. The Lord of the Rings: Frodo and friends head off with the Evil Ring. At the end of the first book, most of the friends break off and do a bunch of irrelevant stuff for the rest of the series. Frodo eventually makes it to into Mordor and destroys the ring, just as you knew he would the minute Bilbo left the ring to him.

It's the details and characters that make a story great. Details like what happened to The Baron's wife and children, the story behind a haunted house, and the role of the Witch Hunters in society. Characters like Triss, Yennifer, and Dajkstra. I was holding my breath in that postlude, having no idea what Ciri's fate would be!

P.S. Who is Mary Sue?

There is a broad gap between games I think are great and games I love playing. Oddly I find many 'fun' games not 'good games' and vice versa. I hate to great a 'list' of 10 best crpg but I will name a few games I loved and a few i just didn't get into:
love playing
bg2
iwd2
wiz8
ds
wasteland 2 (director cut)
dks
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and a few I just didn't really enjoy that much
bg1
kotr1
--
and a few inbetween
dd (i really liked this game actually but the graphics got in the way sometimes)
arx fatal (I finsihed it and thought it was pretty neat idea but i have no desire to play again)
witcher series (I liked 1 the best and i'm playing 3 but it never ends)

Thread resurrection time! It's easy to tell what are my top favourite 5 cRPGs but decided to spell it out anyway:

1. BG2: SoA + ToB - This is *my* perfect cRPG, doubt that this will ever change. It just ticks all my boxes.
2. IWD1 + HoW + LotTM + NPC project mod - I am always in search for the "next BG2" and this pretty much is it with NPC project mod. Fantastic game which was missing just NPC interactions.
3. NWN1: The Aielund Saga - Yep, this is another "next BG2". I only wish henchmen system can be modified.
4. Stardew Valley - Never thought I would enjoy a farming game but this game really helps me relax and I love designing a new farm/house interior.
5. The Witcher 3 + HoS + B&W - A little different to my beloved party based cRPG with lots of NPC interactions but there is no doubt this game really sets standard for current generation games. I call this the "next BG2" in that regards Only reason it is 5th and not higher is due to personal preferences like: 1. I prefer playing female protagonist 2. Monster design gives me creeps 3. Can be a little depressing at times.

Honorable mentions (basically games I enjoyed a lot but has flaws to be rated as top x):
-NWN1: HotU - Really enjoyed this one but it only really picks up in the later chapter. Undermountain was blah, Underdark was basically smaller copy version of BG2 Underdark, but I LOVED Cania. Also, I hate henchmen system.
-ME2 - You can laugh all you want, but I was HOOKED in my first playthrough. Found this to be a lot more enjoyable than generally more loved KotOR series. Fantastic interactive movie. Problem is there's absolutely zero replayability. Very short game, pretty sure I finished 95%+ quests during my first playthrough, there was nothing new or interesting to go for replay.
-WoW - Ah, I have so many good memories of this game. I dislike what it has become but up until WotLK, it was a solid MMORPG.
-Morrowind - Fantastic open world game. I enjoy this game a lot but only when I am in a mood. I can play this game for hours and days then suddenly lose interest, and won't come back to it for a long while.
-D:OS - Similar to Morrowind. The only thing that hooks me up in this game is TB combat.

I would not include D:OS on that list; I mean it is a fun game but it has serious problem with lack of a story, bad balance in the mechanics (esp later in the game) et all. Don't take me wrong I liked the game but definitly not top 10. Its weird; I liked D:OS better than wasteland on first place because the mechanics were so much better; but on second play i prefer wasteland because i paid more attention to hidden details in the story.
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And yes i did mention ds in two posts above but i've had time to reflect.

I don't laugh at anyone have Mass Effect one or two on their best games list, both are fine games and do not require the sukorigin platform. Now, if you select a Mass Effect with a numeric value higher than two as a best game, then I'll laugh at you. And I'll pity your poor computer.