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Default Shroud of the Avatar - RPG Codex Review

June 29th, 2018, 18:19
Originally Posted by rune_74 View Post
Are you honestly pushing the dance party weird shit?
Why not just let people have their opinions? No need to push the guy for enjoying the game.
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June 29th, 2018, 19:00
Originally Posted by rune_74 View Post
The problem is the only reason you don't have to spend a lot of money right now is because you have more supply then people. They wanted you to spend money to get things, it didn't work. The whole system was based on this…they are trying hard to peddle stuff now to get people to stay. If the game had taken off you would of course not have seen this. Crafting your own house is also a misconception….go ahead and craft it, you need a lot to place it on.
I agree with you that their system is not well thought out. But you can buy anything that is in the addon store with in game gold form vendors. Everything in the addon store is sold on obsidian crown vendors (so you need obsidian crowns to buy them). And you can buy obsidian crowns from player vendors.

The problem with their business model is that they need a big player base for them to have a financially viable game. And I don't see this happening anytime soon. It's too niche of a game, and too rough around the edges, and too many standard modern game features are missing.

As for lots, you can buy them from player vendors or crown merchants. They are very attainable. There is also a raffle every month if you can get lucky. There are some free housing options that other players offer (especially if you are in a guild). And once you complete the main quest, you are awarded a POT row deed. So everyone can have a house if they want.
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June 29th, 2018, 19:04
Originally Posted by rune_74 View Post
Are you honestly pushing the dance party weird shit?

Lol no, I'm not into that sort of thing (even though it is part of what some people like with the game). But that wasn't what I meant by it being a primarily social game. To get the most out of the game, you need to be in a guild, interact with others, visit the different player owned towns that host multiple events (like pvp events) or ingame quests. And I know the devs are planning on adding more tools to help with player created content.
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June 29th, 2018, 19:11
Just as I thought. What's the point of spending thousands of dollars on a castle or a guild town or a hundreds of dollars on a costume if there's nobody to admire all those riches? Why not go for "we invite you and you invite us" model of mutual adoration society. Brilliant!
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June 29th, 2018, 19:23
Not surprised. If you had listened to Garriot in ANY interview from about 1998 to now he always says he thinks social aspects are "Where it's at". Then with the KS pitch it was almost all MMO online stuff, it was obvious this was going to be a disaster.

Biggest disappointment ever? Not really as I didn't expect much from the kickstarter. Biggest disaster from a legendary game designer? IMO yes.
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June 29th, 2018, 20:23
Has Garriott made a lot of money on this? If he has, then it makes sense. He was in it for cynical financial gain.

But I have a hard time believing that. Why wouldn't he just make a more modest game that is actually good? Was this another case of the libertarian types thinking they are Supermen, and can make some enormous, sprawling game with a bare bones approach?

Was this just a way of scamming investors? I just can't imagine devoting years of my life to something that is such obvious shit.
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June 29th, 2018, 20:28
Originally Posted by Ovenall View Post
Has Garriott made a lot of money on this? If he has, then it makes sense. He was in it for cynical financial gain.

But I have a hard time believing that. Why wouldn't he just make a more modest game that is actually good? Was this another case of the libertarian types thinking they are Supermen, and can make some enormous, sprawling game with a bare bones approach?

Was this just a way of scamming investors? I just can't imagine devoting years of my life to something that is such obvious shit.
I'm pretty sure there is no scamming involved. If the game fails, Garriott will have lost a ton of money. The game has been developed for more than 5 years. The money they have gathered is around 11 million (between kickstarter and pledges) plus the money he personallly put in his company. That is not a lot of money for a game of this scope. I run a business, I know how much employees, rent, fixed expenses,… cost. So no , it is not a money grab. If anything, the biggest loser will be Garriott if the game fails.
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June 29th, 2018, 20:29
I agree with most here that this is for me the only game I regret kickstarting and this includes one the totally failed (its understandable if a no name studio screws up but not so much a legendary game designer). As Saxon1974 said "Biggest disaster from a legendary game designer".

I was fortunate that I learned early in the KS cycle to only back at the minimum level and NEVER back for physical rewards. I almost feel bad for those who backed this game for big bucks.
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June 29th, 2018, 21:01
Originally Posted by Terry View Post
I agree with most here that this is for me the only game I regret kickstarting and this includes one the totally failed (its understandable if a no name studio screws up but not so much a legendary game designer). As Saxon1974 said "Biggest disaster from a legendary game designer".

I was fortunate that I learned early in the KS cycle to only back at the minimum level and NEVER back for physical rewards. I almost feel bad for those who backed this game for big bucks.
I agree with you that the game is not worth putting thousands in it like some people did (and a few have put in tens of thousands!!!!!!). No game is worth that IMO… But that's how the devs decided to fund the game, for better or worse… Again , as I said before, I don't think they have a good financial model for sustainable revenue. We'll see if that works for them in the long run…
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June 29th, 2018, 21:17
Originally Posted by k1000 View Post
I'm pretty sure there is no scamming involved. If the game fails, Garriott will have lost a ton of money. The game has been developed for more than 5 years. The money they have gathered is around 11 million (between kickstarter and pledges) plus the money he personallly put in his company. That is not a lot of money for a game of this scope. I run a business, I know how much employees, rent, fixed expenses,… cost. So no , it is not a money grab. If anything, the biggest loser will be Garriott if the game fails.
Not to mention his reputation which was on the line… I think it is the saddest aspect of this entire mess. Then again he has pretty much fullfilled all his dreams: become a lengendary game desinger, get rich, find a wifey, go to space etc. More I think, it just doesn't seem plausible that he is doing something this niche for money's sake alone.

It is easy to laugh at this project and I've done my share of that, but there are some intresting lore ideas (like virtues) which all seem to be sadly burried under all the technical issues and weak game design. Besides the whole project was doomed when they decided to do both mmo and sp with so limited funds and resources…
Last edited by Dez; June 29th, 2018 at 21:47.
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June 29th, 2018, 21:30
Originally Posted by Darth Tagnan View Post
I like the skill system and the way you can combine skills just as you want. It's the actual combat in itself that I find terrible.



Yeah, I guess I'm just the kind of player who needs to fundamentals to work, before I really want to invest myself into something like that.

The performance is probably my primary issue - as I tend to do combat only as a means of progression.

But thanks for your insight
The performance got quite a bit better in the past 6 months, and every release makes it better. But the game is still rough around the edges. I'd honestly recommend waiting till the end of the year before giving it another try.
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June 29th, 2018, 21:48
Will Portalarium still be in business at the end of the year?
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June 29th, 2018, 21:54
Originally Posted by Stingray View Post
Will Portalarium still be in business at the end of the year?
I think they will, but your guess is as good as mine.
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June 29th, 2018, 22:23
This thing actually earned eleven million in pledges/donations???? Man, that is just a huge crime. For shame, Garriott, all that money and not a worthy game to show for it all. Never again.
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June 30th, 2018, 00:31
We could have gotten 2 or 3 actually good RPG's out of that amount of cash.
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June 30th, 2018, 01:38
Originally Posted by Carnifex View Post
This thing actually earned eleven million in pledges/donations???? Man, that is just a huge crime. For shame, Garriott, all that money and not a worthy game to show for it all. Never again.
Yeah we fell victim to the old snake oil seller technique.
Originally Posted by Stingray View Post
We could have gotten 2 or 3 actually good RPG's out of that amount of cash.
So true but nowadays you need Chris Avellone's name. I've seen many projects fail lately though. Just look at Final Equinox: The Arrival. Asked for a small amount and failed.


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June 30th, 2018, 01:54
which is astonishing considering nothing much happens in the game physics-wise (can I even say nothing at all? I'm not even sure I ever saw basic gravity effects)
Even City of Heroes had physics!
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June 30th, 2018, 02:35
Just read most of that review. Wow that game sounds terrible.

The most interesting part of the whole story is that people are still defending it.
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June 30th, 2018, 03:05
Originally Posted by Darth Tagnan View Post
Why not just let people have their opinions? No need to push the guy for enjoying the game.
Because dance party weird shit is stupid. That’s why.
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June 30th, 2018, 03:50
I once read that Jeff Vogals plan was to steal all the good parts of his favourite RPGS to add to his game. I think if Lord British tried to do this he would have to play a game first.
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