Cyberpunk 2077 - Gamescom Gameplay Video

BoboTheMighty said:

They confirmed it's WIP, but I'm seeing a lot of options: scars, piercings, skin mods, eye mods, surface wiring, etc. Not 100% sure about different body types, we'll see.

How it's integrated reminds me a little bit of Mass Effect.

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The background options ("what brought you to Night City", etc) reminded me of Mass Effect. Hopefully their effects are more interesting/significant than those in that game. In every way, I hope choices you make are more significant than in Mass Effect which I consider more smoke and mirrors than actual choice.

Seems some of dialogue options include hand emotes, this was a nice touch.

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Yes! I love that, and it brings up something that the developers have talked about that we didn't see at all in this demo. They have talked a lot about how the dialogue system responds to and changes based on where in the environment you're focusing your attention. In the demo, they are focused on doing a prescribed set of actions and don't look around much, or even always scroll down through the available dialogue/action options. There's so much potential for that, which I would imagine could and would also sometimes involve non verbal methods of communication.

I finally watched the whole video and… wow… it promises to be a great game. I agree that the game seems to be a bit too focused on action (action-y ???), but at the same I believe there is no better way to do it (I am not complaining here). Both first person and third person views would still result the game being too much action-oriented, and I personally prefer it to be first person. And I'm not even considering a turn-based, isometric view here, because… no!

Darth Tagnan said:

My point was that maybe they would actually like other games for similar reasons if they kept themselves open in those cases as well, because in reality maybe those things aren't as bad as they're made out to be.

One example would be that I think joxer might actually like Prey and get a great experience, if only he could get past his absurdly obsessive dislike of respawns. When those respawns aren't in a game called Witcher 3, that is.

But maybe I'm wrong, who knows

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I think you're talking about a very tiny but outspoken minority, but otherwise I agree with what you're saying. I also don't think it's in anyway unique to TW3.

Darth Tagnan said:

Yeah, just like Silver Coin must be a troll and doesn't just simply dislike what he's seeing, right?

I don't think there's a conspiracy. Just a bunch of entitled whiny gamers who've preconditioned themselves towards dislike, based on something that's largely inside their head.

Then there are more reasonable people who simply don't care for what Bioware is doing.

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I can't recall anyone being as irrational as Silver Coin when it comes to Bioware. Find me a thread where one person posted 10+ times about a Bioware game.

The simple fact is that Bioware has fallen out of favor with a lot of people around here. However, the majority of them just comment that they're no longer as interested in BW titles, or they express regret that BW no longer makes the kind of games they enjoy.

Also, most of the negative comments I've seen were about games that those people have actually played.

There are unreasonble comments from time to time, but that's usually from the same 2 or 3 posters.

Darth Tagnan said:

Well, I guess I'll have to take your word for that

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Or you could take a minute and look for yourself. It's not like the thread is that large. Just a thought.

azarhal said:

I saw a guy on another forum yesterday say: "it's the sequel to TW3, of course I'm hyped".

I'm not sure if the game is going to be what he expect or if he understand that the Cyberpunk IP has nothing to do with The Witcher IP.

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Lol, common' you have to admit that's pretty funny: weren't you saying not long ago, you're expecting "Witcher with guns" here?

This is not unexpected though: lot of devs have a certain type of design/philosophy they focus on ( Bioware, Bethesda, Arkane, etc).
CDPR doesn't seem to fit the mold, even within confines of Witcher they changed things substantially from one game to the next. There was a leak few months before E3 mentioning game in FPP, and practically no one believed it. ( Interestingly it also mentioned wallrunning, and Moon DLC).

JFarrell71 said:

The background options ("what brought you to Night City", etc) reminded me of Mass Effect. Hopefully their effects are more interesting/significant than those in that game. In every way, I hope choices you make are more significant than in Mass Effect which I consider more smoke and mirrors than actual choice.



Yes! I love that, and it brings up something that the developers have talked about that we didn't see at all in this demo. They have talked a lot about how the dialogue system responds to and changes based on where in the environment you're focusing your attention. In the demo, they are focused on doing a prescribed set of actions and don't look around much, or even always scroll down through the available dialogue/action options. There's so much potential for that, which I would imagine could and would also sometimes involve non verbal methods of communication.

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They picked Death of Sibling ( Key Life Event) and Unfinished business ( Reason for coming in Night City) as two lifepath options. And V says something interesting at the end of the demo: "Need to get to know the city, Jack. And not just gun in hand. I'm on a crusade".
It kind of sounds like player dialogue based on your lifepath choice, not sure if tied to main story or not.

BoboTheMighty said:

This is not unexpected though: lot of devs have a certain type of design/philosophy they focus on ( Bioware, Bethesda, Arkane, etc).
CDPR doesn't seem to fit the mold, even within confines of Witcher they changed things substantially from one game to the next. There was a leak few months before E3 mentioning game in FPP, and practically no one believed it. ( Interestingly it also mentioned wallrunning, and Moon DLC).

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Well here's hoping they change the loot system substantially from the one they used in TW3.

JDR13 said:

Well here's hoping they change the loot system substantially from the one they used in TW3.

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You loved it JDR, and no point in trying to deny it.

From what I've seen though it seems more like Fallout + customization through weapon modules.

I just want good weapons and armor to be rare and/or expensive. I don't want to be swapping gear every 30 minutes or every time I advance in level.

JFarrell71 said:

They have talked a lot about how the dialogue system responds to and changes based on where in the environment you're focusing your attention. In the demo, they are focused on doing a prescribed set of actions and don't look around much, or even always scroll down through the available dialogue/action options. There's so much potential for that, which I would imagine could and would also sometimes involve non verbal methods of communication.

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True that, it's a shame they didn't show it here, it seems one of the most interesting features.
They also said there will be different options ( based on skills), but integrated more organically than, like in Fallout.
I've heard also that npcs respond differently/have a different attitude based on your gender: like with Victor/Ripperdoc, who is a lot more friendly to female V ( in this demo) than male counterpart.

JDR13 said:

I just want good weapons and armor to be rare and/or expensive. I don't want to be swapping gear every 30 minutes or every time I advance in level.

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I think that's fine, long as there is enough variety for that approach. Here they have 4 major damage sources, three general types, ( likely) projectile and hitscan, and variety of different weapon types and modules.
So they have a lot more "room" for design than they did in Witcher. Only thing I'm concerned is with smart weapons: in typical FPS, you usually use this for a very limited amount of time, high danger encounter. AI can't really compensate for it.

Jeez this topic moves fast!

sakichop said:

It worked in fear and other shooters. It could be managed by limiting bullet time so you wouldn’t have time to clear an entire room. Have helmets that take 2-3 shots or even robotic enemies that could take more shots. I assume that’s a thing in cyberpunk?

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Yeah, it works great in shooters, but they don't have a skill system to support. In an RPG you need to decide if you want to put points into your pistol skill, your shotgun skill, or some diplomacy skill and play to the style you pick. With that sort of combat system, though, you just practice and get good at the headshots and put all your points into other things. Whether you've got an old pea shooter and no skill or a +10 plasma rifle and your ranged skill maxxed out, the head shots will make them the same.

Though, now that I look at it… maybe they've got a bit of a hybrid going? They do have critical areas to hit sometimes and that clearly has to be done via your twitching. Perhaps the skills will only be used to access more complex weapons while your twitch abilities (and weapon stats) will be used to figure out damage and hit rate?

Regarding realistic PnP combat… ugh. I saw that in Rolemaster and it's criticals. They're fun when attacking but terrible when some friggin' kobold gets lucky and puts an arrow through your windpipe. The only way I saw to get out of that was to limit the criticals to crippling-but-not-too-deadly. (Or just not doing any combat.)

PnP doesn't have the bottomless, full party ressurrection powers of a save game system, though, so I don't think it applies here.

P.S. PC Gamer reports that you will be able to turn off the damage numbers flying around.

P.P.S. I really want to see how other classes work out. The video says there aren't classes but I'm hoping there's various different careers other than "hired muscle." Can you play as a rock star? A reporter? The end made it sound like there was a path into the corporates.

Zloth said:

P.P.S. I really want to see how other classes work out. The video says there aren't classes but I'm hoping there's various different careers other than "hired muscle." Can you play as a rock star? A reporter? The end made it sound like there was a path into the corporates.

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Nothing that specific as a class, but who knows what you'll do in quests. You're hired to do jobs for sure. Whether it's as muscle, necessarily, we'll have to see.

They didn't exactly say there are no classes. They said it's a fluid class system, as in you don't choose a class, you choose from abilities that make up a class. Nothing revolutionary about that, really. Skyrim and other games have done something similar. The three classes are Solo, Tech, and Netrunner. You can blend the skills from one, two or all three in whichever way you prefer.

BoboTheMighty said:

Lol, common' you have to admit that's pretty funny: weren't you saying not long ago, you're expecting "Witcher with guns" here?

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Back at E3, I was saying it, the trailer, looked like GTAV with a cyberpunk paint.

In this thread, I said the itemization seen in the gameplay demo seems inspired by TW3 itemization which isn't the same thing as "Witcher with guns" to me: the gameplay is quite different, as is the tone.

JDR13 said:

I think you're talking about a very tiny but outspoken minority, but otherwise I agree with what you're saying. I also don't think it's in anyway unique to TW3.

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I'm glad we agree about some of it, at least

If you don't see CDPR being a special case here, then so be it.

I can't recall anyone being as irrational as Silver Coin when it comes to Bioware. Find me a thread where one person posted 10+ times about a Bioware game.

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I'm sure I could find plenty of threads with similar spamming by people who're annoyed with whatever game. Not like I'm going to bother, though.

You should see how Drithius responds to Bethesda news

Even if you're not a fan of Bethsoft yourself, you should be able to see that his comments are a little unreasonable.

I'm just pointing out that what you think is a troll could actually be a person who doesn't like what he sees. I think he's making sense in several of his observations - it's just that he's blowing his conclusions way out of proportion.

The simple fact is that Bioware has fallen out of favor with a lot of people around here. However, the majority of them just comment that they're no longer as interested in BW titles, or they express regret that BW no longer makes the kind of games they enjoy.

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I haven't actually counted how many are unreasonable and how many seem informed.

However, it's not like we have to agree. If you don't think people are being unreasonable about Bioware often around here, then so be it.

It's not that Bioware is unique here. Bethsoft and other big companies get similar responses. CDPR are usually exempt, is my point - even though they've massively streamlined their Witcher game from the first one, not least of which would be in the name of console concessions.

It doesn't bother me, though, as I like all the games involved for the most part - I just find it amusing enough to take note of it.

There are unreasonble comments from time to time, but that's usually from the same 2 or 3 posters.

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It's often the same people, yeah - but I wouldn't say it's the minority opinion that Bioware games are essentially not worth playing - around here - even when they're not released yet. To me, it's obvious that several people are not giving them a fair shot at being worth more than that.

If it is the minority opinion, it's not a tiny minority - I'd say.

But, again, it's not like we have to agree.

Or you could take a minute and look for yourself. It's not like the thread is that large. Just a thought.

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I could, but it's not really that important.

I heard on another forum that developers have confirmed the HUD will be highly customizable - and things like the damage numbers will be hidden if you so desire.

I didn't expect anything different, but it's nice to hear it's confirmed.

However, I don't think a bullet-sponge design is necessarily better without the HUD information - and certain things seem to be part of the design. Sort of like playing Witcher 3 without the mini map was a major hassle (IMO) - and I hope they take greater care in providing a playable experience with most of the HUD turned off, given how much they're focusing on immersion.

I'm very curious about the weapon modifications - as that could be a big thing in terms of gameplay. It's one area that could provide a much more meaningful exploration experience if handled with care.

I hope we'll have SOME handplaced loot, at least - so we can get appropriately rewarded for exploring areas at will.

I just want a way to play the game without the handholding - but also without feeling as if I'm playing against the intended design.

It remains to be seen if CDPR have learned something about gameplay which seems to be where they're most challenged - and we know they understand how to tell a story.

That said, the writing doesn't come off as great in that video. In fact, I found it a little weak and derivative. The whole "I'm cleaner than a cunt in a convent" and "I will END you!" shtick was already old at the finish line, I found.

I'm hoping that's a deliberate choice to demonstrate the setting instead of the best they can do, and they have something more subtle and on the level of Witcher 3 later on.

Darth Tagnan said:

I'm glad we agree about some of it, at least

If you don't see CDPR being a special case here, then so be it.

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I don't see it as being a special case because it's not.

It might seem more prominent because of how popular TW3 is, but someone liking something depite the presence of features they dislike isn't an uncommon occurrence.

Darth Tagnan said:

I'm sure I could find plenty of threads with similar spamming by people who're annoyed with whatever game. Not like I'm going to bother, though.

You should see how Drithius responds to Bethesda news

Even if you're not a fan of Bethsoft yourself, you should be able to see that his comments are a little unreasonable.

I'm just pointing out that what you think is a troll could actually be a person who doesn't like what he sees. I think he's making sense in several of his observations - it's just that he's blowing his conclusions way out of proportion.

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There's a difference between someone commenting on something they dislike and someone spamming that many posts over and over in a single thread.

I have no problem with most of the things he said even if he seems confused at times. The troll part comes in when he repeats the same thing that many times in one thread.

Darth Tagnan said:

It's not that Bioware is unique here. Bethsoft and other big companies get similar responses. CDPR are usually exempt, is my point - even though they've massively streamlined their Witcher game from the first one, not least of which would be in the name of console concessions.

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CDPR hasn't streamlined their games nearly as much as some other developers because they were never what most people would consider very hardcore or traditional RPGs to begin with.

They've also only released a total of 3 games so far. That's probably why some people are more likely to point out streamlining from a developer who's been making RPGs for 20 years. I guarantee the same thing will happen to CDPR more as time passes and they have more games under their belt.

JDR13 said:

I don't see it as being a special case because it's not.

It might seem more prominent because of how popular TW3 is, but someone liking something depite the presence of features they dislike isn't an uncommon occurrence.

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Oh, please. Let's not get juvenile with "it's so because I said so".

You know better than that.

Let's just agree to disagree.

There's a difference between someone commenting on something they dislike and someone spamming that many posts over and over in a single thread.

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Sure, one difference is that you and others are constantly responding to his posts - which is why he's dragging it out.

That's not entirely his fault, now is it.

I have no problem with most of the things he said even if he seems confused at times. The troll part comes in when he repeats the same thing that many times in one thread.

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Again, if people keep getting upset over his opinion - they'll keep giving him the incentive to respond.

It's not rocket science.

I mean, we're spamming the thread for much the same reason. We're exchanging based on your response to my original comments.

We wouldn't be having this exchange if you didn't respond and just let me have my opinion.

Do note that I'm not bothered by it. I'm just pointing out that you're at least as responsible as Silver Coin and myself when threads go off topic.

CDPR hasn't streamlined their games nearly as much as some other developers because they were never what most people would consider very hardcore or traditional RPGs to begin.

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Streamlining doesn't have to happen to a hardcore or traditional game.

But, it's not like we're likely to agree about the streamlining of Witcher games, so let's not bother droning on.

They've also only released a total of 3 games so far. That's probably why some people are more likely to point out streamlining from a developer who's been making RPGs for 20 years. I guarantee the same thing will happen to CDPR more as time passes and they have more games under their belt.

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Yeah, I guess I don't need more than one sufficiently obvious example to point something out.

But I'm fully aware that people are more invested in the changes that's been happening with Bioware and Bethesda.

What I'm saying is that these changes are universal for people aiming wide - and if you're mature and adult about it, you will realise that it's the nature of doing business in the field.

Again, we don't have to agree that people are more prone to notice this about Bethsoft and Bioware.

Just watched the whole video.... amazing! just amazing!

I hope we get great CE edition also.

Darth Tagnan said:

Oh, please. Let's not get juvenile with "it's so because I said so".

You know better than that.

Let's just agree to disagree.

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Huh? I'm just stating an obvious fact. Are you really that oblivious?

You've never liked a game despite not liking all the feature in it?

Darth Tagnan said:

Sure, one difference is that you and others are constantly responding to his posts - which is why he's dragging it out.

That's not entirely his fault, now is it.

Again, if people keep getting upset over his opinion - they'll keep giving him the incentive to respond.

It's not rocket science..

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If that's the way you want to rationalize it.

Darth Tagnan said:

Yeah, I guess I don't need more than one sufficiently obvious example to point something out.

But I'm fully aware that people are more invested in the changes that's been happening with Bioware and Bethesda.

What I'm saying is that these changes are universal for people aiming wide - and if you're mature and adult about it, you will realise that it's the nature of doing business in the field.

Again, we don't have to agree that people are more prone to notice this about Bethsoft and Bioware.

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You mean you're fully aware that a few people on an RPG message board are more invested. That's cool. I don't disagree with that, but I also think there are reasons for it that I've already mentioned.

JDR13 said:

Huh? I'm stating an obvious fact. Are you really that oblivious?

You've never liked a game despite not liking all the feature in it?

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Ehm, you responded to this:

If you don't see CDPR being a special case here, then so be it.

I was specifically talking about CDPR being a special case - and I've done everything I can to make that being the point very, very clear. Are you awake?

Once again, it's ok if you don't agree.

You mean you're fully aware that a few people on an RPG message board are more invested. That's cool. I don't disagree with that, but I also think there are reasons for it that I've already mentioned.

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No, I'm fully aware that several people are MORE aware of it in one case, than in another case.

But that would be my opinion.

Yeah, we're on a message board dedicated to the exchange of things like the things we're exchanging about.

Do we have to remind ourselves of that, or?

Anyway, can we agree that we're done here?