RPGWatch Feature - Black Geyser Review

Originally Posted by Nereida
I feel you are calling for me!

In a lighthearted fashion, yes.

I don't think he was talking about the game. He was saying what is the rating for "his taste".

Now having said that I think 3/5 sounds about right. I like to classify games that score around 50-70% as games that are good for genre fans but your average mcdonalds eating gamer might want to avoid them as they are an acquired taste. It's quite common for most indie crpgs to end up in this bucket due to lack of funding etc.

Originally Posted by bjon045
Now having said that I think 3/5 sounds about right. I like to classify games that score around 50-70% as games that are good for genre fans but your average mcdonalds eating gamer might want to avoid them as they are an acquired taste. It's quite common for most indie crpgs to end up in this bucket due to lack of funding etc.

There's not much acquired about Black Geyser, it plays like pretty much any other party-based companion based isometric RTwP cRPG and anyone who's played similar games would have no problem adapting to it.

It has barely no serious bugs and the bugs it does have wouldn't even occur to someone who hadn't played in Early Access and got pre-involved in development.

The main problem with the game is loading times and uninteresting combat, both of which are criticisms that can occur with games people happily rate 5/5.

In order to rate something 3/5 you have to specify what exactly is causing you to be so negative towards it, and to apply that same criteria across the board.

Originally Posted by lackblogger
In order to rate something 3/5 you have to specify what exactly is causing you to be so negative towards it, and to apply that same criteria across the board.

I think that is subjective. For me 6/10 is a perfectly acceptable game. For a genre fan that 6/10 is more like a 8/10. But for your "average" gamer i.e. who plays GoW, CoD etc it would be 6/10.

Get what I mean?

For some reason the watch won't let me edit my post. To make it even clearer I was saying I can understand why someone else would review it that way (or lower). Likewise I can understand why you would review it higher.

Originally Posted by bjon045
I think that is subjective. For me 6/10 is a perfectly acceptable game. For a genre fan that 6/10 is more like a 8/10. But for your "average" gamer i.e. who plays GoW, CoD etc it would be 6/10.

Get what I mean?

Not really. If someone is unfamiliar with a genre then the first game they play in that genre comes with zero expectations and even quite the opposite, they wont even have a clue as to what anything is supposed to be like and will likely be far more forgiving.

That's why a complete Junk AAA game passes by with barely a ripple of mainstream quibble. And why indy games or AA games can suddenly become very popular.

I could pick up literally any driving game ever made tomorrow and not have a single clue as to it's quality or comparison value to any other driving game as I haven't played a driving game since Destruction Derby in the 1990s.

I'd bet if picked any random mainstream gamer who'd never played an Isometric RTwP party-based companion-based cRPG before and gave them both Pillars and Geyser then they'd be hard pressed to make any kind of assessment as to which was better and why. The answer would likely be just as subjective as an opinion from a cRPG specialist.

Agree. Perhaps I am not ariticulating my point. You must also acknowledge some might not find it their cup of tea though right? The kind of person who would also review Pillars as a 5-7/10 (or lower).

Originally Posted by bjon045
Agree. Perhaps I am not ariticulating my point. You must also acknowledge some might not find it their cup of tea though right? The kind of person who would also review Pillars as a 5-7/10 (or lower).

Depends on the specific reasoning. If it boils down to a dislike of RTwP isometric Party-based companion-based cRPGs, then I'm surprised they even looked at it. But if it's some game-related aspect, then specifics make the point. And you are still dodging stating any specifics.

Originally Posted by lackblogger
And you are still dodging stating any specifics.

Not intentionally. For instance they just like the characters better in Pillars/Baldurs Gate. They might like the themes/story more etc. They might get more crashes in one game or the other.

If I was including non-genre fans then that list would grow i.e. they might not like the camera angle, the RTwP combat etc. Something like Baldurs gate might get higher (than pillars/Black geyser) because it has D&D behind it and the person might play tabletop or they might of read the FR books. Could be anything really.

I was just saying I could see why someone might review it a 6/10.

They would probably like those games more because they're better. Let's not make this more complicated than it needs to be.

Originally Posted by JDR13
They would probably like those games more because they're better. Let's not make this more complicated than it needs to be.

For me personally, yes they are a bit better. BG2 is one my favourite games of all time and it is ahead by a reasonable amount. Pillars/BG1 I think it is a bit closer but I think I will of enjoyed Pillars more when I finish Black Geyser but to be honest that is mostly because of White March. It was an exceptionally good DLC/Expansion that was on the level of BG2 for me. The rest of Pillars is much less memorable.

Nothing comes to BG2 for me because it has the perfect mix of story, characters and combat. Some really memorable locations and battles i.e. who can forget the Red Dragon or Kangaxx the lich.

The other reason is I really enjoy D&D and Pathfinder. I like the settings and I have read a ton of the books from both systems. Naturally it adds a lot of weight behind the story in the game. Also BG1/2 are based on 2nd Edition which is still my favourite edition along with 3.5/OGL.

Originally Posted by JDR13
They would probably like those games more because they're better. Let's not make this more complicated than it needs to be.

I've noticed you've chosen to make this game a target for your hilarious one-liners, but at no point have you ever said why this particular game has drawn your wrath. I see in this post you're suggestive that you're never going to say and that you feel that's the right thing to do. Because you're reasoning is 'bollocks'?

*Sits back and waits for the inevitable hilarious one-liner*

Originally Posted by lackblogger
I've noticed you've chosen to make this game a target for your hilarious one-liners, but at no point have you ever said why this particular game has drawn your wrath. I see in this post you're suggestive that you're never going to say and that you feel that's the right thing to do. Because you're reasoning is 'bollocks'?

*Sits back and waits for the inevitable hilarious one-liner*

Really? I'm sure you can point out all these hilarious one-liners, right?

I'm not sure why me saying Black Geyser isn't as good as games like Baldur's Gate or PoE, which most people are going to agree with, would elicit such butthurt from you.

There's no wrath here from me. I'm just stating the obvious.

Any watchers who played this, who have any more impressions?

Originally Posted by JDR13
Really? I'm sure you can point out all these hilarious one-liners, right?

Of course I can, otherwise I wouldn't have written that would I *rolls eyes*

Your total sum contribution to the thread is just these 'hilarious' codexian one-liners:

Originally Posted by JDR13
Yeah, I found myself wondering if Lackblogger actually wrote that.

Kidding

Originally Posted by JDR13
I think it's a combination of that and some Watchers having subpar tastes.

Originally Posted by JDR13
Imagine being so naive that you think critics are neutral and unbiased.

Originally Posted by JDR13
They would probably like those games more because they're better. Let's not make this more complicated than it needs to be.

And now I've done as you've asked you'll call me names like autist, butthurt and, oh wait, you already did:

Originally Posted by JDR13
I'm not sure why me saying Black Geyser isn't as good as games like Baldur's Gate or PoE, which most people are going to agree with, would elicit such butthurt from you.

I don't care what opinion you have, you'll notice my complaint has consistently been people saying stuff about the game without actually talking about the game.

But cool deflection as per usual.

Originally Posted by JDR13
There's no wrath here from me. I'm just stating the obvious.

So now you're "oh my word, I'm only stating my 'opinion'" is now, just in the next sentence "I don't have to give my opinion, my baseless statement should just be assumed to be fact because I'm JDR13".

LOL.

Hilarious.

Your claim was that JDR was targeting Black Geyser with one-liners, but only 1 of the 4 examples you cited even pertains to Black Geyser? One was him giving you shit and he even said he was kidding, another was him giving shit to RPGWatch review scores in general (not even yours specifically), and another was him giving shit to game reviewers/critics in general (not you specifically)… Then the last one, which did actually pertain to Black Geyser, simply said that PoE/BG are better than Black Geyser, which doesn't seem like a controversial or edgy comment in the least: 99+% of people will probably agree.

TLDR: ?????

Originally Posted by Stingray
Your claim was that JDR was targeting Black Geyser with one-liners, but only 1 of the 4 examples you cited even pertains to Black Geyser? One was him giving you shit and he even said he was kidding, another was him giving shit to RPGWatch review scores in general (not even yours specifically), and another was him giving shit to game reviewers/critics in general (not you specifically)…

Wow, such interpretation, such amazing. No, the careful use of winks and words doesn't at all pertain to digs at the game, suuuuure. But then that's the glory of one-liners isn't it, they're always just ambiguous enough to mean pretty much anything you want, but as long as you get a keyword in with a wink, you know, job done.

Originally Posted by Stingray
Then the last one, which did actually pertain to Black Geyser, simply said that PoE/BG are better than Black Geyser, which doesn't seem like a controversial or edgy comment in the least: 99+% of people will probably agree.

I didn't say it was controversial or edgy. I said it means nothing without discussion of the games in question. But, again, great deflection. It's almost like talking about the game might actually endanger your 'opinion' or something.

And nice stat pulled out ur ass from nowhere. Always helps when people do that.

Originally Posted by lackblogger
I don't care what opinion you have, you'll notice my complaint has consistently been people saying stuff about the game without actually talking about the game.

Perhaps you really should talk about the game in this thread instead of being at each other's throats Although reading all the crap here is entertaining in a perverted way.

Regarding the game: I thought the modest beginning of it appeared more tempting than the bombastic demon hunting of WotR. There seems to be the feeling of adventure to it.

Originally Posted by SveNitoR
Any watchers who played this, who have any more impressions?

Let's check out the latest negative review on steam (246 hours played):

Ok game at best. The game tries to replicate old school rpgs except it is worse than those games. If you have played every other crpgs out there already, and you need some more, then go ahead give this one a try. I still managed to finish it.

(My play time distorted by leaving the game running for days)

Ok at best = negative apparently. It's worse than 'those' games apparently. They recommend it for people who have already played all similar games. They managed to finish it. But apparently it's a 'negative' because: they said so. Apparently they left their game running for days. Because that's something people regularly do and we, the viewing public, needed to know that information more than what 'worse' actually means for a recommendable game that was 'ok' and gave no problem to finishing it.

Originally Posted by largh
Perhaps you really should talk about the game in this thread instead of being at each other's throats Although reading all the crap here is entertaining in a perverted way.

Regarding the game: I thought the modest beginning of it appeared more tempting than the bombastic demon hunting of WotR. There seems to be the feeling of adventure to it.

With such a poor review, both in content and in writing style, a lot of flak was to be expected. The full on defensive posture against criticism doesn't help either.

Just the concern against JDR's completely inoffensive remarks shows how great the desperation for positive feedback is.

In my opinion, the best kind of feedback is the negative one, especially if it's constructive, as it has been here.