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February 22nd, 2020, 00:30
Kindness costs nothing, being an arsehat can follow you for life. I do my best to try and be kind, but I'll admit it took decades to realize the positive repercussions from doing so. Golden rule and whatnot is fully applicable!
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February 22nd, 2020, 01:13
I enjoy discussions where I can take away something new.
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February 22nd, 2020, 11:52
Same here.

I don't enjoy discussions which are nothing but masked power games.
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February 22nd, 2020, 12:52
Yes, they are rather boring.
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February 22nd, 2020, 13:24
Originally Posted by Carnifex View Post
Kindness costs nothing
I agree and I also think it is important to always remember that ‘being kind’ is different than ‘being nice’. Kindness can involve confrontation, can involve difficult discussions, and can be uncomfortable. Putting on a smiley face and doing nothing in the face of hatefulness is not ‘being kind’, it is ‘being complicit’ … we are all responsible for shaping the world we want to live in, whether or not we actively engage.
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February 22nd, 2020, 13:39
Sorry to be a spanner in the works, but don't posts like the previous batch constitute merely power-play competative posts whereby individuals are competing for moral authority?

It's all rhetoric and catchphrases with very little substace that would be of use from either a moderation or discussion perspective?
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February 22nd, 2020, 13:59
Very little substance?
If we all agree to a text we all feel better for a moment and then carry on as usual but with a better feeling about ourselves - for a moment.
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February 22nd, 2020, 22:30
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
I felt it was reacting to what Mythros said on the previous page - and talking about more specifically how some will choose to not engage in more heated threads or stay away from controversial topics that appear to be done for their own sake.

There is too much ‘listening to know when to restart talking’ rather than actual listening both online and in real life. In the US I am finding it increasingly hard to untangle corrosive political strife from … well, anything. Whether it is running, enjoying the outdoors, work, travel, food, family and so on - everywhere there is disinformation and hatefulness and plain lies being thrust upon us from malicious individuals.

I have always (since the founding of this site) disagreed with Mythros on his core moderation approach - but it is his site, and I do my best to operate within those rules most of the time ( ). My disagreement comes down to how many people through the years have used posts to spout hatefulness against groups of people with no consequence … but that calling out someone gets you punished.

But what he was talking about is that conundrum - where things get heated in a discussion but aside from looking to ‘cool things off’ it can be hard to see particular offenses - what do you do?

The obvious answer is ‘just be kind’ - but honestly that is wonderful advice but situationally not a trivial thing. We get passionate about things, get argumentative, and occasionally lines are crossed. And there are more than a few occasions where it is a direct argument between two or three people (could likely find multiple 3+ page battles between JDR and D’Art, for example) … and generally the fight ‘stops’, and yet those things are frequently come back up in subsequent fights - we are all just people after all.

And honestly, when I talk about things like racism, religious intolerance, misogyny, homophobia and other stuff on the site … I recall not just threads and posts but *people*, just as I know that others will pre-judge a post based on it coming from me.
I have no control over what people think, but I do have control over what people are allowed to say on this forum.
You are not allowed to accuse people for what they have done in a time when there was a different TOS.

“when I talk about things like racism, religious intolerance, misogyny, homophobia and other stuff on the site …”
The only place where that is allowed is in P&R.

“when I talk about things like racism, religious intolerance, misogyny, homophobia and other stuff on the site … I recall not just threads and posts but *people*”
Yes, you are spreading accusations - in many threads, not being P&R, and now again, here, in this last post of yours in “Goodbye from me”.

“I have always (since the founding of this site) disagreed with Mythros on his core moderation approach - but it is his site, and I do my best to operate within those rules most of the time ( )”
Yes, up until this very day you keep on disagreeing, complaining about his core moderation approach.
You have barely witnessed how things have changed, how different people react, that the whole team, including Myrthos, is more aware of unwanted situations, that moderation is more tight. You clearly don’t accept me saying in a different thread things have changed.
You yourself on the other hand have been acting as in the old days, as if there never had been introduced a new TOS and a new way of moderation, which is also described in the TOS btw. ‘Play the ball, not the person’, is a Dutch expression I have used on these forums several times. Most people are doing that by now. And I must say I am very pleased to see how restraint people react(ed) to your verbal aggression towards their persona.

Unlike you I don’t care what people have said in the past, or did not say, I care about what they are saying NOW on our site and whether that is in accordance with TODAY’s TOS.
I don’t care what new members are thinking, or saying outside this site about “racism, religious intolerance, misogyny, homophobia and other stuff”, there is no questionnaire they have to fill in, no ballot committee to see whether they have opinions that are (not) acceptable for us (or you!). As long as people abide by the TOS they are free to post and talk about games.
Games!

If you like to debate with people, anyone, “calling out someone” as you prefer to call it, talking about the “hatefulness” from “malicious individuals”, getting “passionate” about it, and “finding it increasingly hard to untangle corrosive political strife from … well, anything”: please, broaden your horizon. Plenty of places on social media where you can call out plenty of people. This is a gaming site. On P&R, the place to be for these topics, there is hardly any activity.
Do your passionate work to confront people with the consequences of their past/present(?) hatefulness elsewhere and allow people here to be judged on what they write now, what they write now about games, and not about what they wrote in the past or what you might think/remember they wrote.

“I do my best to operate within those rules most of the time”
Others are expected to follow the rules ALL of the time, I don’t see why we should accept any infringements from you.
Consider this to be a proper notice.

Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
So I don’t see these as empty moral posturing, but more a chat about ‘what to do’ as the main activity of this thread dies down, and it is very clear that WE must be the change we want to see.
Yup, so start being respectful to the rules of this site, and to other members of this site and stop that hatefulness of yours.
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2. Getting a YouTube video loaded and other BB codes, see this post
Last edited by Eye; February 22nd, 2020 at 22:42. Reason: Added a comma
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February 23rd, 2020, 05:44
Let me just add one comment to Eye's excellent post. As a foundation member of this site I too didn't totally agree with Myrthos' plan for loose moderation, but I understood the reason for it. Our previous site died due to sometimes extremely tight and often arbitrary moderation, especially by one particular person. When we were planning this new site, we didn't want this to happen again. The pendulum has swung once more and I'm happy to have a tighter moderation policy.
One more small point; we're all volunteers here and we're all human. We do our best and if you have an issue with anything we do, then PLEASE just PM us for a quiet, adult conversation. We're actually very reasonable and pleasant people!!
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February 26th, 2020, 16:53
So blobby are you really leaving? I'll miss u so much . Don't go! As u probably know I had my fair share of heated and often negative encounters here but I just let them go and now try to just be kind and not get involved in any negativity. Even though sometimes my ego pulls me to be harsh I try to not follow that road. Hope u have a change of heart, ur a favorite poster of mine and I'm sure many others here, it would be a shame to lose u. God bless.
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February 28th, 2020, 20:14
@purpleblob

When I heard about BG3, the first that came to mind was you and how you will have decent take down on the new game. So I came to the watch after sometime and saw this post and was really sad

I understand and respect your decisions as I too have take short break from the site as I was getting bit confrontational with some members and thought it was not worth it.

However don't think that other people here don't respect or share your opinions on games even if they don't say anything. Sometime I have will come to the site post something but then see my thinking reflected in other members post so I won't say anything.

Anyway I hope your break is a short one and you will come back soon. I really enjoyed your take on the games and even on political matters.
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March 1st, 2020, 17:54
Purple
All I can say is ditto to what Lost and Fluent said x10
Come back
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March 1st, 2020, 18:34
Well, it's no secret that I'm extremely experienced when it comes to heated disagreements around here - and on many other forums.

Sometimes, it gets to you. I guess for different reasons.

Personally, I've grown all but immune on an emotional level (not really, but pretty close) - but I can't control my compulsion to respond when I feel I still have something to say, in a hopeless effort to make people understand where I'm coming from.

This can become quite exhausting at length.

Truth is that the written word doesn't mix well with human weakness - including pride and wanting to avoid losing face.

It's been my experience that all us of fall victim to these weaknesses - in one way or another. Some are completely incapable of openly being wrong about something - which is never going to make it easy to give way and yield the field.

Now, I've always liked Purple - and I appreciate her perspective, even if we've had our disagreements.

That said, she's always been a little bit of a princess in terms of wanting her way - and being a little sensitive when people didn't agree with her.

Nothing out of the ordinary - and it wouldn't be a problem except she does have a tendency to be overly defensive when she finally finds a game she likes, which seems to be rather rare.

SirJames is quite the character and has quite the ego. I've certainly faced much, much worse from him - but I still like him. He's overly competitive and that, too, isn't unusual.

We all have our flaws.

As for our moderators - I've had my conflicts with both of them. I still like them.

Eye has certainly said some extremely nasty things about me - and both she and Myrthos are nauseatingly woke and smug at times.

I still like them, though

You could take someone like Pib, which has never said anything negative about anyone.

He's clearly wise and extremely easy to like.

Still, he never really challenges anyone - and never seems to state a strong opinion, so is that necessarily better?

I don't know.

Point is that "online personas" and how we perceive each other is flawed and limited. I suspect many of us would quite enjoy each others company IRL.

Well, maybe not? I don't know.

I'm always sad to see regulars go, though.

Be well and all the best to you, Purple.

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March 1st, 2020, 19:06
Originally Posted by StintDArt View Post
As for our moderators - I've had my conflicts with both of them. I still like them.

Eye has certainly said some extremely nasty things about me - and both she and Myrthos are nauseatingly woke and smug at times.

I still like them, though
For the record: Corwin and I are the most active moderators. Myrthos is an administrator, though seeing his daily activities on the Watch he is more of a news editor as well as a moderator.
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Lovely 2 minute video: 'Change your words, change your world'

2. Getting a YouTube video loaded and other BB codes, see this post
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March 1st, 2020, 19:09
I'll take your word for it

I appreciate that kind of work - and I'm careful to criticize moderation because I know how much effort it takes.

Still, there's no such thing as a neutral human being.

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