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Default Fallout 4 - A Final Goodbye

January 19th, 2016, 01:59
Pixelgate, rather apocalyptically (no pun intended, honest), insists that Fallout 4 destroys everything the Fallout series was built on. Ouch.


As a franchise, Fallout has tended to maintain a high standard. Aside from spin-offs, the experiences on offer have constantly been enjoyable. From the top down view, to the modern first person, the stories told have been memorable. Things changed with Fallout 4.

At its worst, Fallout still managed to create good stories. The latest entry into the franchise bucked the trend, and bucked it hard. No longer was the story directed by the player. With a new found focus on linear narrative, Fallout 4 pushed and nudged the player forward. Dialogue options stripped back to nods and shakes of the head. Player choice reduced to nothing but a lie.



Fallout 4 marked the end of my interest in the franchise. Not because it’s a bad game, but because it’s no longer the franchise I knew. The changes made clearly had the desired affect. Fallout 4 sales hit impressive numbers, brand recognition increased and critics love it.

No longer do I see Fallout as the franchise I can count on for quality RPG experiences. The last two games may have been departures from the originals, but they still had numerous core elements. Numerous dialogue options, deep side quests and builds that affected the whole game. All Fallout 4 had was Nick Valentine and a decent map.
More information.

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January 19th, 2016, 01:59
this should be fun *grabs popcorn
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January 19th, 2016, 02:01
Originally Posted by luj1 View Post
this should be fun *grabs popcorn
Well if that is how you are going to start it off it won't be….
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January 19th, 2016, 02:04
Originally Posted by CelticFrost View Post
Well if that is how you are going to start it off it won't be….
Please stop quoting that.
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January 19th, 2016, 02:12
lol rune xD …. or what ?
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"… thing about Morrowind is we did far more than we could, far less polished than we should. It's a miracle that it works at all… there's too much, and it's like jazz… a product like Oblivion - far better software… but Morrowind… oh there's so much delicious nonsense in that." ~ words of wisdom by K.Rolston
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January 19th, 2016, 02:47
That wasn't really much of an article, just a few short paragraphs there along with some nostalgic videos. Not sure why it's worth the trouble to link. But I do agree with the little that was said in it, Fallout 4 felt like the installment where the final vestiges of RPGness were more-or-less shed, and from here on out we can assume it's balls-to-the-wall dumbing-down and mainstreaming. Unlike the author (?), I will probably still buy Fallout 5. At this point, BioWare and Bethesda are sort of like the Metallicas of the game industry - you know their new games will suck, but you still feel strangely compelled to buy and play/listen anyway. Besides, Fallout 4 was a decent loot-oriented shooter anyway, even if it wasn't an RPG and wasn't Fallout.
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January 19th, 2016, 02:50
Yeah yeah, and Fallout 3 destroyed the Fallout series. And Oblivion destroyed the Elder Scrolls series - as did Skyrim and Elder Scrolls Online. And Master of Orion 3… well… OK, sometimes they are right but most of the time these sorts of articles are just a bunch of griping. Fallout 4 is doing *quite* well from what I've heard.

Originally Posted by CelticFrost View Post
Well if that is how you are going to start it off it won't be….
That depends on the type of popcorn and whether or not there's enough for everybody.
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January 19th, 2016, 02:51
The heck?

He posts a diatribe and doesn't bother backing it up? He's just crying over his public diary like a love-lost 12-year-old who got rejected by the pretty one. There's… nothing there. Just a tear stained rant.

C'mon. Man up and make an *actual* case. I'm willing to listen. I like the game, but I can see weaknesses in it and I do wonder about the direction Bethsoft is going. Convince me. Don't act like an overemotional teenager.
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January 19th, 2016, 02:56
Originally Posted by Zloth View Post
Fallout 4 is doing *quite* well from what I've heard.
Of course it is.

For starters, pretty much all Fallout 4 sales at this point are based on franchise or developer reputation, not the actual game itself. After all, Fallout 4 got very bad reviews compared to all previous Bethesda games. (Metacritic: Morrowind 89, Oblivion 94, FO3 91, Skyrim 94, FO4 84.)

But secondly, the direction they're moving the game in - towards the mainstream and away from its RPG roots, is intended to create more sales than before. That's the whole point.

So, saying it's doing "quite well" really has nothing to do with anything being discussed in this (stupidly short) article.
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January 19th, 2016, 02:59
I agree on is the linear narrative. That works great for some games (ME, Witcher, etc.) but FO (and TES) I like it better when the character is far more open. Other FO games did have some history to the character but overall was very flexible.

Being forced into a marriage and having a kid was just the wrong direction for me. Guess others enjoyed it. I just made up a back story of mistaken identity and my character went along with the "looking for Shaun" thing (when I had no other option in dialogue) with the rationale that if the Institute ever figured out he wasn't the guy they thought he was they might make a determined effort to hunt him down and kill him. Knowing Synths could be anywhere he kept up the ruse. It works but would be much better to not have the kid thing in the first place.

I think FNV had a better story, companions, quests, and choices. But in the end I go with what is fun and FO4 has been very fun for me. I consider it an RPG myself as I tend to focus on things other than combat and have enjoyed the companions (certainly way better than FO3 and even better than Skyrim ones), many of the quests, settlements, and while I would like more dialogue choices I can deal with what there is. I also like the perk system and spend a lot of time agonizing over each of my choices going with a certain RP focus in mind.

I also don't cling to the past very much on games (although I do get nostalgic at times). I try to enjoy each game on its own merits and take it for what it is.
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January 19th, 2016, 03:01
Fallout 4 was great for a once off playthrough….
No replayability in it though!

Good for sales, but will never be a true classic!
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January 19th, 2016, 03:40
Replay-ability is the goal if you want to make a classic and I'm not seeing that in fallout 4. You end up with a powerful character who can do everything so there is not much room for multiple play-styles. It will be interesting to see what the expansions offer beyond further base building options.
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January 19th, 2016, 03:47
At this point criticising Fallout 4 feels like beating a dead horse. Just leave its corpse behind and pretend you never came across it. Fallout 4 stood out only in being average and unremarkable, and nobody will remember it even existed in a year.

But it's time to stop being so negative about it. There are nice games coming up that will be deep and interesting and give the player power of choice, to actually roleplay their characters and see that their actions do matter. In this site more than anywhere else we should be talking about the RPGs that will have those things instead of beating repeatedly on the ones that shouldn't even be hinted as being a RPG.
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January 19th, 2016, 03:47
I'm trying my best to stay interested long enough to finish the main quest… but the sheer amount of deja vu as I venture back into previously explored buildings and find not just respawned enemies (which I can typically tolerate), but also newly relocked doors, repopulated safes, and even replacement pre-war tech and medicine lying (again) out in the open is driving me up the wall. This is anything but a wasteland - it's a themepark of immersion-destroying gimmicks.

Overall, Bethesda did so much wrong with this installment that it can only be explained away as absolute stupidity. And, while this can certainly sound like a dead horse getting beat on at times, it's simply frustrating that what once held so much promise has turned into utter shit.
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January 19th, 2016, 04:25
Originally Posted by Drithius View Post
I'm trying my best to stay interested long enough to finish the main quest… but the sheer amount of deja vu as I venture back into previously explored buildings and find not just respawned enemies (which I can typically tolerate), but also newly relocked doors, repopulated safes, and even replacement pre-war tech and medicine lying (again) out in the open is driving me up the wall. This is anything but a wasteland - it's a themepark of immersion-destroying gimmicks.
Weird… I honestly don't recall ever coming across a relocked door or respawned loot, and I put quite a few hours into FO4. I didn't often revisit places once I had cleared them though.

As far as the article is concerned though, it's pretty much complete bunk imo. I though FO4 was better than FO3 in almost every way.
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January 19th, 2016, 04:34
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Weird… I honestly don't recall ever coming across a relocked door or respawned loot, and I put quite a few hours into FO4. I didn't often revisit places once I had cleared them though.
I did.
Until I installed norespawn mod which is IMO a must.

FO4 better than FO3 is what I feel too.
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January 19th, 2016, 04:47
Originally Posted by Emerwyn View Post
At this point criticising Fallout 4 feels like beating a dead horse. Just leave its corpse behind and pretend you never came across it. Fallout 4 stood out only in being average and unremarkable, and nobody will remember it even existed in a year.

But it's time to stop being so negative about it. There are nice games coming up that will be deep and interesting and give the player power of choice, to actually roleplay their characters and see that their actions do matter. In this site more than anywhere else we should be talking about the RPGs that will have those things instead of beating repeatedly on the ones that shouldn't even be hinted as being a RPG.
Yeah you're right. There's a serious embarrassment of riches for RPG fans. More stuff to do with leisure time than could be accomplished even if you devote complete workweeks to gaming (which is unhealthy).
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January 19th, 2016, 04:54
Agree in part, regarding it's change of direction: but here is the thing, I love hiking simulators with a linear storyline so that works for me.

My Fallout Games go as followed:

NV > 2 > 4 > 1 > 3

NV's DLC is the best in any RPG I can think of… so there's that too.

I am happy enough having my hiking simulators separate from my core RPG experiences now, I see them as a open slate to mod upon (come second playthrough time), whereas games like Pillars of Eternity, D:OS and Wasteland 2 are scratching my hardcore RPG itches.
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January 19th, 2016, 04:55
Everybody knows that FO3 ruined the Fallout series and that New Vegas made it all better.
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January 19th, 2016, 05:14
FO3 was a clunky mess with terrible dialogue and jokes for quests but at least the core game showed some semblance of being an RPG, which is more than I can say for the dialogue and quest system in FO4.

I'll just leave this here…
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