Skyrim Impressions after finishing up my first character

The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

Maylander

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I started writing various impressions in some news thread, but realized it started to become a bit much, so I cut it short (relatively speaking) and decided to make a thread about it. I will try to keep it spoiler free for now. If people ask specific questions, I'll reply with spoiler tags. Let's try to keep it spoiler free, so everyone can read it.

First off, let me say the game is massive, so I obviously have not completed everything yet. I have the following content left:

— Cities —
- Winterhold
- Windhelm
- Solitude
- Dawnstar
- Falkreath

— Regions —
- South west
- North east
- North (central, area around Solitude)

— Guilds —
- Thieves Guild
- Mage Guild
- Dark Brotherhood
- Legion
- Stormcloaks

In other words: Quite a lot. My first character was an honorable orc fighter and focused on fighter based guilds and quests. I avoided as many thief/murder type quests as possible, simply because there's no way to pick an honorable outcome. I'll do those quests on my thief character. My mage will also be honorable, so he'll focus primarily on the mage guild + various major cities.

The reason I'm doing it this way is a drawback that is as ever present in Skyrim as it was in Oblivion - linear quests. I've found a few exceptions, so it's a bit less linear than Oblivion, but they are quite rare.

The comparison will be primarily to Oblivion and/or Morrowind, as the Bethesda recipe is still quite unique.

Graphics
As always in Bethesda games, the graphics are great. Not as impressive as Oblivion was back in the days, but it should be more than enough for anyone who enjoy RPGs. My computer has no issues running the game on Ultra, no glitches or anything.

It is a bit interesting to consider the whole engine thing. Is it really a new engine? It's certainly a lot smoother, but a lot of the effects are so similar to what we're used to in Bethesda games, I'm really starting to wonder if actually made a new engine, but copied so many of the things we've seen in Fallout 3 and Oblivion. An example is the slow-down-killing-blow thing - it's identical to previous implementations.

It's not really important though, as long as the game runs smoothly and looks nice.

Sound
I'm not as overwhelmed as some of the reviewers seem to be. Yes, it's all high quality stuff, but hardly mind blowing. The music is certainly not on par with Gothic 3, or even Morrowind in my opinion (I really enjoyed the sound track of Morrowind). The voice actomg is all solid, but I don't see how they're better than DS3, Alpha Protocol, Gothic 3 and so on and so forth that all got criticized for having bad voice acting. In fact, some of the voice actors are actually the same, such as the guy that played Deckard Cain in Diablo 2 (he was in both Gothic 3 and Skyrim).

Still, it's as good as anyone can expect, and quite a bit better than Oblivion - no random voice stuff or weird conversations. The conversations are certainly scripted this time, which works out a lot better.

Gameplay
Same as always. If you like Bethesda's gameplay, you'll like it here too. If you never liked it before, you won't like it now. Simple as that really.

There are a few improvements though:
- I actually prefer the new character system. Not all perks are equally interesting, but they do seem fairly balanced and it's quite a smooth system.
- Dual wielding! About time! It even works out well - my first character used primarily dual wielding, and he sliced most creatures apart pretty fast. Except Giants. Don't go near Giants.
- Working 3rd person view! Yes, they did it! It took them a bunch of tries, but this time they nailed it. I can now flawlessly switch between my beloved 3rd person view, and 1st person view for inspecting something closely. This is a pretty big plus in my opinion, though I still feel it's something that should've been available already in Morrowind. It can't be that hard to implement properly, can it?
- Toned down level scaling. I'm pretty sure there's still level scaling, as I completed the game in Blade gear, capable of killing most creatures without breaking a sweat. I suspect the system works similar to the system in Gothic 3, where there is limited level scaling, but not enough to remove the "danger factor". Bump into a Giant early on and he'll kill you in a single blow. Bump into him 15 levels later, and.. he'll kill you in about two blows instead. Dragons seem to scale more than most enemies though, as they seemed to be roughly as tough no matter when I met them.
- Better use of 3D and the Z-axis. This is something PB mastered years ago - how to properly make use of the Z-axis. Oblivion, Morrowind and Fallout 3 all used a similar recipe, with slopes more than proper mountains, and very few canyons, bridges etc. Skyrim is vastly superior to previous Bethesda titles in terms of 3D.

That being said, there is also a drawback: Morrowind still trumps Skyrim when it comes to magic. Neither Oblivion, nor Skyrim, is anywhere near Morrowind.

Quests
Overall, the quality of the quests is relatively high. There are quite a few FedEx quests, but it didn't really bother me as I just avoided them after a while (they usually pay insignificant amounts of gold).

The only real complaint is the exact same complaint I had in Oblivion: No way to influence the outcome of the quests/questlines. In D&D terms: If I'm playing someone who happens to be Lawful Good, I want to be able to handle situations as if I'm Lawful Good, not True Neutral. I consider this a major issue, as it really lowers replay value - there are now dozens of quests I simply don't feel like doing again, as the reward was lousy and I know exactly what the outcome is. Nothing will change.

Edit1: I see there is an achievement related to conquering one of two cities. I suspect I know what needs to be done in order to complete it. If my suspicion is correct, that is quite a choice with a fairly big impact. Definetly something I'll check out with my next character.

Story
In good ol'Bethesda fashion it's quite.. weird. I'm not going to spoil anything, but at times it felt as weird as the questline of Morrowind. No need to close 10 Oblivion gates though, so it's automatically superior to Oblivion in that regard. The writing seems to be the same as always - good enough to be captivating, which is all it really needs to be in an open world game.

Skyrim still has the "it's urgent, but not really urgent" thing going on, but that's hard to avoid. I've played very few games where this was not the case. In fact, the only game I can think of Baldur's Gate 2, which used a rather cheap mechanism to avoid the problem (gather 20.000 gold).

Exploration
The heart of such a game! And yes, it really is a lot better than Oblivion. I haven't noticed a single re-used dungeon, and I've even encountered several big ones with puzzles and what not in them.

However, about halfway through I lost the motivation to explore. I realized that, while most dungeons seem unique, what I'm going to find inside them is not. I've only seen a few pieces of hand placed loot, and they were all related to some quest (Companions quest, main quest, etc). The rest seem to be generic, which means it's not really worth anything after you get to the point where money is no longer an issue. Near the end of the game I had more money than I could spend, so why drag along useless items?

In other words, I primarily did dungeons that were quest related near the end. If I didn't have a quest in some specific dungeon that I came across, I simply didn't enter it at all.

It's better than Oblivion though, hands down. Not all games can be Gothic 2, right?

Oh yes, almost forgot to mention: The scope is very impressive. I'm not sure how it relates to Oblivion in terms of size, but it feels a whole lot bigger. Could be the Z-axis thing though, as Oblivion was similar to Denmark, while Skyrim is more akin to Norway.

Unfortunately, that also means Oblivion was about as varied as Denmark, and Skyrim as varied as Norway, which means.. not very varied at all. Don't get me wrong - it's very realistic for an area the size of Skyrim to not be very varied, but when I'm playing games I prefer a little more variation. Maybe Bethesda should make a sci-fi game? That way, their worlds can all be realistic, but still varied as you travel between different worlds with different climates and cultures.

All in all, I still think Morrowind had a more fun world to explore. It not only felt a bit more varied and unique, but I seem to recall more special loot too, and a culture that was a bit more interesting to explore. Of course, Morrowind had Buzzards and massive, boring ash plains, so it wasn't fantastic at all times.

Verdict
Well, I've only completed about 1/3 of the overall quests (rough estimate), in addition to the main quest, so I can't really give a final verdict just yet. However, I would currently place it somewhere between Morrowind and Oblivion. It is clearly superior to Oblivion, I very much doubt anything is going to change my opinion on that matter. However, I'm still a bit uncertain as far as Morrowind goes.

On the plus side, Morrowind was more interesting in terms of factions and quest structure. Deciding which house to join had a massive impact, as did the other factions once you neared the end of their questlines. I also remember that it felt like a much greater achievement to reach the top of the Legion than anything I've felt in other Elder Scrolls games. I really felt like the king of the world when I finally beat what's-his-name in the arena, after having gradually risen through the ranks.

Then again, Skyrim has superior atmosphere, NPC behavior and overall gameplay. It's nowhere near as rough around the edges as Morrowind was, and would obliterate Morrowind in terms of gameplay if only the magic system had been anywhere near the one in Morrowind.

Anyway, in time I'll reach something of a final verdict. For now, Morrowind is still the top Elder Scrolls game for me - the main reason being the factions and the fact that I didn't grow bored as fast while exploring the world. It simply didn't feel as predictable.

That is all I can think of for now, might add more later. Feel free to add questions/impressions/discussions etc.

Edits:
- Edit1, quest section updated.
 
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In other words: Quite a lot. My first character was an honorable orc fighter and focused on fighter based guilds and quests. I avoided as many thief/murder type quests as possible, simply because there's no way to pick an honorable outcome. I'll do those quests on my thief character. My mage will also be honorable, so he'll focus primarily on the mage guild + various major cities.

The reason I'm doing it this way is a drawback that is as ever present in Skyrim as it was in Oblivion - linear quests. I've found a few exceptions, so it's a bit less linear than Oblivion, but they are quite rare.

I do this in Bethesda games too. Since they don't really lock you out of content I just kind of lock them off myself by only doing quests that suit my character. Right now I am an Imperial assassin working to further their interests in the war.

It is a bit interesting to consider the whole engine thing. Is it really a new engine? It's certainly a lot smoother, but a lot of the effects are so similar to what we're used to in Bethesda games, I'm really starting to wonder if actually made a new engine, but copied so many of the things we've seen in Fallout 3 and Oblivion. An example is the slow-down-killing-blow thing - it's identical to previous implementations.

I got in some heated arguments about this when they announced the "new engine" thing. The deal is that they replaced more of the engine components, which were gamebryo in origin, but the majority of their technology was on top of that and created by them. They certainly overhauled a lot between Fallout 3 and Skyrim, but just like Morrowind to Oblivion the core tech is the same.

Whether that counts as a "new engine" is up for debate, but it definitely feels like a Bethesda game.

- I actually prefer the new character system. Not all perks are equally interesting, but they do seem fairly balanced and it's quite a smooth system.
- Dual wielding! About time! It even works out well - my first character used primarily dual wielding, and he sliced most creatures apart pretty fast. Except Giants. Don't go near Giants.

I love the leveling system. It finally brings real choice and consequence to TES, you cannot master everything. You can only get 70 or so perks out of 250+.

And duel wield is great. As a spellsword I can control my magic and sword at the same time, back and forth.

- Toned down level scaling. I'm pretty sure there's still level scaling, as I completed the game in Blade gear, capable of killing most creatures without breaking a sweat. I suspect the system works similar to the system in Gothic 3, where there is limited level scaling, but not enough to remove the "danger factor". Bump into a Giant early on and he'll kill you in a single blow. Bump into him 15 levels later, and.. he'll kill you in about two blows instead. Dragons seem to scale more than most enemies though, as they seemed to be roughly as tough no matter when I met them.

Saber cats slaughtered me at first and kept me from going North. When I finally killed one it felt like a real accomplishment. This is what RPGs are about!
 
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I second that emoticon when it comes to the dual-wield thing - i decided to go Dunmer dual-wield/archery (dabbling in some destruction magic), and I'm having a blast now that the interface and game overall is becoming more comfortable. Controlling both hands independently really gives a feeling of freedom in battle, and the ability to hit w/ both weapons at once is brutal! (using two swords right now)

and just having the freedom to bust out some fire or lightning w/ one hand while slashing away w/ the other has lead to some interesting fights, or bust out the heal spell w/ one hand for a quick health blast. Both hands going w/ a surge of lightning, or one w/ fire the other lightning - wow! Good times.

Oh and I agree about the Giants, I was feeling pretty badass after mowing thru a bunch of stuff and thought I'd start some trouble with a giant - which turned into my first death of the game. Awesome looking enemy tho, they did a great job w/ the giants.

Initally turned off by a few things in the game, but that's all fading into the ether now that the game's opening up more and more as I get more levels under my belt. This is already feeling like my GOTY
 
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About 15 hrs in, not done too many quests, part way down main one. The whole world "feels" hand crafted. The locations and dungeons are very memorable, they really are. So much better than copy-paste oblivion and fo3 so far. Oozes atmosphere. Not visited many other cities except Whiterun. Lots of little touches everywhere. Some funny random encounters. "Themed" dungeons. Tough fights as archer even with companions.

I enjoy exploring, they struck the right balance between GFX and playability. It looks simply great. You can see fires and "other" types of light miles away.

I love RPGs but I do not replay them. FO:3 I never completed. Oblivion I did once I got bored. FalloutNV I completed. The writing is not as good as The Witcher 2 or Fallout NV but its still pretty good, just not as involved. (so far anyway …).

The issue with Oblivion is that eventually the player began to see the underlying mechanics (leveling mobs with gear and randomised naff loot) so the game lost its aura. Wondering how long it will take for this to happen in Skyrim? Hopefully a lot longer.

Have a feeling Whiterun is the largest city? Maybe not.

Crafting seems decent, as does alchemy and cooking. Spells not really dabbled in much. Archery good.

Word of advice - the first tier of combat and Armour perks really help you if you are struggling in melee or sneak / archery combat. (i.e. they up your damage or armour by 20% each time). This is great especially as when your gear improves the bonus is bigger. I skipped lockpicking and pickpocket to put some points in archery etc., but might come back to them later.

An expansion pack in a really large city would be great, especially for the "Thief 1 & 2" feel.

So far its much better than I thought it would be, I have been pretty surprised! They really have learnt a lot and taken a lot of the faults and fixed them. I hope it lasts past the honeymoon period!
 
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I'm enjoying myself immensely after about 20 hours. I'm playing a thief/archer/sneak with illusion thrown in. Frenzy works great, but still have to find an invisibility spell! Even though they are dead ugly, I picked Argonian for initial skill boni, but more importantly for the hitskin power. Though I haven't had to use it yet. :/

On thing bugs me about stealth. In a house I go into sneak mode, unseen. And I go upstairs. The owner follows me upstairs even though my sneak icon shows hidden. I can steal right in front of him without him going hostile. But if I move around he follows me. Bizarre.
 
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maybe try taking off your boots ='.'=

One day i'm going to try a beast race, Ive always wanted to try the Khajit as a thief but the Dunmer always wins..
 
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Have a feeling Whiterun is the largest city? Maybe not.

Solitude is about the same size, maybe a bit bigger if you include the docks right outside of it. The only other one I have been to is Winterhold, which is really small.

An expansion pack in a really large city would be great, especially for the "Thief 1 & 2" feel.

I think full expansions are a dead memory, but if you mean Fallout 3 style expansions I think there are a ton of great ideas they could do. They have all the assets to do a return to Bloodmoon, which would be awesome. Morrowind and Cyrodiil are right next door as well, so they could do some border hopping. Morrowind has a city at the Northern tip right next to Skyrim, that could be a great place to set an expansion.
 
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On thing bugs me about stealth. In a house I go into sneak mode, unseen. And I go upstairs. The owner follows me upstairs even though my sneak icon shows hidden. I can steal right in front of him without him going hostile. But if I move around he follows me. Bizarre.

Yeah, I think the AI is coded to follow you upstairs in their own homes and shops no matter what, to make theft at least somewhat challenging. After you get to about 40 in sneak though theft is super easy.
 
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Whitehold is not the biggest city in terms of size, but it is in terms of involvement. At least it feels that way.

I'm level 15ish now with my Mage. Generally, I find it more fun than melee, but I definitely depend more on having a companion now - I soloed most of the game with my fighter without breaking a sweat, but certain fights will pretty much flatten me now if Lydia doesn't come to the rescue.

It might have something to do with the fact that I played orc previously - the rage ability is flat out amazing in boss fights, trivializing most such fights due to the massive bonus.

@huggster
Considering a stealthy wood elf archer/thief as my 3rd character, but I'm not sure how good archery is. It seems like it could get a little challenging in certain dungeons. Having any trouble so far?
 
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Archery is tricky in dungeons, yes, but now I have companions they tank for me. A few levels back there were dungeons I could not do but may have been above my level.
I won't spoil but I managed to get three companions at once, one of whom was very annoying! Not sure if 3 is normal?

Level 13 now. Archery now feels even more powerful as I added a two levels of 20% damage perks and two magic items with 20% each giving 80% overall boost to damage output, plus the steady aim skill (awesome) and the 3x multiplier for sneak attacks. With a high base damage bow and steel or orcish arrows you can do very well. Even iron arrows are okay. You may have to hunt around for a decent bow. Some creatures drop decent ones non-magical ones. Merchants inventories change quite a lot. You can also apply smithing improvements to a bow ;-)

Decent light armour with points into the 20% defence bonuses, and some points into 1h damage boost (at the bottom of the tree) I would say is a no brainer, as you will likely fall back on 1h weapons / daggers anyway if you are unlocking sneak route.

I have decided that these combat perks are essential, and left lockpicking/pickpocketing alone for now. Also put a lot in stamina as aiming with bow drains it quickly.

I dual wield currently when things get hairy. I just mash the buttons and glug potions. Skillful I know.

Without companions or summons dungoens would be tough if you get bum-rushed by 2 or more. As my sneak improves I should be able to stay hidden longer. Dungeons in general are far too bright.
 
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Archery works great against single foes but if several people close with you you are in trouble. Actually, if several people close with you you are in trouble anyway!

Anyone try the 15x sneak attack with daggers? Wow! I took down a giant with an Elven dagger. It's hard to sneak up on groups, though.
 
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This is why i use illusion with my sneaky archer. For crowd control.

I start off with frenzy to get my enemies to attack one another, and retreat into hiding in shadows. As they thin out themselves, I keep that up until left with just one guy I can take out with a bow sneak attack. :)

There's other approaches using calm, invisibility to run away, paralysis, etc…

My back up melee is single handed with a shield. I figure if I get into that situation it should be defensive as possible, until mana regens, and then start on the illusion spells again to thin the ranks (or escape).

Anyway, this is my favorite style, there's lots of possibilities, can cause many funny situations, and requires quick thinking, not just spamming attacks. :)

BTW, anyone notice that the command spells are missing from the illusion school? :(
 
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BTW, anyone notice that the command spells are missing from the illusion school? :(

Illusion in general just seems a bit… empty to me, at least at low skill levels. There doesn't seem to be much to make me use it enough to level it up without spamming spells just for levelling purposes. Frenzy's there, but without being super-stealthboy they tend to attack you over anything else. I suppose Muffle's alright, but I think that's about all I ever use.
 
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Yep, illusion is hard to train. I found Clairvoyance, but I don't feel like spamming it to train. I think I need to join the Thieves or Mage guild to find an illusion trainer? This world SEEMS weak on mage trainers, (but I've hardly explored it)...
 
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They do seem to be concentrated in Winterhold. I suppose it fits the feel of the place, but in the pre-Oblivion days other factions had their own magic trainers and services. I'm sure some nightblade (or guy with nightbladish skills) in the Skyrim version of the Thieves Guild would be interested in making a bit of money off of his buddies.
 
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Also thinking Dark Brotherhood should have an illusion trainer. Although my PC is like an assassin, that really isn't the role I think for him. I like to think of him more like a trickster. Well, I could check the game guide I suppose. I've tried to avoid all spoilers so far...
 
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- Dual wielding! About time! It even works out well - my first character used primarily dual wielding, and he sliced most creatures apart pretty fast. Except Giants. Don't go near Giants.

I'm playing a dual wield stealth character as well (on "master" difficulty setting) and I almost managed to one-shot a giant last night after pulling off a backstab dual wield power attack with daggers (15x dmg with Assassin's Blade perk).

I think after progressing a bit more and improving my one-handed and poison-making/enchanting skills I will eventually be able to one-shot the smug bastards.
 
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I think after progressing a bit more and improving my one-handed and poison-making/enchanting skills I will eventually be able to one-shot the smug bastards.

Are poisons any good? I just sell mine, also can they be used on arrows?

Daniel.
 
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Just press the poison bottle in the inventory and it will ask to be applied to your equiped weapon. So you poison the bow not the arrows but yes it works :)

Next question! It seems the poisons only last for one hit, is there a way to make them last longer?
 
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I think poisons sometimes last several hits at random, but I'm not sure.

I find that Slow and Paralyze poisons are great for an archer build, but they are unfortunately rare. I've been able to whip up some lingering damage poison (DOT) myself which is good against tough opponents.

I would love some lead or concrete poison to keep those pesky dragons tethered to the ground. ;-)
 
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