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August 21st, 2021, 00:27
Oh, THAT ! *facepalm*



Too bad only subscribers can post in that forum, and I'm long not a subscriber there anymore …
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August 21st, 2021, 17:47
The word genre seems to be such a torture to pronounce for English-speakers, so unnatural and unlike other words. Each time I hear it, I have the impression this word is out of place.

For a native French, it's even weirder to pronounce this French word the English way, especially because of the 'n', which we merge (in French) with the 'e' to create another sound (a diphthong).

English: ˈʒɒnrə
French: ʒɑ̃r
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August 21st, 2021, 18:09
Fortunately, in Norwegian we write it and pronounce it "sjanger".

pibbuR who thinks that Norwegian is easier than any other language he knows (apart from a few programming languages)
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August 22nd, 2021, 11:20
Personally, I'm torn between both ways to pronounce it.
The more common way to say it in Germany is the French way. Remember that at least western Germany has been ruled by Napeleon for quite some time, which is why a few French words have made it into German language.
And a few which sound French, but … seemingly aren't. Like the "mach' keine Fisimatenten !", which is more or less like "calamities" or "don't do any troubles !", roughly translated.

So, German people usually correct me in that the word "genre" is pronounced the French way, but to me, it feels more naturally to pronounce it the English way, I have no idea why.

I have even come up with my very personal way to pronounce it : Genre, literally with all letters spoken …

I also pronounce "router" (the device) that way : I speak all letters … except with the "r", which I don't really pronounce.
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August 22nd, 2021, 11:31
Like the English I speak it with two syllables:
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August 22nd, 2021, 13:45
Originally Posted by HiddenX View Post
Like the English I speak it with two syllables:
She got the French pronunciation right (even the "r")
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October 4th, 2021, 11:37
I guess that I had written this at some point already : The Egg And The Shield.

The Egg is in German language the Ei, which is pronounced like the English letter "i".

"The Egg is the I."

When I was very young, and a starter in learning the English language, I thought that the English word "child" looks a lot like the German word "Schild", which I still do.
But, there are no more similarities. "Child", or, as a beginner might write, "cheild", with the "ei" from above, means simething very different than a "sign".

The word "Schild" appears in different variations. Cars have the "Nummernschild", which is in English the "license plate", if I recall that correctly.
There are also "signs" like in "traffic signs".
There are no "sign seeing tours", though.

The "Schild" is also what knights hold before their bodies. The English word "shield" looks very much like the German word.

there's a German saying : "Was fŁhrt er im Schilde ?" Meaning "what is he going to do ? What are his plans ?" The literal translation of "Was fŁhrt er im Schilde ?" would be like … "what kind of sign does he have on his shield ?" or, even more literal, "what is leading [him] on his shield ?", roughly translated.

The sign on the shield (hah !) has always been the "coat of arms" (whereas I originally thought that "coat" was meant to be a "mantle", err, coat … So I asked myself : "Why would someone put such a big sign on his coat ? And why is it so important to habve his arms mentioned ? Why not his legs ?"

One curious thing I didn't fully understand is the "schilderij" from het Nederlands language. I still do not quite understand what it actually means. Can anybody help me here, please ?
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October 4th, 2021, 12:00
A painter is named 'schilder' in Dutch. A painting is a ' schilderij'
The origin of the word 'schilder' probably comes from painting a 'schild'. The English word for 'schild' is shield. Shields were usually painted with symbols. In the old days this was named 'schilden van schild'. In current English this is 'Painting of shield'.
The one doing all this 'schilden' on the 'schild' was named the 'schilder'. Later on the work of a 'schilder' was named 'schilderie' or 'schilderye', which brings us to the current word 'schilderij'.

Apparently the word 'Schilderie' was a word that was also used in old German, where it was named 'schilderei'. And I have found other locations where the word was used in older days, like in Norway and Sweden (skilderi) and Maleysia (Skelderij)
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October 4th, 2021, 12:04
Originally Posted by Myrthos View Post
Shields were usually painted with symbols.
Yes, or with a coat of arms.

Thank you very much.

In Cologne, there actually is a street called "Schildergasse", with "Gasse" meaning a narrow street (often between columns of houses).

Edit : Scyld in the Beowulf text, too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skj%C3%B6ldr
"Scyld" is usually transtraled into German as "Schild", as far as I know.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sceafa…cyld_and_sceaf
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October 4th, 2021, 12:13


In this respect German is somewhat similar to Latin.

pibbuR who notices that both languages are similar to RPN (postfix notation in mathematics).
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October 4th, 2021, 12:20


Yes, I have had the same experience !

In my latin learning books, I was very asonished how many verbs look like English words !
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October 4th, 2021, 12:40
Originally Posted by Alrik Fassbauer View Post


Yes, I have had the same experience !

In my latin learning books, I was very asonished how many verbs look like English words !
No surprise since a lot of words in European languages derive from Latin.

pibbuR

PS. One funny thing I found after I watched the TV series "Dark": In Latin we have the word "particula" which means small part. The suffix "-ula" or "'ulus" means small, and we use it a lot in "medicine latin" (which my daughter correctly doesn't regard as Latin). The same word is used in English "particle" and Norwegain "partikkel". But in German - at least that's what they said in "Dark" it's "Teilchen", which seems to be a direct translation: "Teil" is "part" and "-chen" is a suffix to denote something small. Nice. DS
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October 4th, 2021, 13:19
Maybe Cicero was a cousin of Yoda.
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October 4th, 2021, 16:02
Originally Posted by pibbuR View Post
But in German - at least that's what they said in "Dark" - it's "Teilchen", which seems to be a direct translation: "Teil" is "part" and "-chen" is a suffix to denote something small. Nice. DS
That's right.
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October 4th, 2021, 17:04
One thing about the "-chen". As far as I remember, in German all words ending with "-chen" are neuter. Which means that a girl ("Mšdchen") is it (German "es"). (Found out the from a fake Rammstein cover of the German Eurovision Song Contest song: Ein bisschen Frieden -"Ich bin nur ein Mšdchen, das sagt, was es fŁhlt").

pibbur who thinks this is a bit strange.

PS. Admittedly there are some words for females and males also in Norweegain that are neuter. DS.
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Last edited by pibbuR; October 4th, 2021 at 17:23.
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October 4th, 2021, 20:59
ATM I am consuming a Gin and Tonic. Bareksten, a Norwegian gin which IMO beats Hendricks, my previous favourite (sadly, I'm not paid to write this).

Which reminds me of the term "nursing a drink", which according to my sources (the internet) means "slowly consuming a (usually alcoholic) drink". How slow, it doesn't say. Now, where does that expression come from?

pibbur who now is a bit concerned about what they do at nursing homes.

PS. Actually he's not, since he in his early medical student days spent the summers working at a definitely non alcoholic nursing home. DS.
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October 5th, 2021, 10:53
Originally Posted by pibbuR View Post
One thing about the "-chen". As far as I remember, in German all words ending with "-chen" are neuter. Which means that a girl ("M√§dchen") is it (German "es"). (Found out the from a fake Rammstein cover of the German Eurovision Song Contest song: Ein bisschen Frieden -"Ich bin nur ein M√§dchen, das sagt, was es f√ľhlt").

pibbur who thinks this is a bit strange.

PS. Admittedly there are some words for females and males also in Norweegain that are neuter. DS.
Yes, Mädchen are neutrum, I din't know why. There is also the word "das Fräulein", which only elder ones use nowadys, which means "a young woman". Neutrum, again.

There is also "die junge Frau" = "the young woman", which basically is the same as "Fräulein", but with more repect, and female, because "Frau" is female, too.
The term "junge Frau" often breathes the image of a young woman either being in a higher social state than a "Fräulein", and thus getting more respect, or being older as a "Fräulein".

My grandmother, when she was in the 70s, she still said "Fräulein" or "junge Frau" to adress women who were working at cash registers in food markets, no matter / regardless which age these women had. I lived to see one incident when she did so to a women clearly noticeable as being in the 50s or 60s herself (as people, especially women, who had only very few money when becoming older, in the countryside often worked in the 50-70 in small shops).

Traditionally - and nowadays only elderly people use that word today - "Fräulein" was usually used for working women, be it in shops (like groceries) or as postwomen, or as cleaners.


I have a question myself now :

What is the difference between "hag" and "witch" in English ?
I wonder because the German language only has one word for that : "Hexe".
There does exist a male form as "Hexer", but that is something almost no-one uses outside of the Fantasy genre.
One Edgar Wallace criminal story was translated as "Der Hexer", though.
(His movies were a HUGE success in Germany in the 60s ! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Films_…ns;_the_Krimis )
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October 5th, 2021, 11:12
As I understand it a witch is more generic and can be a woman or a man. A hag is always a woman and is more regularly used with a negative connotation.
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October 5th, 2021, 12:54
Witch is close to old English wicca (=sorcerer).

And wicca is close to low German Wickewief = sorceress [wief =Weib= woman]
"wicken" is a verb in low German which means "to use magic".
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October 5th, 2021, 13:09
In Norwegian "heks" is a female. The male is called "trollmann" (magic man). But we have the term "heksemester" (master of witchery) which is male. The corresponging word for "hag" would be the derogatory term "trollkjerring" (magic bitch).

pibbur who FYI is a no-magics male.
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