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December 28th, 2019, 12:28
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Just finished the last episode of The Mandalorian. I found it just as mediocre as the prior episodes. A lot of the dialogue is cringeworthy, and some of the things that were done plot-wise were particularly nonsensical in this one. I even laughed out loud a couple of times and not in a good way.

Spoiler


It's ironic because I had high expectations for The Mandalorian while at the same time being extremely skeptical of The Witcher. The latter turned out to be a lot better imo.
Spoiler
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December 28th, 2019, 12:34
the witcher

enjoyable overall though it had some slow moments; did not expect cavill to play that well, he was really cool through most of the scenes. It was confusing with different time periods since i dont know anything from the books but it was rewarding towards the end when all things fall in place. Also a very nice feeling seeing chars/scenes from the games and thinking/comparing about them.
As a very fun fact did not know that the duny lord becomes archmagnificiency emhyr ha.

The major negative thing for me was the music or the lack more like it, they should have just get it from witcher 3 or hire that band. Ah, and why the fuck they stuck with the polish name for dandelion?

looking forward to the next seasons but 8 episodes seem way too few.
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December 28th, 2019, 14:06
Originally Posted by vurt View Post
I also don't get why people watch an entire first season of a show they claim is mediocre from the first episode.. Doesn't seem like a fun time. I think The Witcher is slightly above mediocre, i'm still giving it a skip for now, there are way better things to do. If i hear S2 is phenomenal then i'll invest the time.
Each to his own and all that though.. just seems odd.
I watched it because I'm a Star Wars fan. However, not all of us are able to ignore bad writing and implausible actions.
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December 28th, 2019, 14:54
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
I watched it because I'm a Star Wars fan. However, not all of us are able to ignore bad writing and implausible actions.
Yup, implausible actions, bad writing, make me cringe. Big turn off. No matter how big the fantasy, the human reaction, emotion, reasoning, has to be realistic.
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December 28th, 2019, 15:19
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Spoiler
Didn't watch, couldn't resist to open… Cynicism detected.

1. Does look silly what you wrote, but who programmed the droid? Rockstar? Bethesda? Ubisoft? One of those probably. I'd laugh on that scene too, obviously for the opposite incapable2make proper and optimized AI videogame designers appear in the star wars show reason.

2. For all I know all survived Mandalorians are strict zealots in selfexile who couldn't accept abandoning the outdated creed on the original planet (?) so they left, accepted ignorance and work for coin without ethics. Not being home is the reason they survived.
So pardon me but not hearing about everything in the universe, or to be precise, not caring about anything except bounties doesn't strike as an oddity, in fact I'd be more surprised if they did hear about something that wasn't related to bounty collecting.

Sadly you didn't detail what's wrong with boat(?), but I bet I'd have an opposite reaction just as with Prey.
Also sadly, I have other plans before this show, but will go for it soon. Maybe you're right and it's cringeworthy, but can't be sure as there was that Arkane fail that prevents me to believe you 100%.
Originally Posted by Eye View Post
Yup, implausible actions, bad writing, make me cringe. Big turn off. No matter how big the fantasy, the human reaction, emotion, reasoning, has to be realistic.
I kinda disagree when it comes to scifi with nonhumans. Even with humans only anything rotten can be realistic:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Sentinel_Island
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
I watched it because I'm a Star Wars fan.
After Jar Jar movie and decision to declare Ewoks movies as non canon I stopped to be. Sorry.
Originally Posted by porcozaur View Post
The major negative thing for me was the music or the lack more like it, they should have just get it from witcher 3 or hire that band. Ah, and why the fuck they stuck with the polish name for dandelion?
They used polish names for everything (vukodlak instead of werewolf) so I have no problem with that.
Instead of with names, I do have a problem with what's supposed to be a cheerful, playful, borderline immature and very young lass with crush on Geralt. That in the show is not Triss.
Same goes for Coral. Instead of deadly mistress of doom they put a friendlylooking "granny". Whatta joke.

I also didn't like the music choice. Pop in a fantasy show? Camp by a fire, put out guitar, excuse me, a lute, and what, sing "Have You Ever Seen The Rain"? WTF?
Not saying the main score sucks, it's a great campfire song, but feels incompatible. Noted this with covers in the other thread.

A question for female watchers. Does Dandelion presentation in the show really strike you as a guy every other woman would fall for? Or I'm asking the wrong question and (lack of) handsomeness is irrelevant but all is pheromones related?
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December 28th, 2019, 15:20
I see it pretty much as a comic book, it's over the top and the writing is lazy sometimes, like so much else in the genre. I guess it depends on what kind of series you expect.

The characters i found way more likable than in e.g Witcher (3 episodes in). Overall the SW community is overjoyed with the series. I've only seen people disliking one or two episodes, which i can agree with.
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December 29th, 2019, 17:17
Mandalorian very-much-not-for-me/10

I tried my best to give Mandalorian a shot, and I managed to get through 3.5 episodes before giving it up.

I consider it even weaker than Rise of Skywalker - which is saying something.

Utterly, utterly devoid of originality and purpose - at least as far as I could tell. I guess if you enjoy superficial jokes and absurdly implausible action sequences - and nothing else - then it's entertaining.

For an 8-episode piece with 30 minute episodes, I find it completely inexcusable to spend half of it on zero character or plot development.

The amount of praise it is getting is mindboggling to me. If this is what people truly want from Star Wars - I count myself out.

The Witcher 7/10

Now, here's a surprise. This was much, much better than I anticipated. I was dead wrong about it in several ways.

Now, I'm not a big fan of Cavill as Geralt, but I have to concede he does a good job here. I don't think he's "great" as some people seem to think, but he's more than adequate.

I've only read Last Wish - so my image of the characters are almost entirely based on the three Witcher games.

Cavill is quite a bit too bulky to represent a superhuman agile fighter. It seems to me that it's vital that Geralt be lean rather than big, and while he's obviously meant to be muscular - I don't think the bodybuilder look is a good fit.

As for the rest of the characters, I like most of them - but none of them seem to truly fit my image of them.

Yennefer is not attractive enough, even though the actress is very pretty. But she's supposed to be out-of-this-world beautiful and she's not.

Triss is definitely NOT how I imagined her. Strange choice.

Ciri is pretty good, though - except the actress is at least 5 years too old.

Beyond that, for the negative - I really only have a single one and that's their approach to non-linear storytelling.

I mean, IIRC Last Wish was sort of the same way, but I think books are a different medium - and you have a lot more time to adjust and figure stuff out.

For the show, it was way, way too confusing - and I'm not a fan of non-chronological approaches in general. I very rarely see a good reason to go that way.

I guess they needed to introduce all the characters ASAP for some practical reasons, but I think it was detrimental.

That's it for the bad.

The rest was good to great. Pretty much all the actors are doing a great job with their characters - and I found the action sequences convincing and easy to follow.

Tons of great dramatic scenes as well, which is not always easy to pull off in the fantasy genre - especially not in this case, given the amount of magic and monster stuff. It can very easily turn cheesy and silly - but it doesn't.

I don't understand the ratings here. It's truly excellent for what it is.

Certainly miles ahead of GoT season 2-8, in my opinion.

I'm glad to have been so wrong about it.

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December 30th, 2019, 04:50
Originally Posted by joxer View Post
Done the Expanse season 4. Should have been a bit shorter IMO.
Halfway through and finding myself agreeing with Joxer /shudder. There's four different story arcs this season and I find myself only caring about one or two of them… whole lot of superfluous padding.
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December 30th, 2019, 05:05
Originally Posted by lostforever View Post
What makes you think the eye make up like that has anything to do with India?
…Bollywood. Pretty simple and correct conclusion. Sorry you couldn't figure it out. Bollywood actresses and actors too for that matter are known for wearing very heavy makeup. It's even a meme, though you may not know what those are either. If so, sorry again.

The girl doesn't need the 6 pounds of eye makeup to play Yennefer…
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December 30th, 2019, 05:35
I've seen three episodes of the Witcher now, and I'm liking it. Not perfect by any means, but I think I'll get through the rest of the series.
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December 30th, 2019, 09:47
I also finished Expanse. I find it decent overall, but the characters do nothing for me, which is highly unusual in a show that I enjoy. Amos is amusing but a little one-note for my tastes.

But the plot is interesting at least, though it can all be nullified quickly like so many shows with good premises and bad endings.

It’s also nice to see a sci fi show that takes reality into consideration when it comes to a cold vacuum and stuff like gravity.

Looks good and has potential, but damn I dislike so many of the characters. The next person who says BELTALOWDA in an awkwardly foreign accent really needs to fall into an active mansized blender.

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December 30th, 2019, 12:04
Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
The next person who says BELTALOWDA in an awkwardly foreign accent really needs to fall into an active mansized blender.
Interesting take. Especially considering the Belter language is probably one of the most realistic parts of the show. The accent and word evolution might sound foreign and strange to some, but anyone who's spent time in the deep south among listening to primarily Creole (which the language is based on) and Cajun individuals, will feel very much at home. Or maybe even Afrikaans.

Also, while I like the main characters, I am especially fond of Ashford and Drummer, who I think put on excellent performances for complex characters in their political surroundings.

I think my biggest complaint of the 4th season was making Avasarala swear with every breath. In the prior seasons, when she did so, it was a political tool she used to shock people into listening to her, and was to enforce a particular important plot point for the view. But in the 4th seasons they just make her sound like whining potty mouth.
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December 30th, 2019, 12:18
Originally Posted by Caddy View Post
Interesting take. Especially considering the Belter language is probably one of the most realistic parts of the show. The accent and word evolution might sound foreign and strange to some, but anyone who's spent time in the deep south among listening to primarily Creole (which the language is based on) and Cajun individuals, will feel very much at home. Or maybe even Afrikaans.
I appreciate their reasoning, but if you're going for realism in that way - you should probably not have everyone else - including 99% of Earth and Mars characters - speak with an American accent.

Earth actually has a few places beyond America - and I have to assume Mars wasn't colonized entirely by Americans.

Oh, I forgot - except for Draper, who was born on Mars but speaks with an incredibly thick Australian accent.

So, clearly, if you originate from Earth - you speak with an American accent no matter where you end up. I assume the human beings referred to as Belters originated from Earth as well.

Consistency is key here

Also, while I like the main characters, I am especially fond of Ashford and Drummer, who I think put on excellent performances for complex characters in their political surroundings.
Incidentally, they both represent the worst examples of how that accent interferes with their acting ability.

I spent half a season getting past Strathairn's awful line delivery - and I consider him a good actor.

As for Drummer, I'm not terribly fond of the ultra cliché super tough female - with the body of a small girl that might break apart if she took a bad fall. If you're going to hire an actress to portray a heroic authority figure like that, at least make her look like someone that commands respect.

At least Draper looks like someone with a bit of weight behind her.

I know, I'm not progressive enough to ignore the reality of how the human body is a part of physical prowess and how it factors into intimidation.

All I have is my brain and sense of reality

I think my biggest complaint of the 4th season was making Avasarala swear with every breath. In the prior seasons, when she did so, it was a political tool she used to shock people into listening to her, and was to enforce a particular important plot point for the view. But in the 4th seasons they just make her sound like whining potty mouth.
That's very true to her character in the books.

The reason it seems sudden is that America has this thing against swearing on TV (like nudity and other extremely natural human stuff) - but it doesn't apply at the new home of The Expanse.

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December 30th, 2019, 12:25
Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
I also finished Expanse. I find it decent overall, but the characters do nothing for me, which is highly unusual in a show that I enjoy.
Yup. I totally agree.
The only one that I find a bit more interesting is not Amos though but that older lady, the UN Deputy Undersecretary. But if the makers decide to let her die in one of the upcoming episodes, I could not care less - same goes for the other characters.
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December 30th, 2019, 12:29
Originally Posted by Eye View Post
Yup. I totally agree.
The only one that I find a bit more interesting is not Amos though but that older lady, the UN Deputy Undersecretary. But if the makers decide to let her die in one of the upcoming episodes, I could not care less - same goes for the other characters.
You just like her voice and her swearing, admit it

But I agree, Avasarala is one of the better characters. At least she makes me smile.

I actually liked Miller, too.

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December 30th, 2019, 12:34
Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
I appreciate their reasoning, but if you're going for realism in that way - you should probably not have everyone else - including 99% of Earth and Mars characters - speak with an American accent.

Earth actually has a few places beyond America - and I have to assume Mars wasn't colonized entirely by Americans.

Oh, I forgot - except for Draper, who was born on Mars but speaks with an incredibly thick Australian accent.

So, clearly, if you originate from Earth - you speak with an American accent no matter where you end up. I assume the human beings referred to as Belters originated from Earth as well.

Consistency is key here



Incidentally, they both represent the worst examples of how that accent interferes with their acting ability.

I spent half a season getting past Strathairn's awful line delivery - and I consider him a good actor.

As for Drummer, I'm not terribly fond of the ultra cliché super tough female - with the body of a small girl that might break apart if she took a bad fall. If you're going to hire an actress to portray a heroic authority figure like that, at least make her look like someone that commands respect.

At least Draper looks like someone with a bit of weight behind her.

I know, I'm not progressive enough to ignore the reality of how the human body is a part of physical prowess and how it factors into intimidation.

All I have is my brain and sense of reality



That's very true to her character in the books.

The reason it seems sudden is that America has this thing against swearing on TV (like nudity and other extremely natural human stuff) - but it doesn't apply at the new home of The Expanse.
Yup. Casting seemed weird to me, and the accents: yuck.
That old lady seemed to be wrongly casted too, was my initial thought watching the first episodes, though I was intrigued by her low voice. Now after having watched all episodes I think having Shohreh Aghdashloo as Chrisjen Avasarala makes more sense. She seems to be tough and sturdy, mentally.
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December 30th, 2019, 12:54
Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
Incidentally, they both represent the worst examples of how that accent interferes with their acting ability.

I spent half a season getting past Strathairn's awful line delivery - and I consider him a good actor.
Again, I think what's uncomfortable for some will feel natural for others. When he first opened his mouth, it felt like was back in the remote projects of Louisiana.

Before I lived in the US, if I got a call from a call centre, I would immediately know if they were from the US or not. Sometimes the accent seemed so forced and "unnatural" that it was tough to process that this was how they spoke for years. After living in the US, I don't feel that anymore. If I felt that for your "average" American accent, I can only imagine how uncomfortable it is listening to Creole or Afrikaans (Watching a few Die Antwoord videos where they have dialogue outside of their "music" will do the trick), or in this case, Belter.

Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
As for Drummer, I'm not terribly fond of the ultra cliché super tough female - with the body of a small girl that might break apart if she took a bad fall. If you're going to hire an actress to portray a heroic authority figure like that, at least make her look like someone that commands respect.

At least Draper looks like someone with a bit of weight behind her.

I know, I'm not progressive enough to ignore the reality of how the human body is a part of physical prowess and how it factors into intimidation.

All I have is my brain and sense of reality
Again, that's one of the more realistic parts. Weight isn't going to playing much of a factor when you're weightless. You're not going to be finding many muscled out women who spend most of their life in zero-g. In those situations you're looking more at bodymass to strength ratios (such as a gymnast or mountain climber).
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December 30th, 2019, 13:10
Originally Posted by Caddy View Post
Again, I think what's uncomfortable for some will feel natural for others. When he first opened his mouth, it felt like was back in the remote projects of Louisiana.
I don't think that was where you were supposed to feel like you were

Before I lived in the US, if I got a call from a call centre, I would immediately know if they were from the US or not. Sometimes the accent seemed so forced and "unnatural" that it was tough to process that this was how they spoke for years. After living in the US, I don't feel that anymore. If I felt that for your "average" American accent, I can only imagine how uncomfortable it is listening to Creole or Afrikaans (Watching a few Die Antwoord videos where they have dialogue outside of their "music" will do the trick), or in this case, Belter.
I'm not entirely sure what you're getting at here.

I don't know if you're aware of it, but I'm from Europe. I would like to claim that "being used" to a very wide variety of non-local accents is more or less part of being European - unless you're a hermit or something.

You must remember that, for non-American westerners, non-local languages and accents are what you're mostly exposed to when it comes to the media.

So, my problem with this super awkward Belter accent is not about the concept - it's the execution and the lack of consistency.

It feels off to me. As in, forced and very hard to pull off for the actors who all seem to have their own version of that accent - which is why I think they're having a harder time being compelling characters on-screen.

To me, that is.

Obviously, it's working for you - so that's good.

Again, that's one of the more realistic parts. Weight isn't going to playing much of a factor when you're weightless. You're not going to be finding many muscled out women who spend most of their life in zero-g. In those situations you're looking more at bodymass to strength ratios (such as a gymnast or mountain climber).
I'm not communicating this clearly enough, I suppose.

Again, it's about consistency. I understand that the Belters are supposed to have the physicality of someone living in Zero-G (or lower G) for large parts of their lives.

The show goes out of its way to demonstrate this - so it's kinda hard to miss.

Remember that episode where the love interest (sorry, I find her extremely forgettable) had to take injections constantly?

The problem, you see, is that at least half of them don't have that physicality at all. The casting is super inconsistent - and most of them DO NOT look physically frail in the slightest.

Anyway, even if they all had fragile bone density and what not - I'm pretty sure physicality would remain a factor when it comes to command authority and the ability to intimidate people.

In fact, I'm not just pretty sure - I'm very sure

It's very much a part of human instinct.

For that very same reason, I'm very sure you would be a little unnerved if you encountered a friendly bear in the woods - and you might not react the same way to a small puppy - no matter how aggressive it was.

It's that weird thing again, where weight and mass are factors to keep in mind for a potential confrontation.

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Anyway, I think we can conclude that we don't agree on how realistic and consistent this show is - and you obviously really like these aspects.

I think that's nice - and we don't have to agree.

To each his own.
Last edited by DArtFlash; December 30th, 2019 at 13:23.

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December 30th, 2019, 14:05
Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
I don't think that was where you were supposed to feel like you were
Maybe not, but the language created for the show was based on Creole so it's unavoidable

Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
I'm not entirely sure what you're getting at here.

I don't know if you're aware of it, but I'm from Europe. I would like to claim that "being used" to a very wide variety of non-local accents is more or less part of being European - unless you're a hermit or something.

You must remember that, for non-American westerners, non-local languages and accents are what you're mostly exposed to when it comes to the media.
What i'm getting at is it's probably a subconscious rejection of the particular inflections of the language. Listen to one engineer explain a process in a posh British accent, then make another engineer explain the detail exactly the same in a thick Texan accent, and decide which one sounds "smarter" or more "natural".

It's probably not much different in that respect, being Canadian in a very multicultural hub (and even more so when I grew up in Vancouver area). My parents are both European immigrants, so i'm quite familiar.

But again, I lived in different remote parts of the US for a number of years doing service work, so it's not about what's on TV for me.

Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
In fact, I'm not just pretty sure - I'm very sure

It's very much a part of human instinct.

For that very same reason, I'm very sure you would be a little unnerved if you encountered a bear in the woods - and you might not react the same way to a small puppy.
That sounds solid in theory, but i've had enough bear encounters to tell you I am much more intimidated by moose or mountain lion encounters.

Then again, i'm shorter than average. Everyone is bigger than me. You all just blend in.

Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
The problem, you see, is that at least half of them don't have that physicality at all. The casting is super inconsistent - and most of them DO NOT look physically frail in the slightest.
Ironically i'll quote Todd Howard here "We can do anything but we can't do everything."

Probably part of my problem is my own too. I often see people that I feel are burdened for wasting time on perfection, rather than just letting go and enjoying the moment.
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December 30th, 2019, 15:38
I fail to see how any accent matters in what's supposed to be a sci fi show about some future outside of this planet. It's not drama/history/war/biography to precisely mimic how martians talk. Assuming you heard martians talking. If you did, respect.

Originally Posted by DArtFlash View Post
You just like her voice and her swearing, admit it
Dunno about others but I do.
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