Coronavirus (No Politics)

The swelling has gone down after a day but the arm still hurts. Anyway according to the doctor those that already had co-vid have more severe reactions to the vaccines.

I seriously wonder what will be the outcome of these limited tested shots in the future. I'm no conspiracy theorist like SirJames but they were rushed to the market in one year.

On top of that we now have a new variant from India.

Link - https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...e-mutant-variant-in-india-what-does-that-mean

Ripper said:

Yes, I've been down that road before, and I've been keeping an eye on it. Luckily for me, it hasn't been total social isolation (or I might have been in real trouble), and I don't think we're into the realms of clinical depression. I would say it's highlighted for me just how important getting out and about in the world is to me, and when that need isn't met, it becomes apparent.

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You are not alone in that, mate. I'm lucky to have a wife and two kids. Without them I don't know how I would've survived this year, since I've always had depressive tendencies.

I'm a member of a computer building forum as well, and even among the nerdy, asocial IT-crowd there seems to be a lot of people longing to go back to work and meeting co-workers. Last year around this time most of them seemed happy to work from home, but not anymore. We are very social creatures, and even most of the ones who consider themselves introverted loners need quite a lot of social interaction to feel alright.

Couchpotato said:

The swelling has down after a day but the arm still hurts. Anyway according to the doctor those that already had co-vid 19 have more severe reactions to the vaccines.

I seriously wonder what will be the outcome these limited tested shots in the future. I'm no conspiracy theorist like SirJames but they were rushed to the market in one year.

On top of that we now have a new variant form India.

Link - https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...e-mutant-variant-in-india-what-does-that-mean

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Lol, I read your post before you edited it. I love the idea of someone being a conspiracy therapist

SveNitoR said:

Lol, I read your post before you edited it. I love the idea of someone being a conspiracy therapist

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Yeah sorry about that the arm and auto-correct and all that.

I read the reply and was like what the hell that's not what I wrote.:lol:

When the average FDA testing for drugs runs about a decade in length, yet these vaccines were pushed out in roughly under a year, you know there will be repercussions. One just has to hope the positive will outweigh any negatives.

SveNitoR said:

Lol, I read your post before you edited it. I love the idea of someone being a conspiracy therapist

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SirJames would need one (see the other Coronavirus thread). :lol:

Carnifex said:

When the average FDA testing for drugs runs about a decade in length, yet these vaccines were pushed out in roughly under a year, you know there will be repercussions. One just has to hope the positive will outweigh any negatives.

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There is a worry among a lot of people in Sweden, since they've hurried these vaccines. One of the MERS-vaccines a few (15 maybe?) years ago caused narcolepsy in a few hundred unlucky children and teenagers. It was a similar situation in that they hurried with getting a vaccine out.

A large problem for me is that I have such a low understanding of vaccines apart from the basics, so I have to trust the experts. Which is scary since they hurried the vaccines and can't possibly know of all long term side effects yet. It likely won't impact me or anyone I know, but the possibility of it hurting my kids (if they ever need a vaccine against Covid-19) scares me more than it usually does.

bkrueger said:

SirJames would need one (see the other Coronavirus thread).

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Lol, that's true.

SveNitoR said:

… One of the MERS-vaccines a few (15 maybe?) years ago caused narcolepsy in a few hundred unlucky children and teenagers. It was a similar situation in that they hurried with getting a vaccine out.
….

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If you allow me one small correction: That wasn't a MERS vaccine, but a swine-flu vaccine (2009). At the moment there are AFAIK no vaccines for MERS, although there are a few under development.

Regarding how rushed the vaccines are - yes, to some degree. But not as rushed as it may seem. Developing the vaccines took far less time than expected, that's partially due to new techniques, but probably also due to the enormous amount of resources spent. Testing periods were therefore not as short as one might suspect, and IMO we know enough to safely assume that the benefits (especially given the current pandemic situation) far outweigh the risks.

What we cannot know is of course possible late (after years) long term effects, but that applies to most vaccines (and a lot of other things).

an incarnation of pibbur who without doubt accepted his first shot this week and will accept number 2.

PS. Regarding facing uncertainties. I tend to (not always) follow the following principle: Is the risk lower than the risk of dying/killing someone driving a car? If so, it's less than the risk involved in doing somthing I regularly do without much worry. DS.

a pibbur said:

If you allow me one small correction: That wasn't a MERS vaccine, but a swine-flu vaccine (2009). At the moment there are AFAIK no vaccines for MERS, although there are a few under development.

Regarding how rushed the vaccines are - yes, to some degree. But not as rushed as it may seem. Developing the vaccines took far less time than expected, that's partially due to new techniques, but probably also due to the enormous amount of resources spent. Testing periods were therefore not as short as one might suspect, and IMO we know enough to safely assume that the benefits (especially given the current pandemic situation) far outweigh the risks.

What we cannot know is of course possible late (after years) long term effects, but that applies to most vaccines (and a lot of other things).

an incarnation of pibbur who without doubt accepted his first shot this week and will accept number 2.

PS. Regarding facing uncertainties. I tend to (not always) follow the following principle: Is the risk lower than the risk of dying/killing someone driving a car? If so, it's less than the risk involved in doing somthing I regularly do without much worry. DS.

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That was a very good answer, especially regarding the development of the new vaccines. Thanks!

Yeah, you are correct that it was swine flu and considering how many got the vaccine the risk was obviously very, very small.

For me as an adult the answer is simple (take as many vaccines as I can get), and I tend to do what seems logically and statistically to be a good choice. I tend to do so that with my kids as well, but this time the amount of fear is larger in society, I think. Or maybe it's just me that's more fearful than usual.

a pibbur said:

... but probably also due to the enormous amount of resources spent. Testing periods were therefore not as short as one might suspect, and IMO we know enough to safely assume that the benefits (especially given the current pandemic situation) far outweigh the risks...

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Yep. Telling a company that you'll pay them whether or not the vaccine works means they don't have to worry about sinking multi-millions into research that might not result in any return.

I finally got my second dose yesterday. (I'm still muttering about how our 'phase 3' that lets folks with asthma and other relevant disorders only lasted a week before Kansas just opened the whole thing up.) It's actually hitting me a bit. I just snoozed for a couple of hours and found I have a temp of 99.8F (37.66C)! COVID has also resulted in a bounty of vacation time, though, so no worries there.

First haircut since <insert every curse word> September is right around the corner!!

India is getting absolutely hammered now. They went from barely being on the Covid radar to being #2 behind the U.S. in total cases, and they look to be on track to pass the U.S. unless they can drasticaly slow the spread there. Brazil is also getting hit really bad.

I wonder if we'll ever really know the total number of cases in any nation? Lots of people got it and only had mild or even no symptoms at all. Now, with so many people getting immunized, I don't think you can really tell people who have had COVID then got vaccinated from people who just had the vaccine.

Yeah India is having a really rough go, now. Alberta, the province I formerly resided in when I lived in Canada, is also currently taking Covid on the chin. Sometimes those ultra-conservative mindsets can make for a difficult epidermis to pierce.

Zloth - you are right in a sense of what is practical on a national scale. There is a but. According to our govt site the test for antibodies depends on whether you have had a vaccine or not. It states that the non-vaccine test checks for different "anti-bodies" from those you get from a vaccine and vice versa. So no universal test.

The other thing is no test is perfect so if the anti-body count is low then you may get a false negative.

Currently the latest estimates suggest that in England up to 700,000 people had the virus in the last week or so. With deaths at 130,000 since the start of the crisis we can guess that perhaps 13 million people have had the virus though I don't know how we include young adults and children. So perhaps 20% of the adult population.

I think that most of those who could die have either died or been vaccinated (in the UK). So we are probably past the worse unless a mutant strain hits us which can happen but is thought not very likely if we continue to behave in a sensible manner.

India is getting hammered - news report and films of hospitals overflowing - terrible. That could of been the UK if we had not treated the threat of covid seriously.

My wife got her first dose yesterday. I'm still waiting for my chance, but hopefully before summer starts.

We want to visit relatives in Germany in July and it might require having been vaccinated before that.

I don't drive so getting a shot has been problematic for me, yet I think an outreach program might make that a non-concern in another week or two. At least that's my hope. Up to now I've just continued my decades-old habit of simply avoiding people, yet it only seems common sense to get the shots at some point, and I'm hopeful that it will happen later this month.

Carnifex said:

I don't drive so getting a shot has been problematic for me, yet I think an outreach program might make that a non-concern in another week or two. At least that's my hope. Up to now I've just continued my decades-old habit of simply avoiding people, yet it only seems common sense to get the shots at some point, and I'm hopeful that it will happen later this month.

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I think that's the rational approach. As a pibbur mentioned before, the trials of the vaccine weren't actually rushed, just compressed. Though the trials usually take years, much of that is dead time and bureaucracy. The same amount of data was gathered.

When a trial looks for long-term effects from a vaccine, they're talking about problems that arise in a few months, rather than immediate ill-effects. They don't deliberately wait for years to see if any issues crop up in the very long term. That's extremely rare, and wouldn't be shown up by the trial process itself.

Trials do continue after a medicine has been released to look out for such problems, but that's the same as the case now.

I had my first shot of Pfizer yesterday. It was very well organized, with almost no waiting time. Had a tingling feeling in my arm and jaw for the first hour or so and a sore arm for the rest of the day. Those are the only effects I encountered of the vaccine.

I got my first dose of Moderna Friday night. Felt okay yesterday, arm was sore but I wasn't too bad. But today, wow. I feel like HELL. My body is so achey and hurting, my arm is extremely sore but so is my back, my torso, my legs. I don't mean to complain or anything, God is still good, but I am definitely feeling it today. I heard only the 2nd shot has side effects, so I'm wondering what that ordeal is going to be like, if the 1st shot made me feel this way.

I also don't mean to dissuade anyone from getting the shot. Aches and pains will go away, getting COVID could kill u or someone u love. Get the vaccine, people, it's important for all of us. Peace and God bless. <3