Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Review @ Gamerant
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FurtiveNyctophile
Sentinel
For me, the only negatives in this game are the bugs. The sprawling, existing world that I already find interesting and a complex character building system are what I *love* about Pathfinder/3.5's and Golarion as a setting. It's like the Forgotten Realms, if you're into that setting you can get really, really into it and just enveloped by the lore unlike anything else. Or the world of The Witcher, because it comes from pretty decent fantasy books that happened to be made into a game.
Not always saying a great setting makes for great games (looking at, say, Game of Thrones here... the best game that franchise got me was one with a cool scent-sniffing mechanic for wolves) - but it never hurts in my book. On the other hand, a setting I don't like - for example, anything superhero/Marvel/DC based - is instantly off-putting to me no matter how good the game or show might be. I'm just not interested in the superhero genre.
So I get how it could go either way. Still, let us tabletop nerds have our living, breathing versions of tabletop games play out. We've been dreaming of this for decades now starting with SSI Gold Box stuff!
Not always saying a great setting makes for great games (looking at, say, Game of Thrones here... the best game that franchise got me was one with a cool scent-sniffing mechanic for wolves) - but it never hurts in my book. On the other hand, a setting I don't like - for example, anything superhero/Marvel/DC based - is instantly off-putting to me no matter how good the game or show might be. I'm just not interested in the superhero genre.
So I get how it could go either way. Still, let us tabletop nerds have our living, breathing versions of tabletop games play out. We've been dreaming of this for decades now starting with SSI Gold Box stuff!
I'm not fond of the level design and it was the same mixed bag in Kingmaker too. Crusade management looks too much like Kingdom management, without the bugs but with the same awkwardness, i.e. separate screen with long loading unaccessible in many occasions and tasks that can either be done as crusade cards or in game.
The overall experience is not polished enough. Hidden stat checks and unclear quest markers (mostly wrong) add to the mess.
The overall experience is not polished enough. Hidden stat checks and unclear quest markers (mostly wrong) add to the mess.
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Crusade management is copypasted from the first game (region menu that is useless is an obvious example). HoMM/KB minigame was only added to it.
It's not without bugs, in fact there are many in that part of the game - only you won't care as none of them is critical.
It's not without bugs, in fact there are many in that part of the game - only you won't care as none of them is critical.
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Then it has changed a lot since EA. Last time I saw it in WotR, the kingdom management was really simplified in comparison, and they had removed the timed events that could cost a lot to the kingdom and ultimately fail the compaign. They had also added the crusade armies, decisions to make in order to upgrade them, enemy armies. The advisors were working completely differently than in Kingmaker.
Have they really scratched all that and done a copy-paste from Kingmaker?
Have they really scratched all that and done a copy-paste from Kingmaker?
Gamers hoping for a less intense, less mentally demanding, more polished RPG experience would be better off looking elsewhere.
Lol! I like how they say "If you are stupid, look for another game."
Lol! I like how they say "If you are stupid, look for another game."
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No, wait.
Menus, building part and UI are copypasted.
Advisors are not cards any more, you get a nice lil' chatty about options on every council levelup rank.
Each department has a bureaucratic advisor enforced by the queen and some of companions. In case you are soloing the game or kill companions, you won't see companions suggestions nor will be able to unlock benefits they suggest. For example, want the best archer? Don't kill Regill. Want the best cavalry? Don't kill Greybor. Etc.
Note that it's not the same for all myth clases, on lich path you are supposed to kill some advisors.
There is no failing the campaign because management.
Instead of that there is failing the management because campaign choices. In such case it's not permanent, you can always rebuild everything.
There is a rare loop case where you lost all armies and Drezen is under siege by a demon army bigger than your weekly recruits - in such case just don't recruit anyone for weeks till the number of available recruits is enough to win.
But it's the truth.
One needs some brains for this game. Not much, it's not ment only for Einstein.
It's just not possible to move forward with both eyes closed like candy crush saga.
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purpleblob
Princess
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What do you mean army management screen is unaccessible? It can be accessed via both citadel table or in the world map - certainly a lot more accessible than Kingmaker kingdom management.
Personally, I found it a lot more enjoyable than kingdom management. There are now only 4 stats to manage and advisors actually have good arguements. Also, no more DC cards and you can see impact of your choices before making decisions (except the ones that still have <null> tags :/)
My issue with army management is how unbalanced and bloated the army combats are - chap2&3 were ok enough but I was pulling my hair out in chap5 until my mage general learnt an ability which wipes out whole entire army at the start. So freaking unbalanced.
Nah its certainly different to kingdom managment.
See my response above and also joxer's
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I have to disagree.
This is ch3 army:
Double your army unit numbers and you still can't win it.
You can't kill succubi pack in one turn, and if you start hitting them (you should so they don't charm anyone) the enemy horsemen destroy your clerics while opponent archers halve the rest of your army.
I mean, you can't unless…
Unless you have a second general with stun ability .
I wrote a few times to grab elf girl as a second general and level her up a few times on easy to win demon armies.
I will write more details about this in a separate thread. Soon. Can't now, I'm too lazy or something...
I wrote a few times to grab elf girl as a second general and level her up a few times on easy to win demon armies.
I will write more details about this in a separate thread. Soon. Can't now, I'm too lazy or something...
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purpleblob
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I have to disagree.
This is ch3 army:
Double your army unit numbers and you still can't win it.
You can't kill succubi pack in one turn, and if you start hitting them (you should so they don't charm anyone) the enemy horsemen destroy your clerics while opponent archers halve the rest of your army.
I mean, you can't unless…
Unless you have a second general with stun ability .
I wrote a few times to grab elf girl as a second general and level her up a few times on easy to win demon armies.
I will write more details about this in a separate thread. Soon. Can't now, I'm too lazy or something…
I disagree, I had a lot less units in my army and still won most of the battles in chap 3 (not easily but usually in 1 attempt). No, I didn't have mage general, it was with shield general.
I don't want to go into a long arguement tho because we likely have different units, hence, different experience.
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Yes we have almost all different units. The cavalry up there is the one unlocked by Greybor.
Beside that, I refused to have a single evil unit in my army.
Not sure what I'll do on the replay though as by default you can buy only one evil unit type before ch5...
Beside that, I refused to have a single evil unit in my army.
Not sure what I'll do on the replay though as by default you can buy only one evil unit type before ch5...
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TheSHEEEP
Keeper of the Watch
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I beat that fight with an almost identical army.I have to disagree.
This is ch3 army:
Double your army unit numbers and you still can't win it.
You can't kill succubi pack in one turn, and if you start hitting them (you should so they don't charm anyone) the enemy horsemen destroy your clerics while opponent archers halve the rest of your army.
I mean, you can't unless…
Unless you have a second general with stun ability .
I wrote a few times to grab elf girl as a second general and level her up a few times on easy to win demon armies.
I will write more details about this in a separate thread. Soon. Can't now, I'm too lazy or something…
Those marksmen should be more than enough to kill the succubi on turn 1. Reload until you get high morale 2nd shot if you have to. But really, all of those ranged units firing on turn 1 are enough to kill the succubi - I had even less than those and did it.
Their cavalry will always attack the same target, so cast shield or some other +AC ability on that.
The rest should be rather simple then.
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My current problem with my army is that I just don't get the option on general level up to select the feeat increasing my army size. So I have just 3 stacks since the beginning.
Are the selectable feats chosen randomly?
Are the selectable feats chosen randomly?
N
Nereida
Guest
There are a lot of things I would change about WotR, bugs aside (which is a big deal to start with when at some point it was preventing about half the mythic paths from being able to complete the game at all)
For example, the last half of the game feels like a Korean mmo with constant trash encounters that add nothing but artificially extending the length of the game. I had the hardest time crawling through it, and only sheer willpower (and Dimension Door) got me to the finish line.
Quest design is bloated and bland in general.
Memory leakages and loading times for even the tiniest of transitions, adding up to horrendous stuttering even in high powered machines.
Copy/pasted HoMM I wouldn't mind in general, if there was any effort put into it.
Realm management would be best as an optional feature.
Writing/companions, the story could have been more original, the companion cast could have been better. It also could have been worse, but this game was aiming for excelence, so a "it was decent" isn't that much of a great thing to say about it.
All in all, it's a very good game, that drags on too long for its own good, and does bring a well-needed breath of nostalgia to the scene, which I personally welcome and found entertaining for the most part.
For example, the last half of the game feels like a Korean mmo with constant trash encounters that add nothing but artificially extending the length of the game. I had the hardest time crawling through it, and only sheer willpower (and Dimension Door) got me to the finish line.
Quest design is bloated and bland in general.
Memory leakages and loading times for even the tiniest of transitions, adding up to horrendous stuttering even in high powered machines.
Copy/pasted HoMM I wouldn't mind in general, if there was any effort put into it.
Realm management would be best as an optional feature.
Writing/companions, the story could have been more original, the companion cast could have been better. It also could have been worse, but this game was aiming for excelence, so a "it was decent" isn't that much of a great thing to say about it.
All in all, it's a very good game, that drags on too long for its own good, and does bring a well-needed breath of nostalgia to the scene, which I personally welcome and found entertaining for the most part.
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Ripper
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I wonder if we could badger them into giving us the option to truly turn off realm management. That stuff is a complete drag, for me, and I'd be very pleased if I could avoid it when get to the game.
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Andrew23
Keeper of the Watch
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After 120 hours I barely scratched few quests after Drezen. It seems substantial amount of gameplay is still before me and thats great. Pathfinder is what Ive been waiting for since BG games. Which accounts for both Kingmaker and WotR.
Im sure some people will say its old-fashioned, some will say bugs are unbearable, some will consider it too long, etc. No game will ever be made without objective flaws.
Pathfinder might not be perfect, it might be even full of bugs, but I dont care, because Im having tons of fun with it.
Im sure some people will say its old-fashioned, some will say bugs are unbearable, some will consider it too long, etc. No game will ever be made without objective flaws.
Pathfinder might not be perfect, it might be even full of bugs, but I dont care, because Im having tons of fun with it.
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The option exists, but I think there are side-effects that are not solved yet.
(known issues thread)
There are probably other serious issues too.
Have you tried to switch the crusade system to its easiest difficulty setting? I'm tempted to do so for this 1st run. I didn't dare turn it off.
Exactly. There is simply no other recent game in that genre, Owlcat's games fill that gap with two very audacious and successful games. There are issues and downsides, but they're not significant for me in comparison to the many qualities.
Ripper
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Thanks. I won't be touching it for a while yet. A buggy experience is pretty much the death knell for a game, in my case. I get irritated, put it back in the backlog, and then don't have the same incentive to explore something new. This often condemns the game to languishing in backlog limbo, in perpetuity.
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I'm reminded of Kingdom Come Deliverance and how every new patch released broke something else in the game. Seem the more complicated your game is, the higher chance it happens, and Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous fits the bill as well.
Heck even CDPR has talked about how complicated it is to patch Cyberpunk 2077.
Heck even CDPR has talked about how complicated it is to patch Cyberpunk 2077.
Andrew23
Keeper of the Watch
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Regarding kingdom (or crusade) management - I didnt slightly expect, I would like this gameplay aspect, before Kingmaker was released (which was one of main reasons, why I didnt support it on Kickstarter).
But I have to say, that after I put some time into Kingmaker, I started to like it in a way. It is rather easy and shallow minigame, but it is related and intertwined with what is happening during the party adventure. It somehow contemplates it in my mind and if I stop to struggle to succeed in it in 100%, it becomes very casual and lots of pressure disappears. I suggest open-minded approach and do not attempt to succeed all the time. I already shared this view when Kingmaker was released, but I believe its relevant also in case of WotR as the management is similar in scope.
But I have to say, that after I put some time into Kingmaker, I started to like it in a way. It is rather easy and shallow minigame, but it is related and intertwined with what is happening during the party adventure. It somehow contemplates it in my mind and if I stop to struggle to succeed in it in 100%, it becomes very casual and lots of pressure disappears. I suggest open-minded approach and do not attempt to succeed all the time. I already shared this view when Kingmaker was released, but I believe its relevant also in case of WotR as the management is similar in scope.
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