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December 3rd, 2018, 23:32
Originally Posted by Darth Tagnan View Post
But the 10/10 ratings are as ridiculous as the 2/10 ratings are for FO76.

I don't know why people absolutely must exaggerate on this scale - but there it is.
It'd an odd mentality. For many people, there seem to only be two options, a 0 or a 10. Or at least, that's the scale they work off of. Not often do people place something in the middle. A quick look at FO76's user score reflect this (though many of those user reviews are new accounts attempting to bomb the game intentionally, whether it's rational or not).

For this reason, I like to read reviews that don't boil down to a number. I think it incentivizes people to to essentially skim over the review and go straight for the rating. It gives them a reason to discard everything in an article, or at least not pay much attention to it.

I do hope that one of the things they consider when designing Cyberpunk are these archaic design choices, and hope they steer very clear from them.
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December 3rd, 2018, 23:35
The hyperbole surrounding RDR2 shouldn't come as a surprise. RDR1 suffered from the same exaggerated hype. A lot of people acted like it was some kind of great revolution in gaming when in reality it's just a GTA clone in a cool setting.

It's good to hear CDPR has set aside extra time dedicated to playtesting. When you look at the release state of some recent games, it's obvious that more companies need to do that.
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December 3rd, 2018, 23:39
Originally Posted by Ragnaris View Post
I do hope that one of the things they consider when designing Cyberpunk are these archaic design choices, and hope they steer very clear from them.
I wouldn't worry too much.

I'm not the biggest fan of CDPR when it comes to game design and mechanics, but I do hold them in higher regard than Rockstar.

I remember Rockstar all the way back from when they were called DMA design and made Amiga games.

They were always about the spectacle and about being "cool" - and that hasn't really changed.

Now, there's no doubt that they were on to something really special with GTA 3 on PS2 - making such an established formula work in a 3D world was really something.

But, ever since then, their "progress" has been about budget and production values - and much less in terms of game design.

I expect Cyberpunk to be better - but I'm not at all convinced it will be a significant step up from Witcher 3, which I consider to be a pretty bland gameplay experience (story/presentation was top notch though!).

But, time will tell.

My point is more about the low-hanging fruit when it comes to marketing. Their recent claim about how making "high quality games" is how to sell is a little too conceited for my tastes.

I think they need an ego check. Sooner would be better than later.

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December 17th, 2018, 00:47
Thanks go to @Silver for finding this one.

Gamingbolt interviewed level designer Miles Tost about Cyberpunk 2077
It wouldn’t be an exaggeration say that CD Projekt RED’s Cyberpunk 2077 is one of the most highly anticipated upcoming video games. We’ve known about its existence for several years, but it’s re-reveal at E3 2018, followed by a 50 minute long gameplay demo that was shown to the entire world, have led to a resurgence in anticipation for the title. Given the developer’s pedigree with The Witcher, and their ambitions for Cyberpunk 2077 itself, that anticipation looks perfectly reasonable. Recently, we sent across some questions about the upcoming RPG to CD Projekt RED’s level designer Miles Tost. We talked about everything from its demo, to the freedom of choice the game offers in terms of gameplay, to what players can expect from side quests in the title, and much, much more. Read on below.
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December 17th, 2018, 23:06
Lol.

CDPR says: "We want to release our game in a very polished state"

The Butthurt: Nooooooooo!

This game will cause rivers of tears.
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December 19th, 2018, 18:28
This game will be a buggy mess upon release but will still be freaking good.
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December 20th, 2018, 20:17
Originally Posted by BoboTheMighty View Post
Lol.

CDPR says: "We want to release our game in a very polished state"

The Butthurt: Nooooooooo!

This game will cause rivers of tears.
Maybe they meant "in a very polish state"?.

I'm not going to give up on this pun!
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December 23rd, 2018, 19:03
I think they mean as streamlined and "for the masses" as RDR2

The corporation has taken a firm hold of those developers. As well as the games-as-movies fans of CDPR.

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December 23rd, 2018, 20:40
Originally Posted by BoboTheMighty View Post
CDPR says: "We want to release our game in a very polished state"

The Butthurt: Nooooooooo!

This game will cause rivers of tears.
It seems like that's already coming to pass.
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December 23rd, 2018, 20:56
Originally Posted by Darth Tagnan View Post
As well as the games-as-movies fans of CDPR.
Sorry. Actual dinosaurs went extinct. I'm waiting Nintendo's ones follow.
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December 23rd, 2018, 21:04
Originally Posted by joxer View Post
Sorry. Actual dinosaurs went extinct. I'm waiting Nintendo's ones follow.
Nah, it's the new age of endless identical Marvel movie fans - who also appreciate games playing themselves while they click dialogue options

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December 23rd, 2018, 22:45
Having flashbacks to the various cut-scene debates.

Anyway I have no problem with cut-scene's with dialogue choices so meh.

Seriously can't see why this bothers RPG players but whatever.
Characters suddenly become unplayable as the player becomes aware of new pieces of information. Armed with that knowledge, she embarks on the next quest or level and gets right back into the action.

At first glance, this completely makes sense. After all, if games want to tell a story they need to have some type of narrative anchor, and cut-scenes are a great way to do that.

Since the mid 1990s, games have used pieces of cinematic animation to bridge levels and create motivation to drive the story forward, which demonstrates that the industry clearly wants to tell stories. Ever since the plot moved on from “the princess is in another castle,” games have wanted to create new forms of narrative that drive the player forward.

Cut-scenes can provide a default way of showing the personality of a character, which can be a particularly fickle trait in something as subjective as gaming. They provide a canon, stability, and a solid story arc in a game filled with thousands of options for each player.
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December 23rd, 2018, 22:49
Originally Posted by Couchpotato View Post
Having flashbacks to the various cut-scene debates.

Anyway I have no problem with cut-scene's with dialogue choices so meh.

Seriously can't see why this bothers RPG players but whatever.
Bothers? I think it's great that there are games for everyone.

Some people like games that are challenging, with intricate mechanics - and some players like interactive movies where they don't have to engage with annoying gameplay that gets in the way.

Like I said, it's the same with movies. These days, the biggest hits aren't about the script, the acting, the characters or the plot - it's about the spectacle and the CGI.

I think that's cool. I have other games and I have indie movies with interesting scripts.

As for Cyberpunk - anything can happen. But everything I've seen and heard - so far - has been about hyperbole and appealing to as many people as possible.

From experience, that tends to mean a very low barrier of entry.

Maybe I'm wrong - but I very much doubt it.

RDR2 is no different. It's based on ancient and archaic game design from the 80s and 90s. It's incredibly well produced, though - and if you look at the response from both critics and users alike - that's what matters.

Marketing and production values = popularity.

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December 23rd, 2018, 22:53
Originally Posted by Couchpotato View Post
Having flashbacks to the various cut-scene debates.

Anyway I have no problem with cut-scene's with dialogue choices so meh.

Seriously can't see why this bothers RPG players but whatever.
The cut-scene debates are pretty funny. The best part is when you have people claiming CDPR's games have too many while defending Bioware games that have just as many if not more.
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December 23rd, 2018, 23:05
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
The cut-scene debates are pretty funny. The best part is when you have people claiming CDPR's games have too many while defending Bioware games that have just as many if not more.
So true BioWare perfected the whole interactive cut-scene trend in RPG's.
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December 23rd, 2018, 23:14
I'm not the biggest fan of Bioware games when it comes to writing - but I'd say most of their games are much better balanced in terms of mixing up interesting gameplay with dialogue sequences.

That said, Witcher and Witcher 2 both had less focus on dialogue than Witcher 3.

For Cyberpunk, my assumption is that it will follow the Witcher 3 formula - given its success.

I don't actually know if that's the case, but that would be my assumption.

Since I found Witcher 3 gameplay entirely forgettable and weak-sauce - I have to focus on the dialogue cutscenes - which would seem to be the primary appeal of Witcher 3. For both fans and non-fans alike.

To me, certainly, the game was saturated with endless dialogue sequences. The only reason I could stomach that kind of "gameplay" was that the writing was excellent from start to finish.

But, again, to each his own.

I imagine people who enjoy just going through the motions - or people who felt challenged by the gameplay - would have a different experience.

To me, that's cool. There's no way I can argue against that.

All I can say is that I had a different experience.

But I still enjoyed Witcher 3 - and I expect to enjoy Cyberpunk.

But I find the base assumption that it's going to be this gaming revolution laughable - and utterly counter to my experience with Witcher.

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December 23rd, 2018, 23:36
I haven't seen a decent combination of interesting gameplay and dialogue in a Bioware game for a very long time.

I'd have to go all the way back to DA:O to find what was, in my opinion, a good balance of those things. ME: Andromeda certainly didn't have it, nor did DA:I from what I played.

Some seem to still really like modern Bioware though, and I'm genuinely glad there are people out there who do. Part of me still holds on to the hope that they'll start making the kind of games I really enjoy again one day, even though I know there's almost zero chance of that happening.
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December 23rd, 2018, 23:37
Can't really disagree but hey I want Cyberpunk 2077 to be an improved version of Witcher III. That game won so many GOTY awards so they don't have to revolutionize.

Just improve the formula and fans will buy it. Just don't be like Bethesda and get complacent, or they will sooner or later develop a game like Fallout 76.
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December 23rd, 2018, 23:38
Well, there's no denying that modern Bioware games are weaker than they used to be.

Personally, however, I quite enjoyed both Inquisition and Andromeda. Certainly much, much more than Witcher 3 - in terms of gameplay.

That said, Witcher 3 destroys all Bioware games when it comes to story and writing - and that includes my favorite ones, like KotOR and Dragon Age.

But I was always a gameplay over story guy.

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December 23rd, 2018, 23:40
Originally Posted by Couchpotato View Post
Can't real disagree but hey I want Cyberpunk 2077 to be an improved version of Witcher III. That game won so many GOTY awards so they don't have to revolutionize.
I'm almost certain it will be, so no worries there.

Just improve the formula and fans will buy it. Just don't be like Bethesda and get complacent, or they will sooner or later develop a game like Fallout 76.
They'll probably never understand open world gameplay like Bethsoft, so no worries there either

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