Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Review @ Ye Old Entertainment - Page 2 - RPGWatch Forums
|
Your donations keep RPGWatch running!
RPGWatch Forums » Comments » News Comments » Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Review @ Ye Old Entertainment

Default Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Review @ Ye Old Entertainment

April 13th, 2022, 21:42
@Andrew I have the same curse I get 3/4 through and then burn out or wander off to another game or book or ….. well I'm sure you get the idea.
Terry is offline

Terry

Terry's Avatar
Sentinel

#21

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vegreville, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 478
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)

Default 

April 15th, 2022, 05:03
Originally Posted by Redglyph View Post
He's probably trying to compete with NeverKnowsBest to see who'll get the longest review
The difference is that his reviews are not good, especially when compared to NeverKnowsBest.
gabrielarantest is offline

gabrielarantest

gabrielarantest's Avatar
Stubborn Dwarf

#22

Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 393
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)

Default 

April 15th, 2022, 10:05
Originally Posted by gabrielarantest View Post
The difference is that his reviews are not good, especially when compared to NeverKnowsBest.
I agree with you. I preferred his earlier reviews; they were fun to watch and gave a good impression of the game. They were shorter too, just the right length for what they brought.

Lately his reviews have become a long buffoonery, sadly, and the critic part less objective. I hope he'll get back to his good old self again.

In comparison, NeverKnowsBest makes a good use of his time with analysis, not silly jokes and clips. They're a bit long though, I don't watch them all, and by episodes.
Redglyph is offline

Redglyph

Redglyph's Avatar
SasqWatch

#23

Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Good old Europe
Posts: 5,090
Mentioned: 92 Post(s)

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 04:14
I found this review pretty on point. He knows his stuff.
Silver is offline

Silver

Silver's Avatar
Spaceman
RPGWatch Team

#24

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 9,074
Mentioned: 82 Post(s)

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 10:59
Originally Posted by Silver View Post
I found this review pretty on point. He knows his stuff.
He generally does but I'm surprised by some reproaches. For example the character build that he claims doesn't allow him to see the result.

A player never really knows with 100% what the game will be, that's the point and the pleasure of discovering. The purpose is not to follow a blueprint to the letter and build something without any spark of creativity, like he would have us believe with his comparison. When I played with similar toys, I quickly made designs of my own to learn and discover, that's what toys and games are for.

Sure, one needs some understanding of how it works first, but there's more than enough in Pathfinder. The UI presentation is crystal-clear, you can see the class evolution and plan for your build since the start. And most of the information is available in-game, with tooltips and the encyclopedia. Then there are ample interactive tutorials. I can't imagine how they could have improved it further.

The game is often criticized for having a steep learning curve, this is mainly due to the ruleset. It's true that it's not for everyone, but blaming the game and saying it's not clear is very subjective. He should at least make it plain or take a more mature approach about it.

It was better handled in other of his videos. He usually says it's bad or good but he hates or loves it, and elaborates a bit on both sides.
Redglyph is offline

Redglyph

Redglyph's Avatar
SasqWatch

#25

Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Good old Europe
Posts: 5,090
Mentioned: 92 Post(s)

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 12:00
Originally Posted by Redglyph View Post
He generally does but I'm surprised by some reproaches. For example the character build that he claims doesn't allow him to see the result.

A player never really knows with 100% what the game will be, that's the point and the pleasure of discovering. The purpose is not to follow a blueprint to the letter and build something without any spark of creativity, like he would have us believe with his comparison. When I played with similar toys, I quickly made designs of my own to learn and discover, that's what toys and games are for.

Sure, one needs some understanding of how it works first, but there's more than enough in Pathfinder. The UI presentation is crystal-clear, you can see the class evolution and plan for your build since the start. And most of the information is available in-game, with tooltips and the encyclopedia. Then there are ample interactive tutorials. I can't imagine how they could have improved it further.

The game is often criticized for having a steep learning curve, this is mainly due to the ruleset. It's true that it's not for everyone, but blaming the game and saying it's not clear is very subjective. He should at least make it plain or take a more mature approach about it.

It was better handled in other of his videos. He usually says it's bad or good but he hates or loves it, and elaborates a bit on both sides.
So basically you didn't like his humour and didn't have an issue with the complexity yourself. He seems to have played plenty of these games so I wouldn't necessarily say his take is subjective although players experiences with games can be apples to oranges because we value different things. He is able to contrast and compare to plenty of other games in the genre, which he does.
Silver is offline

Silver

Silver's Avatar
Spaceman
RPGWatch Team

#26

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 9,074
Mentioned: 82 Post(s)

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 12:44
Originally Posted by Silver View Post
So basically you didn't like his humour and didn't have an issue with the complexity yourself. He seems to have played plenty of these games so I wouldn't necessarily say his take is subjective although players experiences with games can be apples to oranges because we value different things. He is able to contrast and compare to plenty of other games in the genre, which he does.
I never said that. Merely that, while his humour generally makes me laugh, he tends to pour more and more of it every time. Just look at how long it takes to get to the subject.

I never said I didn't have an issue with complexity myself either, just that I'm surprised at his take on the lack of clarity.

The fact he's played many of those games like many of us has nothing to do with being subjective or not. Statements like "a game that challenges your tactical skills should be easily to learn and hard to master" is subjective, it's his view of a tactical game. Other people prefer something deeper, and he admits it himself, but the single sentence is lost in a 1h20 video that present that as a flaw.

He's also obsessed to get the perfect build to face any situation, which is not at all what those games are about, just how he wants to play it. Then he blames the game for not making it clear and easy, which I've already shown was incorrect. It's meant to be too complex, there's objectively nothing wrong with not mastering everything and unexpected outcomes.
Redglyph is offline

Redglyph

Redglyph's Avatar
SasqWatch

#27

Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Good old Europe
Posts: 5,090
Mentioned: 92 Post(s)

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 12:56
Originally Posted by Redglyph View Post
I never said that. Merely that, while his humour generally makes me laugh, he tends to pour more and more of it every time. Just look at how long it takes to get to the subject.

I never said I didn't have an issue with complexity myself either, just that I'm surprised at his take on the lack of clarity.

The fact he's played many of those games like many of us has nothing to do with being subjective or not. Statements like "a game that challenges your tactical skills should be easily to learn and hard to master" is subjective, it's his view of a tactical game. Other people prefer something deeper, and he admits it himself, but the single sentence is lost in a 1h20 video that present that as a flaw.

He's also obsessed to get the perfect build to face any situation, which is not at all what those games are about, just how he wants to play it. Then he blames the game for not making it clear and easy, which I've already shown was incorrect. It's meant to be too complex, there's objectively nothing wrong with not mastering everything and unexpected outcomes.
So your issue with the humour is there is too much of it? What I got from the tactics angle was that many combats were trash mobs with little monster variety. The rock, paper, scissors appears to require correct prebuffing which he thinks is not very interesting sometimes. Itemisation he thinks is very good but it is also very easy to muck up your build which is honestly true for lots of rpgs.

As for making things clear he says that the game is like racing a car with a instrument panel of an aircraft. Meaning its appears complicated but you can get by with tank and spank most of the time. I get the average gamer getting confused why he needs fortitude to make a save as compared to having iron skin etc but that would be hard to communicate for any game based on tabletop.
Silver is offline

Silver

Silver's Avatar
Spaceman
RPGWatch Team

#28

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 9,074
Mentioned: 82 Post(s)
+1:

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 13:28
Originally Posted by Silver View Post
What I got from the tactics angle was that many combats were trash mobs with little monster variety.
This is somewhat true, in my opinion. There is quite a lot of minor variation with similar enemies, but less meaningful difference (eg several big fights in a row against 5 different types of ghosts).

My biggest gripe with the trash mobs is that quite a few of them cause permanent effects (ability damage, level drain, blindness and so on) without being a meaningful challenge, so I've spent quite a lot of time replaying fights that weren't very fun, since it takes less time than resting and traveling back and forth.

The rock, paper, scissors appears to require correct prebuffing which he thinks is not very interesting sometimes.
To a degree this is true (and not very fun). I always go with basic buffs of all characters all the time, and then I use specific buffs when required. Some fights almost require certain buffs, while most simply get easier.
---

I've only played to the end of chapter 3 thus far, so I'm not sure how much any of this changes further into the game.
SveNitoR is offline

SveNitoR

SveNitoR's Avatar
Keeper of the Watch

#29

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,267
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 13:38
Originally Posted by Silver View Post
So your issue with the humour is there is too much of it? What I got from the tactics angle was that many combats were trash mobs with little monster variety. The rock, paper, scissors appears to require correct prebuffing which he thinks is not very interesting sometimes. Itemisation he thinks is very good but it is also very easy to muck up your build which is honestly true for lots of rpgs.

As for making things clear he says that the game is like racing a car with a instrument panel of an aircraft. Meaning its appears complicated but you can get by with tank and spank most of the time. I get the average gamer getting confused why he needs fortitude to make a save as compared to having iron skin etc but that would be hard to communicate for any game based on tabletop.
Yeah, the humour isn't such a bad thing. I'd rather have that than a dry presentation. And that was only a personal preference.

It can be fun to prebuff. I usually do the minimum until I die or have to flee with my tail between my legs. Then my character picks himself up and tries harder. It's one way to do it Others prefer to be fully prepared before any combat. Both approaches are valid.

The game still shows you most of the information you want to see - or to ignore. And if you ignore all the details, I think it's harder to make a very bad character in Pathfinder or D&D than some other games. You can, but if you have the main ability scores right, and enough feats according to how you want to RP, you can't be completely wrong unless you're looking for nothing less than perfection.

Taking a few steps back, I wonder how (or whether) they want to top this in their next game. There were many confused players with Kingmaker, and obviously more with Wrath. Perhaps it would be unwise to add even more features next time?
Redglyph is offline

Redglyph

Redglyph's Avatar
SasqWatch

#30

Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Good old Europe
Posts: 5,090
Mentioned: 92 Post(s)

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 14:14
You can also play on easier mode so you don't have to constantly buff, can enjoy exploring and focus on the story and content without every fight being a PITA. You can also make a custom difficulty like I do mainly for QOL.

For example I start with hard and make sure enemies have the same critical damage, that we give and take the same percentage of damage (equal), and some other hard things. But the negative abilities and debuffs that are just a time sink to run back some place to rest … nah I set those to end after battle or a rest, for all of them. Also use Death's Door, again QOL.

Also means I don't have to worry about the perfect build that can do every thing like this video person seems to want. I can focus more on RP then always being the optimized build.

There are a lot of things I enjoy about the Pathfnder games, the depth of character development being perhaps the biggest followed by story and companions, but I really like all the options they give for difficulty, especially in combat. I can tweak it to just the right balance for me of having some challenge and a few deaths but not so hard every battle requires tons of buffing, tedious replay or back to an inn just to heal something then run back to where I was,
--
Character is centrality, the impossibility of being displaced or overset. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
wolfgrimdark is offline

wolfgrimdark

wolfgrimdark's Avatar
SasqWatch
Original Sin Donor

#31

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: NH
Posts: 3,422
Mentioned: 79 Post(s)

Default 

April 19th, 2022, 23:19
Originally Posted by Redglyph View Post
He's also obsessed to get the perfect build to face any situation, which is not at all what those games are about, just how he wants to play it. Then he blames the game for not making it clear and easy, which I've already shown was incorrect. It's meant to be too complex, there's objectively nothing wrong with not mastering everything and unexpected outcomes.
I agree, there is so much more to just builds and combat in WotR. I loved the fact there are so many classes because it helps me RP characters with different background and personality. The game offers plenty different (including custom) difficulty settings that you can find your own sweet spot imo. I'm no Pathfinder expert and I never really try to optimise my build and had no issues on normal even trying out a class I have never played before.

Going to try skald in upcoming DLC - I think its perfect for its story, an ordinary citizen with bit of combat skill + bard buffs
--
Favourite RPGs: Baldur's Gate 2, Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous, NWN: The Aielund Saga, Pathfinder: Kingmaker, Icewind Dale
purpleblob1 is offline

purpleblob1

purpleblob1's Avatar
Princess

#32

Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 640
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
+1:

Default 

April 20th, 2022, 10:32
The party helps to compensate shortcomings anyway.

Those games are random in nature, it's also about how the player can deal with a setback.

Originally Posted by purpleblob1 View Post
Going to try skald in upcoming DLC - I think its perfect for its story, an ordinary citizen with bit of combat skill + bard buffs
I've never felt at ease with bard builds, never took the time to try and understand how they worked. Something new to discover one day.

Have you already played a similar class?
Redglyph is offline

Redglyph

Redglyph's Avatar
SasqWatch

#33

Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Good old Europe
Posts: 5,090
Mentioned: 92 Post(s)

Default 

April 20th, 2022, 12:35
Originally Posted by Redglyph View Post
I've never felt at ease with bard builds, never took the time to try and understand how they worked. Something new to discover one day.

Have you already played a similar class?
Nope, that brief time I had Linzi in my party during Kingmaker is the only experience I had with bard. Suppose I played Azata which has some bard flavour

I think it will be a fun experience
--
Favourite RPGs: Baldur's Gate 2, Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous, NWN: The Aielund Saga, Pathfinder: Kingmaker, Icewind Dale
purpleblob1 is offline

purpleblob1

purpleblob1's Avatar
Princess

#34

Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 640
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)

Default 

April 25th, 2022, 18:48
Originally Posted by wolfgrimdark View Post
You can also play on easier mode so you don't have to constantly buff, can enjoy exploring and focus on the story and content without every fight being a PITA. You can also make a custom difficulty like I do mainly for QOL.

For example I start with hard and make sure enemies have the same critical damage, that we give and take the same percentage of damage (equal), and some other hard things. But the negative abilities and debuffs that are just a time sink to run back some place to rest … nah I set those to end after battle or a rest, for all of them. Also use Death's Door, again QOL.

Also means I don't have to worry about the perfect build that can do every thing like this video person seems to want. I can focus more on RP then always being the optimized build.
This is what I needed to hear to give this game a try. Don't want to be frustrated overall, and when I hear mandatory buffing every fight I know I wouldn't last..
Warmark is offline

Warmark

Sentinel

#35

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Vancouver , Canada
Posts: 463
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)

Default 

April 25th, 2022, 19:51
Heavy buffing is fun for me for big major boss fights. But spending 10 minutes or more to buff for every fight is just pure tedium. I also prefer building my character around their lore and history not some cookie cutter build.

That is why I like difficulty settings for any game, not just this one. I prefer to tweak challenge to what I am looking for. I still have plenty of challenge but I don't have huge time sinks in buffing or running back and forth to sell stuff, get healed, or recover from effects.

I am never going to just let a companion die that I like so its either waste time getting them raised or reloading till they don't die.

We all like to play games our own way which is why having options for difficulty is a major plus in a game for me. Owlcat has a huge number of tweaks you can make - one of the most advanced difficulty settings I have seen for a game.
--
Character is centrality, the impossibility of being displaced or overset. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
wolfgrimdark is offline

wolfgrimdark

wolfgrimdark's Avatar
SasqWatch
Original Sin Donor

#36

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: NH
Posts: 3,422
Mentioned: 79 Post(s)
RPGWatch Forums » Comments » News Comments » Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Review @ Ye Old Entertainment
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT +2. The time now is 19:52.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by DragonByte Security (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2022 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2022 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright by RPGWatch