In case you want to have it, the Fallout 4 Wasteland Workshop is available for dowload now.
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Fallout 4 - Wasteland Workshop Available
- Thread starter Myrthos
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Drithius
Magic & Loss
Where's my Craft your own Dogmeat Armor DLC?
Still no official word on a release date for the GECK beyond "maybe sometime in April?"
Still no official word on a release date for the GECK beyond "maybe sometime in April?"
Well it seems Bethesda is looking for beta testers for the Creation Kit.Not until they've milked the world with their own DLC.
They said they would release the GECK once all the DLC is out - which makes sense to me. Then people don't have to keep editing their mods or worry about things breaking as much. Pretty much what Boris is doing with ENB - waiting for the game to settle down to prevent wasted time on creating code that will break with a patch or DLC.
They said it will be after 5 major DLCs. The third is Far Harbor which I am really looking forward to. I wonder what the other two will be? Nice to know there will be some more stuff added to this very fun and great RPG!
They said it will be after 5 major DLCs. The third is Far Harbor which I am really looking forward to. I wonder what the other two will be? Nice to know there will be some more stuff added to this very fun and great RPG!
Drithius
Magic & Loss
Barring some serious rewrites of the game's systems, very few mods would "break" in the interim between now and June if the GECK were released today. That's a pretty shaky excuse. At most, authors would get bugged by users to expand their ideas into stuff introduced by DLC or update an item/npc for a new animation.
This paid content is so devoid of depth that it's difficult to think it anything but a marketing tactic to garner extra sales for overly-simplistic DLC on the PC. Furthermore, the continued delay drives off potential mod authors, the lifeblood of Bethesda's longterm success. It could very well backfire in the longterm as [true] content creators lose interest while the game is instead catered to by an extension of what the Nexus currently offers - a plethora of gun and boob mods.
This paid content is so devoid of depth that it's difficult to think it anything but a marketing tactic to garner extra sales for overly-simplistic DLC on the PC. Furthermore, the continued delay drives off potential mod authors, the lifeblood of Bethesda's longterm success. It could very well backfire in the longterm as [true] content creators lose interest while the game is instead catered to by an extension of what the Nexus currently offers - a plethora of gun and boob mods.
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I would somewhat disagree with this even with the understanding I tend to take a more positive outlook on things versus a negative one. I do understand that any companies main focus is maximizing profit while minimizing customer unhappiness but that doesn't mean there are no other considerations in making decisions.
This is all ad-hoc as it is all I have to go on (personal experience) but I am pretty active on Nexus and have been for the last three years so can at least provide some insight on what I have seen in Skyrim and now in FO4.
From what I have seen enough mods are broken by patches and DLC's to be a hassle as I see people (users and authors) complain about it and I often see updates made to mods that indicate they have been fixed or updated to work with the new content/patch. Keep in mind I am including updates as well as fixes here as both are considered important. People who use a mod and get a DLC often want that DLC included as an option in their favorite mod (as you mentioned). Also many mods rely on other tools, like SKSE and ENB, that can also be impacted by patches and DLC releases. It really depends on what is released and what the changes are.
So I suspect it doesn't take a serious rewrite of the game to pose a problem depending on the nature of the mod and the change made. I have seen enough comments from authors about how a recent update/DLC created a conflict with the mod to feel it is a definite problem to be considered.
It won't be a major issue but it is one that needs to be considered IMO and shouldn't be minimized. Especially when you consider the desire of people to have DLC's added to a mod. In that case having all DLC's out in advance makes it easier for the mod creator to decide how they will approach the creation of their mod, what they might include or not include for resources, and hopefully cut down on conflicts and a need to update the mod if a change in the engine or content created a conflict with the mod.
The comment on depth was pretty much subjective opinion so no point in getting into that. Everyone has their own feelings about the game.
As for putting modders off I disagree. Oh sure it will some but I expect many in the mod scene will either just come back later when it is released (both users and creators) or will just pick up with the GECK from where they are now with FO4edit. Most do it for fun/internal-rewards and having to wait can be annoying but overall isn't going to change anything in that regard. Impatience exists because they want to mod ... they will still want to mod later.
Based on most of the metrics I have seen on modding for Beth games the population of modders isn't as big as most seem to think so while important to Beth I am not sure its the sole reason for their long term success. But it does play into their motivations and decisions so a very good point to bring up - as the value Beth places on the modding population would certainly (I hope) influence any decisions they make. Having seen how long modding has lasted for other Beth games I suspect holding off on the release of the GECK isn't going to have that big of an impact.
As for their actual reasons I can only guess. Certainly profit is at the forefront but they do have to keep their user base in mind. Profit is tied to customer satisfaction after all - although its the majority that matters here as clearly you can't please everyone.
Taking a more positive view I like to believe the decision was made with both profit and customers in mind. Knowing how users can scream over things breaking their game, especially mod users and creators, Beth might want to minimize that. Of course that doesn't mean they made the decision to release the GECK late based solely on that reason. Especially if you consider the modding base is a smaller subset of their main customer base.
But perhaps they are looking at things from a less impatient view point then users wanting everything right away. They probably review all their data and analyze things to decide what might work best.
So perhaps they balance a chance for more profit by holding of on the release of the GECK against the cons of not releasing it sooner; a case of pleasing customers by releasing it early versus some of the headaches created by customers complaining as things break and need to get updated between each DLC (something I saw as very common with Skyrim mods and users). In addition they might see that it could make things easier on the modding side if all the main content was out already.
I also don't know if the GECK is even ready and perhaps the delay is unrelated, or partially unrelated, to the DLC. Or maybe it as much more simple and they decided that they would focus their resources first on paid additions and then provide the free GECK afterwards - which seems like a fairly smart business decision when balanced against some of the other pros and cons of releasing the GECK early or late.
Or perhaps they wanted to incorporate some things into the GECK related to the DLC and that is part of the polish they are adding to it and hence want to wait to release it until that is done.
They could also be just making a bad decision without any real ulterior motive - like how they misjudged the paid mod debacle.
Or maybe not - maybe it is all just pure greed and they feel they can dismiss a certain population of their user base without any serious repercussions or dent in their overall profits.
It was just something I thought might have been behind part of the decision making process and not anything I was claiming as fact or true.
In the end I don't mind waiting, for whatever reason, since it doesn't really matter to me. If I grow bored I will play another game and come back and play with the new mods as it will give it a fresh new feel. Those who enjoyed the game will probably do the same and those who don't like the vanilla will just come back later as well. The extra months of delay (Skyrim was 11/11/11 and the CK was 2/7/12) don't seem like a huge deal to me.
Course I did write a lot here ... but mainly because I am overly wordy and verbose and I was enjoying thinking about what might have been all the possible reasons behind the decision (and to some extent was it made by the CEO and shareholders or the folks who do all the actual work and have the most invested in how the game is viewed).
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Guilty as charged…but like they say, ignorance is bliss, and when it comes to Oblivion, that old saying is especially true. Oblivion is the worst PC game I ever paid money for, and frankly with its Balls To The Wall level scaling, I would barely even consider it an RPG myself - more like an adventure game. So it should go without saying that I didn't pay any attention to its DLC, although I do remember the Horse Armor, was hard to avoid that one since it basically became a meme.
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Thrasher
Wheeee!
They eventually ended up having some pretty good DLC: "Knights of the Nine" and "Shivering Isles"
Drithius
Magic & Loss
Wolf, you're a lot more… uh… hopeful when Bethesda is involved than I am. Myself, I'm simply done with the company. They have grown far too complacent for my tastes - and far too "streamlined" in their so-called RPG offerings.
You mention the 3 month wait for Skyrim's CK, but if we get the FO4GECK in June, that will be an 8 month wait… And that's if they release in June at the end of their 3 month DLC launch window.
You mention the 3 month wait for Skyrim's CK, but if we get the FO4GECK in June, that will be an 8 month wait… And that's if they release in June at the end of their 3 month DLC launch window.
That's a nice way of putting it and I admit it is true. I lost Bioware so the only two companies left making games in my "top ten" so to speak are Bethesda and Obsidian. I will hold onto my positive view until I personally have a good reason (to me, not a good reason to others) to remove them.
I also don't think 6 or 12 months is really that long of a time to wait. Sure I would like the GECK sooner, I do mod stuff myself, but time will pass one way or the other and when it arrives I will have a reason to return to a game I had a lot of fun with. Seems like they are just trying a different business model or perhaps adding more polish to the GECK. Two friends (both serious mod authors) just got into beta testing it and are very excited with what they have seen but under NDA so they couldn't say anymore than that.
Anyhow I am not really trying to convince anyone - I know how people's minds are and don't see them changing - I was more just thinking out loud and sharing ideas on other possibilities for a delay besides just a negative one.
EDIT: Oh and while I personally don't worry too much about the time I do suspect that if they take too long (to get the GECK out) it could cause some real harm - but I think it is a good sign they have finally mentioned it and have opened it up to some beta testing.