CD Projekt - Going Medieval On Pirates

DRM is a mechanism to prevent copying but you can still have a user license that forbids copying.

Originally Posted by skavenhorde
Yea, Dwagginz, I remember that case in the UK where a mother was charged a ton of money for some game she downloaded. That was insane and even I thought they went too far on that one. Keep it a reasonable amount so no one can go to the press and scream bloody murder, but still give them the fine. They go pay and bam it's done. If they don't welll.

I don't. Is it this one?. I thought for a second you'd gotten confused with this case, but a bit of Googling saved myself. Phew!

In order for me to support CDP, they need to combat the reasons people pirate, not the pirates themselves. Why arm yourself to fight wasps if you're going to leave sandwiches lying around anyway? Surely it's more productive to put the sandwiches elsewhere? It's a terrible analogy, I know, but it's the closest I could come up with.

I think that instead of this, CDP need to release a demo to allow people to try the game. I don't mean some terrible "this demo is not representative of the final product" demo, I mean a fully functioning one that allows you to experience a certain amount of the game and get a feel for how it runs on your system - I believe The Witcher had one, and TW2 should too.

And again, Skaven, I half-agree with you about abandonware. But I also think that companies should use Gog (And similar) to their advantage. EA are one of the few big names not associated with Gog, and I hope they change their stance. I'd instantly buy The Bard's Tale if it went up, I know thousands of people would buy System Shock 2 - And what's it costing them?

Originally Posted by redman5427
I thought they were releasing it on GOG without any kind of DRM whatsover?
Can't you then give a copy to anyone you like? Isn't that what Good Old games advertises? They sell a game without drm and then expect people not to share it?

What did I miss in the discussion?

They ask kindly that you don't -- the multiple PC thing is for single users with multiple PCs. Most of the people that support GOG's DRM-free efforts know it depends on the honor system..so if someone you know wants a game..gift it to them instead.

Ah ok that totally makes sense

Originally Posted by Dwagginz
Didn't Sins use Impulse? I'm sure I had to tie my copy to Impulse after a certain update.

Looks like it was 'minimal' rather than completely free, so I misremembered.

http://www.neoseeker.com/Articles/Ha…_solar_empire/

Sins of a Solar Empire apparently sold around 200,000 copies in its first month of release, generating about $8,000,000 of (retail) revenue - and it is now the highest rated PC game of 2008.

And it did all this without having any CD copy protection. If postings in forums are to be believed, you can install it on 2-3 computers. You don't need the CD in the drive to play.

Yes, it does have a "CD Key" - basically a serial number - and you can only download patches and extensions from Stardock's site if you have a "valid" installation - i.e one of the 2-3 copies allowed per key.

But you can back up your CD. And you can re-install it if your drive needs to be re-installed without being in phone-tree hell with some third world country, convincing some poorly paid non-techie with poor english skills that you are not a pirate.

Originally Posted by kuki
Furthermore, I can say that if game doesn't have demo, i will download it to see if it is good. If not I will for sure not play it and not buy it. No harm done.

Unfortunately for every person like you there are probably many guys like one I used to know. He had hundreds of downloaded games most of which he finished and none of which he ever purchased. Yes, he *said* he'd purchase a game if he "really liked it" but apparently playing one for 10 or 20 or 50 hours isn't an indication he liked it and I never saw a single game he ever actually did purchase.

Yeah, I don't know a single person that has ever gone and purchased a game after playing a pirate version extensively.

Wow!

Amazing development.

How clueless can you be. One day making your company look like a hero , the next day intimidating people with legal actions.

When I heard they are selling the game without DRM. I thought they are going to fight the pirate war with "kindness" Which is actually the only way you can fight it.

And than next day they threaten people in mater worse than EA or Activision.

Not to mention the whole thing is stupid and irrational.

Who are they going to sue ? Are they going to make one million separate court cases ? Who is going to pay for one million trials ?

And in countries ranging from Saudi Arabia to Kazahstan to Bosnia or Ukraina.

Also. Just collecting all those IP's. And than locating them and linking them to specific users.

How about people that downloaded the game by mistake, or it was downloaded by someone else on their PC.

What about people that download by usenet, direct download, or share phisical media ?

Whole prospect is insane. Its mind boggling.


What an embarrassment for CD project.

Wow! They sure are crooks. That's not how the legal system works. If they get a crooked shitbag law firm to blackmail you with a large fine to avoid going to court, that's beyond morally wrong. I know what I'm doing THE INSTANT this game comes out. I probably won't even play it since The Witcher was pretty much the most misogynistic and juvenile piece of garbage I've ever had the misfortune of experiencing, and I have no expectations for anything quality from these guys.

I cross my fingers, gleefully waiting for gog.com to shut down again. If this is what the independent gaming world is going to be like, it can DIAF with mainstream gaming.

There is no such thing as "illegal download", legality of obtaining information is established by receiving information from a public domain - which what Internet IS. You can't illegally hear a song on a radio, you cant illegally see a move on a TV, and you cant illegally receive information from the Internet.

What you can do Illegally however, is to Playback\Broadcast or otherwise SHARE the information without legal right to do so. In other words, one can lawfully prosecute only those people who WILLINGLY and KNOWLEDGEABLY upload copyrighted content to other people, and NOT the receiving party.

Now, what about torrents, where users can't download without upload? Let me tell you! It's technically a COERCION of receiving party into participation in illegal activity, as a receiving party has no choice in the matter, but to trigger a commitment of a crime during a completely legal activity of obtaining information from a public domain. And one can not prosecute a COERCED into illegal activity third party, for any sustained damages or loses resulting from initial activity of offending party.

So, in my opinion, suing\fining an average Joe over a downloaded game is technically a violation of his basic rights.

I say nuke the pirates.

But are people that download games illegally really too stupid to use a friggin proxy? If so then I guess they need to be fined for being idiots as well.

Do we know if the DVD version will have DRM? And if so, what it will be? It would be kind of weird to have the DRM-free GOG version and then to have Tages or something else on the physical version.

I am totally with CDProjekt on this.

No DRM - CHECK
Protect your product - CHECK.

Whats the problem with this? Please kill the pirates. All the pirates. I do hate them because i have to pay for their pleasures. Because, I make sure when i buy the game that THEY can play the next game (also) for free.

I think this is unfair and lacks coherence.

Torrents are not the only way to pirate a game. This strategy would only affect torrent pirates, not the other ones (newsgroups, rapidshare, megaupload, fileserve, hotfile, etc). Or since the game has no DRM, people might lend their copies, burn to DVDs and give/sell them… But only those who get from torrent sites might be punished.

In a way, CD Projekt says "DRM free", but then, they say they will fine some torrent users. That's one form of DRM, to me.

Are they getting nervous about the quality of their game?

This sounds fair enough to me. I don't mind them going after the people who pirate their game. Their approach makes a lot more sense than what other companies do. DRM effectively punishes paying customers, while pirates have pretty much no problems with it. Instead, CD Projekt treat their paying customers really well (high quality products, no DRM, fair price, bonus material, free older game with preorders), and only go after the pirates.

It sounds like they have a sensible approach to punishment, as well. A fine which is "more than the game would cost" doesn't sound like the "suing you for everything you've got" approach used by some companies. I'm not entirely sure how legally sound this is, but as far as I know, any company can write a bill, and from a fairness perspective, I think it makes sense to charge people for the game + the trouble CD Projekt had tracking them down + a "slap on the wrist" fee.

Kay

Being anti-piracy indicates you believe culture should have an economic barrier so the poor may not experience it. That's incredibly arbitrary and elitist of you, because economic means are entirely derived from chance. Life is a lottery, just because you win, doesn't mean you deserve the right to exclude the losers. Get over yourselves and stop buying into the propaganda perpetuated by the mindless "gaming journalists".

Also, if you have a SINGLE INDIVIDUAL MP3 you didn't pay for on your computer and are in this thread applauding, you're a hypocrite. If you've ever watched a downloaded TV show or movie and are railing about piracy, you're a hypocrite. I just want you to know that.

I just read the article. And WOW holly COW!

:"But for Iwiński and CD Projekt it's a worthy pursuit. "There are more and more firms interested in it, because piracy is huge," he added.

According to Jas Purewal, a games lawyer at Olswang and writer of Gamer/Law, CD Projekt's effort with The Witcher 2 marks the beginning of a crackdown that's set to become more intense. "

….

Basically not only that CD project attempts to send those fines. They are also spearheading new age of file sharing crackdown !


Well good luck with that.


Its just amazing how they turned from absolute good guys in my eyes to greedy (but not overly smart) fall guys.

And to think that I almost preordered Witcher2 yesterday!

Now i guess, they will have to find me and fine me

Originally Posted by blatantninja
Yeah, I don't know a single person that has ever gone and purchased a game after playing a pirate version extensively.

Me. Someone handed me a game saying "I think you will like this." I tried it and then bought a copy. They were completely floored that I would buy it when I didn't need to, but I have no need to pirate anything.

@Gwendo

Punishing some of the pirates makes a lot more sense than punishing none of the pirates and all of the paying customers, I think.

Kay

Originally Posted by booboo
Do we know if the DVD version will have DRM? And if so, what it will be? It would be kind of weird to have the DRM-free GOG version and then to have Tages or something else on the physical version.

In the EU, CDP are publishing it so it will likely be DRM free. I think it's Atari for the US, so expect SecuROM or something. Atari aren't bad with DRM (IMHO), so it's a case of wait and see.