Dragon Age 2 - Demo Released

played through as a mage - almost stopped after the first silly over-powered combat, but fortunately that was just a story device. Or something. All the points I would have raised have been covered elsewhere, but I can say that I felt no engagement with the characters of world at all, unlike DA:O where I was quickly sucked in and really enjoyed the origin sequence. Yes, this is a demo, so I can't be certain how well it reflects actual game play, but when I played that first sequence I was reminded very much of Dungeon Siege 2 - probably the pace. I also think that disabling aspects of the game (like inventory) does not serve any purpose - why not allow us to play the proper opening sequence? Demonstrate some of the real depth in the game (assuming its there)? The sequences they selected were just combat. How does crafting work? Why not show some of the other non-combat aspects in play? Based on this demo, I'd say it's not terrible (didn't expect it to be terrible), but its not as good as DA:O. And WTF with the art direction, textures etc? The monsters (and their clones) look improved over DA:O, but the landscape and city that I saw was drab, poor lighting etc. They didn't appear to be using even (cheap!) bump mapping on floors - that final courtyard is a quad with a flagstone texture - ugly. Maybe that will be the "high end" settings, which I couldn't enable even though I have a Dx11 high-end card. As a demo I think this was poorly executed.

Originally Posted by Ovenall
I like some of the graphic style. I actually prefer a slightly cartoony look over trying for gritty realism. The characters look great. What I didn't like so much is the environments I saw were too clean and sparse, feeling more like strategic "battle rooms" versus an actual outdoor setting.

I think the characters in DA2 look dull and boring. Not to mention ridiculously over the top in certain aspects, i.e. giant boobs, etc. It reeks of console influence.

I don't mind the artistic style so much as the way it's actually rendered though. It just looks bad imo. The textures seem faded and less detailed compared to DA:O, which didn't have great visuals to begin with, and the game almost has a "cel-shaded" look.

Okay, I played through it now.

The part until the Dragon arrives for the second time, this is the part of what was available at the Games Com. With lesser combat, then.

The parts behind that are new, compared to that.

My very personal opinion is that this demo is far, far, far too much combat-oriented for my taste. In fact, there is NOTHING BUT combat. Apart from these ridiculously small dialog parts … I think I should call it a "console combat sim" from now on (but in fact any Action RPG is that, too).

And I still don't understand the sense of these strange dialog symbols … What, if I chose the "silly/funny" dialog all of the times ? How will this influence the plot ?

There is even more blood than in Dragon Age 1. I didn't think this was possible … But - yes, it IS possible. Dragon Age 3 will probably entirely in red …

Speaking of colours : Directx 9 users see only "middle" details, "high" and the level above that is only for Direktx 11 users. Another way to say to players "your PC/OS is too old - spend the money for a new one instead !" ? You know that I'm against this "exclusing" kind of marketing scheme.

The options screen is nearly black. If I try to increase the gamma - even the highest possible value generates a screen that is nearly black in the options menu.The menu texts are against nearly black background … What, if I decresed the gamme value even more ? And - what kind of sense has decreasing the gamma value, actually, then ? Is there a thing like "blacker than black" ?

And colours … - Forget it. Just forget it. There are even lesser colours than in Dragon Age 1. Even more muted. Someone at Bioware must hate flowers with a passion. And the Rainbow, too.

The overall quality has actually decreased, this is my very personal opinion. This demo lacks *everything* that made Dragon Age 1 interesting for me … *Everything* - And with a special emphasis on colours …

This … combat simulator … is actually nothing for me. I mught buy it for 5 Euros one day, because to me - a fan of Drakensanbg 2 -this is exactly thew value it's worth to me. Instead I'd rather buy another REAL Drakensang CE for 50-60 Euros … But this game ? No. I won't touch it for a long, long, long time.

Edit : Almost forgot to mention it : The female mage (who is the sister of the protagonist ?) is spoken by the same actress who spoke the role of Fayris in the German version of Drakensang 2 … (I decided to play the German-language version of the demo, after all)

Edit : And another oddity : The blight crossbow creatures had hemlet looking like a dish exactly in the same way as the bowmen in both Drakensang games have it, too …

So you are basing what the entire game is off the demo which is basically just combat. Yep fair. Do you honsetly think its going to be just constant combat and nothing else?


Alrik, at least keep i t real and admit this was never for you regardless. You mention what the demo is numerous times, then tell us the game is not for you and is worth about 5 dollars.

Well, based on the demo, this game isn't for me.
End of the story.

But what irritates me is the projection that someone with this financial power like EA has might dominate the RPG genre with this approach ( read : franchise) of games just like Blizzard did.

If this will be the future, then I'll quit RPG gaming altogether.
(Except Indies, if I can get them in retail here …)

Originally Posted by Ovenall
Second, I found the targeting to be imprecise. Selecting which enemy to hit with a spell or start attacking felt vague, as they barely glow when you mouse over them.

Not only this, but also all AoE spells/special attacks have to be targeted on the ground and can´t be targeted on enemy. This decision is somewhat disputable alone, at least in the case of AoE´s like fireball, but a lot worse is that if you´re targeting an area and your cursor is over an enemy at the same time, the action won´t get executed. Why highlighted enemies matter when none of AoE´s can be targeted on them anyway is beyond me. This makes executing AoE´s quite a hassle, especially given they´re more often than not used on clusters of enemies.

Also, noticed that archers don´t bother with quivers now, arrows just appear in mid air. Nice attention to detail here.

If this demo is a fair representation of the full game, this is not an RPG. It's an action game. And it's a boring action game at that.

I played through the first couple ogres with one finger while I listened to my voicemails for work. I would press the R key, watch my rogue teleport and jump around, occasionally hitting one of the number keys for my ninja abilities or whatever the hell they were. Didn't have to bother looking up what they actually were. I got the overly simplistic idea pretty fast. No pausing. No strategizing. No challenge. No problems at all…and no fun.

The only problem was this steaming pile of feces I thankfully didn't pay for taking up 2 gigs on my hard drive. Deleted.

P.S. I also wasn't a huge fan of being forced into playing Commander Will Riker's closeted cousin.

Originally Posted by Alrik Fassbauer
The overall quality has actually decreased, this is my very personal opinion.

I agree.
I think there was word how they spent too much money on original and decisions about sequel were made before it hit the market.
It sold well but who knows how much it paid off for them so perhaps they automatized some things for this one.

Originally Posted by rune_74
So you are basing what the entire game is off the demo which is basically just combat. Yep fair.

You say that this is only a demo and not an indication of the entire game, and that is certainly true to some extent. However, if a demo is a glimpse of how the game plays, and a player doesn't like the demo at all, how will the full game become a vastly different experience? Will the combat mechanics miraculously change into something enjoyable for people who dislike it? Yes, you are absolutely right that the full game will not be filled with endless combat, but we all know that the full game will feature a lot of combat. So if the demo- which highlights what the combat will feel like - is mediocre to some, I think it's perfectly fair for those people to criticize the full game given the evidence we have that Bioware "RPGs" are quite combat-heavy, just as it is fair for those that liked the demo to make a positive judgment about the full game. Is that not what demos are for? To help decide if a game is enjoyable and worth buying or not?

Sure, but to then say all it is is a combat fest is BS. The combat to be fair is not much different then in the original…it is faster for sure, but it is by no means a who has the faster reflexes, I find it strange people would even play it like that. I mean, you select the skills you want to use, you are not swing the sword like say oblivion, gothic etc….

Also, how does this look bad:
http://social.bioware.com/forum/Drag…6175713-1.html

The days of advanced D&D are gone, consoles completely destroyed an amazing genre in just ten years . When your on the fence about a game you try the demo to see if you might like the game . I know this game is not for me . DA3 will be even more streamlined.

Originally Posted by rune_74
Sure, but to then say all it is is a combat fest is BS. The combat to be fair is not much different then in the original…it is faster for sure, but it is by no means a who has the faster reflexes, I find it strange people would even play it like that. I mean, you select the skills you want to use, you are not swing the sword like say oblivion, gothic etc….

True, and I understand what you are saying; it obviously won't be a Diablo-style "combat fest." But given Bioware's approach to game design, it's pretty clear that there will be a lot of combat, so all I'm saying is that if players like or dislike the combat presented in the demo, (which is how combat will be in the full game) I think that these players can make a reasonable analysis of whether or not the game is for them. An argument can be made that if if there is a great story driving the action, then the quality of the combat is unimportant; Arcanum comes to mind as an amazing game that features combat that I really don't enjoy, but I still love the game thanks to its incredible story, impressive writing, and real choices and consequences. However, even though I personally like Bioware's stories, they are far too linear, feature extremely limited choices on any meaningful level, and are too action-heavy to overlook unappealing combat. So for a fairly linear, action-heavy game, whether or not a player enjoys the combat is fairly important in determining if they will like the full game, in my opinion. And that (perhaps after a far too long-winded post on my part) is my point - I'm not saying in any way that the combat is either good or bad, just that this demo can give players a reasonable look at whether or not the game will be enjoyable from their point of view, even though the full game won't be a complete "combat fest."

Originally Posted by Alrik Fassbauer
Speaking of colours : Directx 9 users see only "middle" details, "high" and the level above that is only for Direktx 11 users. Another way to say to players "your PC/OS is too old - spend the money for a new one instead !" ? You know that I'm against this "exclusing" kind of marketing scheme.

I know certain DX10 features can actually be run on DX9 but there are also a ton of things that only DX10 and DX11 can do, it's not all marketing. Progress is a good thing.

Good god. Bunch of drama queens in here.

Baldur's Gate was excoriated at the time as a big step away from "real RPG" because it had real time combat you could pause. "Oh no, they're making it just like Diablo!"

BG 1 & 2 had — in almost every case of dialog "choice" — a Goody Two Shoes response, an Evil Jerk response and an "I'm sorry I'm too busy right now" response. So the dialog wheel gives you a slight surprise in the actual wording of your response. This is somehow so much worse than taking a long time reading the exact wording your character speaks… even if you STILL have only a few choices?

Get a grip people. This will probably not be my favorite game ever, but it's just a freaking game. Ignore it if you don't want to play it. But the dramatic crying and rending of garments around here is truly comical.

Originally Posted by Maylander
- Like some others here, I experienced the glitch where skills don't trigger. Happened several times with the fireball. Selected the skill, picked my target, clicked the target and.. nothing happened. It always triggered the second time I tried though, so I never experienced it twice in a row.

Errr, that isn't how it's done. You pick the target THEN pick the skill. It worked the second time because you had the target selected at that point.

I remember having a tough time learning that in DA:O, which did the same thing. I think I even posted on these boards about it.

For everyone regarding the 'combat fest'… Think back to DA:O. How long did you spend in back to back to back combat when you climbed that tower in Ostagar (or whatever the name was) early in the game? I've got a screenshot near the start with a 9am date and one near the end with a 4pm date. I'm sure I had at least one break for lunch but it was definitely a long into the courtyard and up to the top of the tower. There has always been a ton of combat in these games.

Originally Posted by DoctorNarrative
I know certain DX10 features can actually be run on DX9 but there are also a ton of things that only DX10 and DX11 can do, it's not all marketing. Progress is a good thing.

To be fair, he is looking at Drakensang 2 which was basically a copy of NWN engine(but inferior) which did not require as much horsepower. You are absolutely correct on why the DX 11 version has more bells and whistles.

And any gamer shouldn't be against things being there that their "current" machine can't handle. The worst thing ever is to limit it to the lowest power and not have a higher edge.

The demo wasn't "just combat", it gave a sample of what DA2's overall look, feel, and atmosphere is going to be like.

The only thing it didn't do was let us see the inventory system, or the 'very high' graphics setting, which I don't expect to be a big leap from the 'high' setting.

In short, anyone who thinks the full game is going to be drastically different from the demo is kidding themselves.

Originally Posted by JDR13
The demo wasn't "just combat", it gave a sample of what the game's overall look, feel, and atmosphere is going to be.

The only thing it didn't do was let us see the inventory system, or the 'very high' graphics setting, which I don't expect to be a big leap from the 'high' setting.

In short, anyone who thinks the full game is going to be drastically different from the demo is kidding themselves.

hehehe, you tell us so we can stop kidding ourselves. So you know how travel will work? Or the overall story arc? I put a link in earlier with the pics of the versions. Do you know how character interaction will be? Inventory system would make a difference already. What I have seen is good, I don't expect the graphics to change, but I do expect more things to do(which is you know, pretty self explanetary) You don't honestly think that it's going to be all corridors that we just fight through do you?

Originally Posted by rune_74
hehehe, you tell us so we can stop kidding ourselves. So you know how travel will work? Or the overall story arc? I put a link in earlier with the pics of the versions. Do you know how character interaction will be? Inventory system would make a difference already. What I have seen is good, I don't expect the graphics to change, but I do expect more things to do(which is you know, pretty self explanetary) You don't honestly think that it's going to be all corridors that we just fight through do you?

Really? So the inventory system is going to make a significant difference in the overall look and feel of the game? Good luck with that…

It reminds me of when the demo for Arcania was released, and certain optimistic people were claiming that there was nothing to worry about.

Originally Posted by JDR13
Really? So the inventory system is going to make a significant difference in the overall look and feel of the game? Good luck with that…

It reminds me of when the demo for Arcania was released, and certain optimistic people were claiming that there was nothing to worry about.

Unlike you, I didn't have a problem with the look and feel…I'm not looking for a drastic change of what I have seen…I just want on overland map like the original and character choices etc…don't think I need luck with that, thanks. This is nothing like Arcania, sad you think that…shows a bit about this site though.

You have blasted the graphics earlier, which is funny since the beat the crap out of Risens and the gothic games.