No Mutants Allowed - A History of Fallout Fandom Part 2

Originally Posted by Burress
Here is what I know for sure about the game: Bethesda has said they would stay true to the humor of the fallout series, there would be fewer and more detailed npcs than in an Elder Scrolls game, the special system would be used, and the lead developer has been announced. I don't call that a lot, but do you know more?

Yes.

http://www.rpgcodex.com/gamedetails.php?id=283

Originally Posted by VDweller
Yes.

http://www.rpgcodex.com/gamedetails.php?id=283

hmmm, I just went through that page and found almost nothing new, nor anything discussing the actual design of the game, what exactly should we be looking for?

Originally Posted by VDweller
"a slightly new story that doesn't change a hair of what went before"
Care to back it up? Show me a few links stating "Fallout 1 was about finding the waterchip and dealing with the mutants, so Fallout 3 MUST be about finding the last light bulb AND dealing with the mutants AGAIN!!!"

From the article:
"And there's too much to be unhappy about when it comes to how Tactics treated the setting. These arguments have also been made for Fallout 2, but a lot of Fallout 2's setting flaws are compensated by good execution of Fallout's central RPG-philosophies."

If Fallout 2 was barely good enough then how can Fallout 3 ever hope to satisfy them?

And as for what *I* want, I'd like to see a game that keeps the setting and themes with a good story and interesting NPCs. The SPECIAL system can be tossed (though it sounds like its not); Lionheart showed that SPECIAL isn't all that SPECIAL. As for using a 3/4 overhead view with turn based combat, well, I used to think I would hate anything BUT that but I've found it doesn't really matter.

My highlights.

Originally Posted by VDWeller
View Post
"a slightly new story that doesn't change a hair of what went before"
Care to back it up? Show me a few links stating "Fallout 1 was about finding the waterchip and dealing with the mutants, so Fallout 3 MUST be about finding the last light bulb AND dealing with the mutants AGAIN!!!"

Originally Posted by BillSeurer
From the article:
"And there's too much to be unhappy about when it comes to how Tactics treated the setting. These arguments have also been made for Fallout 2, but a lot of Fallout 2's setting flaws are compensated by good execution of Fallout's central RPG-philosophies."

I don't care if Deathclaws are furry or not. I really did like the Tactics game. I played it last year and because normally I'm not a fan of tactic games I expected much worse. Of course it lacks depth but it never pretended to be a real sequel - so that's ok with me.

My deepest fear IS the Oblivion with guns scenario. And I think that's it for most of the Fallout fans. So I don't understand why Bethsoft doesn't respond to that negative rumours with just a little calming info. But generally Bethesda doesn't respond to their TES fans and their suggestions - so I can understand that they won't do it for other games (especially if there's a lot of criticism).

Although Piranha Bytes didn't mention a lot of Gothic 3 content before the release they talked to the fans (especiall Kai - every company needs such a mr. nice guy). So you can calm down the fanbase and talk to them even without revealing too much. Some companies just don't see the need to do so. And some fans receive this as some kind of "we make our shit the way we want it to be - buy it or not"… So both sides are offended. This status isn't that good for a well-received franchise, is it?

Personally I think that Beth possibly CAN stay true to the Fallout scenario. They already made good games (you know, before Morrowind ; - ).

Originally Posted by Pladio
Bethesda didn't do anything to help their relation with the NMA fans though.

Weird, huh? So bad, evil Bethesda refuse to associate with a community that has repeatedly (or one might as well say "constantly") threatened to physically harm Bethesda employees or their relatives (like the "offer" to anally ummm… examine Pete Hines' wife), a community that has started assaults on the ES forums to see who can get banned faster than another person, a community that is generally sporting a "Bethesda suxx" state of mind, a community that has suggested that dropping bombs on Bethsoft HQ would be a good thing etc etc etc

Yup. Definitely strange, secretive folks those Bethesda fellas. I mean how could you possibly NOT want to associate with such super-friendly and likeable people as the Fallout community. Inexplicable. Mind-boggling. It really is…

Originally Posted by Moriendor
Weird, huh? So bad, evil Bethesda refuse to associate with a community that has repeatedly (or one might as well say "constantly") threatened to physically harm Bethesda employees or their relatives (like the "offer" to anally ummm… examine Pete Hines' wife), a community that has started assaults on the ES forums to see who can get banned faster than another person, a community that is generally sporting a "Bethesda suxx" state of mind, a community that has suggested that dropping bombs on Bethsoft HQ would be a good thing etc etc etc

Citations?

Moriendor ,
not everyone on NMA and DAC is such unfriendly, many people from there would like to hear something from devs. They are currently the biggest sites about Fallout on internet. Also the whole negative reaction is created by Bethesda itself. If there is nothing to worry about, why bethesda won't tell that it's not Oblivion with guns, that it's true too original. Also on every big foras I saw the expectations aren't optimistic so why they should be on community forums?
There are also rumors which I think are from reliable sources.

I also hate the dumb talk about killing\raping etc. it's childish as hell an creates the bad reputation of the whole fandom. But still that's not the problem, the problem is in the lack of communication and possible destroying of the only valuable Post Nuclear crpg franchise, which by many, including myself is considered to be the best cRPG ever.

20mithrandir
I also enjoyed Fallout Tactics, not so much as Fallout, but still it was quite fun.
but it shouldn't have "Fallout" in name,
The setting was changed alot, and the atmosphere was different
It wasn't very tactical also,
it was more of "Hack & Sla… oh i mean "Shoot & Kill" than Jagged Alliance in PA setting.

Originally Posted by Dagon
I also hate the dumb talk about killing\raping etc. it's childish as hell an creates the bad reputation of the whole fandom. But still that's not the problem, the problem is in the lack of communication and possible destroying of the only valuable Post Nuclear crpg franchise, which by many, including myself is considered to be the best cRPG ever.

Actually, that is part of the problem, not to be discounted, but not to be blown out of proportion either.

threatened to physically harm Bethesda employees or their relatives (like the "offer" to anally ummm… examine Pete Hines' wife), a community that has started assaults on the ES forums to see who can get banned faster than another person

You are repulsive. You know you are lying and yet you go on and out of hatred and fanaticism dare to post that crap. Do you want to know what the Lead Designer to Fallout3, from Bethesda, wrote many months after the game was announced and the heat on the TeS forum (WICH WASN'T ORCHESTRATED BY THE FANSITES) cooled off went to post at NMA?

Hey boys and girls,

I'm really just dropping in to say hello and introduce myself. I'm another Bethesda dev who's been lurking around the forums for a while now, but has never actually posted. It's so much easier to just sit back and watch Pete Hines get tossed into the meat grinder. Razz

I'm Emil Pagliarulo, a designer on TES 4: Oblivion. I've been at Bethesda for a couple years now. Before that I was at Ion Storm Austin, and before that at Looking Glass Studios…working on the Thief series.

I thought Thief fans were the most passionate gamers on the planet…and then I met the Elder Scrolls fans. Then I thought THEY were the most passionate gamers on the player…until I met you guys and found out you had killed all the Elder Scrolls fans and fed them to the Deathclaws! Smile

Seriously, though, you guys are awesome. In the few months I've been visiting these forums I've seen more spirited, passionate, intelligent game design discussion than I have on a lot of other game forums in the past few years.

Anyway, it's good to finally introduce myself and I promise I won't be a stranger.

Til next time, stay safe, and don't forget your Rad-X.

Emil

Would he do that if your story was right? And if someone went with screams against Beth, you can't just come up with a generalization like "THE COMMUNITY did this and that". With all the threats and insults we had to endure until now nothing is so despicable as your trolling. And for your information who had the forum covered with obscene pictures, had to endure DdOS attacks organized by angry mobs and still have to put up with losers full of bullshit registering just to cause havoc is NMA and Fallout fans in general. Stupid troll.

Stupid troll.

Maybe he was banned from NMA for trolling
and now he suffers from NMA complex.
The syndrome which results in Rapidity and general hating for Fallout fans.

Briosa
i haven't saw this quote earlier,
it gives some hope
maybe at least they are trying to do a proper sequel

Oopsie… sorry that I upset you all, you little angels, you!
But whenever you have some time please feel free to ask your good friend VDweller on the cloud next to you how he copied a very detailed description of the anal "examination" of Pete Hines' wife into a new thread that he then called 'Sexual Fantasies' (the original post was by that Major Blackhart dude, IIRC and posted on the news comments forums).

Or if you want some more angelic voices:
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewto…de8052696cbfdb
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewto…7b3c521ec53bc3
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewto…f492c354373480
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=10909
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=13057
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=15747
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=15614
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=15885
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=16534
http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=11423
http://www.duckandcover.cx/forums/vi…c109419031970b

http://www.duckandcover.cx/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15809
http://forum.rpg.net/archive/index.php/t-280032.html
http://www.duckandcover.cx/forums/viewtopic.php?t=10632
http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/vie…295ba24b802a6d
http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=34434

Aaaahhh… so much love for Bethesda. So much constructive criticism. As I said, it's really unbelievable that Bethesda just don't want to listen to these genuinely friendly and mature people.

Originally Posted by Dagon
Maybe he was banned from NMA for trolling
and now he suffers from NMA complex.

Nope. Only forum I ever got banned from in my life is the JoWood forums. I might have an account at NMA though. If so it's 'Moriendor' as well. If you really need to let off some steam then feel free to ban that account or -no- better yet… let's get real funny… hihihi *schoolgirl giggle*… and… and… edit my title and make it 'Gaylord'. Bwahahahahaha… that would be soooo funny. Please do that, will ya? Thanks!

Originally Posted by Moriendor
Aaaahhh… so much love for Bethesda. So much constructive criticism. As I said, it's really unbelievable that Bethesda just don't want to listen to these genuinely friendly and mature people.

Bethesda didn't do anything to help their relation with the NMA fans though.

You cited two examples from NMA. The original remark wasn't actually about DaC or the Codex.

Hell, it's almost all Codex. Codex isn't affiliated with either DaC or NMA, nor is it a Fallout fansite.

Originally Posted by Moriendor
Nope. Only forum I ever got banned from in my life is the JoWood forums. I might have an account at NMA though. If so it's 'Moriendor' as well. If you really need to let off some steam then feel free to ban that account or -no- better yet… let's get real funny… hihihi *schoolgirl giggle*… and… and… edit my title and make it 'Gaylord'. Bwahahahahaha… that would be soooo funny. Please do that, will ya? Thanks!

You have to remember that I don't even post too much on NMA, not to mention that i'm not moderator or admin so banning you would be quite problematic.
And it wouldn't be funny, but your reaction is & very strange at the same time and I have to say very interesting in psychological way. Why so much passion in hatred for NMA community? Did some fallout fans killed someone close to you?
Oh don't take it personally, but you have to agree with me that this kind of behaviour is quite hmm disturbing.

Originally Posted by Dagon
Why so much passion in hatred for NMA community? Did some fallout fans killed someone close to you?

Just having a little fun.. that's all . And it's more like a little aversion (hate and passion are words that are too strong in this context) against the Codex community, not NMA. I don't even know NMA all that well.
You know it's just so cute when them Fallout fanbois get all red-faced and start spitting at their screens as soon as someone dares to say anything against FO or their communities. In fact so cute that I have to restrain myself not to turn gay .

Oh don't take it personally, but you have to agree with me that this kind of behaviour is quite hmm disturbing.

Not only do I agree but it's meant to be disturbing .

Originally Posted by Moriendor
And it's more like a little aversion (hate and passion are words that are too strong in this context) against the Codex community, not NMA. I don't even know NMA all that well.
You know it's just so cute when them Fallout fanbois get all red-faced and start spitting at their screens as soon as someone dares to say anything against FO or their communities. In fact so cute that I have to restrain myself not to turn gay

So basically you were trolling a community you know nothing about to get back a community that has nothing to do with the current situation?

Ok. Just try not to get too worked up about it

Mo, I don't remember you being this confrontational when you were Senior Editor at the Dot!! I do hope someone from Bethsoft reads all this even if they don't respond. Still, they want to make a successful game (obviously) and totally 'pissing' off your fanbase is usually not a good way to begin. SO, I'm still hoping that Beth will deliver what we fans want and I'm not going to attack them until/unless they fail to deliver an acceptable game. If that happens, then the gloves will come off!!

Originally Posted by Moriendor
Just having a little fun.. that's all . And it's more like a little aversion (hate and passion are words that are too strong in this context) against the Codex community, not NMA. I don't even know NMA all that well.
You know it's just so cute when them Fallout fanbois get all red-faced and start spitting at their screens as soon as someone dares to say anything against FO or their communities. In fact so cute that I have to restrain myself not to turn gay .

So basically you hate codex for being cynical & sarcastic, but instead of ignoring that community, you have joy by irriating OTHER fallout fans on another website using more childish cynism than that used by codexers.
Also I consider myself as being fallout fan and i don't have red face right now, i'm not even irritated. I don't want to defend or attack anyone. I'm true neutral.
But I'm sorry i find that to be just stupid.

Sorry for my lil. Offtop

Originally Posted by Corwin
Mo, I don't remember you being this confrontational when you were Senior Editor at the Dot!!

That's the beauty of no longer being an editor. I don't have to play the Mr. Nice Guy game anymore .

So basically you hate codex for being cynical & sarcastic, but instead of ignoring that community, you have joy by irriating OTHER fallout fans on another website

Errr… just from my short little trip that I took to collect those links, I could tell from the registered nicknames at NMA that there is some major overlapping between the Codex forums and the NMA forums. Or are you saying it is a pure coincidence that the same nicks have been registered at both sites? Riiiight. Pure coincidence. Must be. And before you do it, Mr. Lawyer, Kharn, Sir, no, I can not prove that it is indeed the same people. I lose.

And where did I say that I "hate" (as I said, the term "hate" is way too strong anyway) the Codex for being "cynical & sarcastic"? I didn't. Because it wouldn't even be true. I dislike a major part of their community for being childish, immature, full of themselves (self-important), or for being outright offensive in a non-funny way etc. - But I certainly don't mind cynicism or sarcasm at all. Quite the contrary. As you can tell from some of my remarks around here, I can be a cynical and sarcastic little bastard myself sometimes .