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Default Belgium says loot boxes are gambling

Yesterday, 01:21
Belgium wants the EU to ban in-app purchases if you don't know what your getting. I would rather an outright ban but still better than nothing.

http://www.pcgamer.com/belgium-says-…ffer-pcgamertw
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Yesterday, 02:30
I think they got it just right. I don’t care about microtransactions ( knowing what you’re paying for) but random lootboxes are the devil.
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Yesterday, 03:02
Be careful what you wish for. Is buying a card pack for Magic: The Gathering gambling?

That said, the game industry (especially mobile games aimed at kids) is in desperate need of a clean up. A lot of game companies out there seem far more interested in profitable psychology tricks than game play these days. (And, if a friendly politician can sneak in a "no checkpoint-only save systems" into the rules while the others aren't looking, so much the better. ;)
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Yesterday, 03:05
Personally, I also care about clear microtransactions, as I think games are now being designed to manipulate players into in-game purchases, rather than simply being quality entertainment that are the purchases in themselves.

But, that's not really something that can be addressed in law - I just hope that the market will reject it.
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Yesterday, 03:06
These are not the droids you are looking for.

Patent Applicant: ACTIVISION PUBLISHING

System and method for driving microtransactions in multiplayer video games

Abstract
A system and method is provided that drives microtransactions in multiplayer video games. The system may include a microtransaction arrange matches to influence game-related purchases. For instance, the system may match a more expert/marquee player with a junior player to encourage the junior player to make game-related purchases of items possessed/used by the marquee player. A junior player may wish to emulate the marquee player by obtaining weapons or other items used by the marquee player.
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Yesterday, 04:04
Hurrah for Belgium!

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Yesterday, 04:44
loading…


Its a trap! lol

Also go Hawaii!
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Yesterday, 06:06
Eeesh, their futures as YouTube personalities look bleak. I really wish they would have done a bit more to explain HOW this counts as gambling, though. Most voters don't know.

This will be an interesting debate to watch.
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Yesterday, 11:08
Originally Posted by Zloth View Post
Be careful what you wish for. Is buying a card pack for Magic: The Gathering gambling?
No. You can exchange duplicates with a local hobo. Without paying any fee to some inhouse something, so you should ask about Steam cards next.
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Yesterday, 12:02
Originally Posted by sakichop View Post
I think they got it just right. I donít care about microtransactions ( knowing what youíre paying for) but random lootboxes are the devil.
You right even though I also care deeply about microtransactions. I don't believe its the government business to regulate microtransactions but its their business to regulate gambling.

As Ripper says, microtransactions leads to bad game design because the main game will be designed to make you spend money on them.
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Yesterday, 12:09
Some people don't seem to mind that they're no longer dealing with games - but money generating applications disguised as games.

Especially young people, who don't realise how much better these games could be - and how much more meaningful they tend to be when profit is not the goal and part of the actual gaming experience.

Now, it's absolutely true that you can just not play them - or pay for microtransactions - and I don't - but there's no reason to pretend it's good for gaming, or that ignoring it will help matters.

The more people realise that gaming will get worse the more we support this - and the more we accept it. Companies will interpret passive acceptance as support and will go on for as long as people are paying for it.
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Yesterday, 13:08
Apparently, the reason EA suspended all micro transactions in Star Wars, is that Disney showed them their teeth. They are not happy about their brand and their IP being associated with serious talk of predatory practices. This is the way to combat an outfit like EA - hit them in the terms they understand.
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Yesterday, 13:46
Originally Posted by lostforever View Post
You right even though I also care deeply about microtransactions. I don't believe its the government business to regulate microtransactions but its their business to regulate gambling.

As Ripper says, microtransactions leads to bad game design because the main game will be designed to make you spend money on them.
Originally Posted by Ripper View Post
Apparently, the reason EA suspended all micro transactions in Star Wars, is that Disney showed them their teeth.
My suggestion is not to go that direction here.
Microtransactions existed for centuries, can't remember if I already shared thoughts on it in politically anticorrect section. Not only every religion depended on microtransactions through history, today China bases it's blossoming economy on those same microtransactions. Let's not forget the presence of microtransactions in crowdfunding - is that a bad thing?

Lootboxes and microtransactions are not the same thing.
What Belgium and Hawaii tried to say is what some of us are yelling for years now but noone cared - star trek online lootboxes are nothing but scam where gambling is falsely advertised as a videogame thus avoiding huge taxes (and rating/warning).

Originally Posted by NewDArt View Post
Some people don't seem to mind that they're no longer dealing with games - but money generating applications disguised as games.
True, but doesn't mean that minority being easily abusable by greedy CEOs should make the rest of us left without choice.
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Yesterday, 13:50
True, but that doesn't mean such minority being easily abusable by greedy CEOs should make the rest of us without choice.
There are many things that shouldn't be - but they are.

There's a reason the crowd-funding scene happened and exploded.

Some of us are willing to deal with sub-AAA production values if it means we can get games that don't focus on profit almost exclusively.

I'm happy about that.

That's not to say there aren't great games in the AAA segment - or terrible games in the crowd-funding segment - but the tendency is obvious.
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Yesterday, 22:41
Originally Posted by NewDArt View Post
Some people don't seem to mind that they're no longer dealing with games - but money generating applications disguised as games.

Especially young people, who don't realise how much better these games could be - and how much more meaningful they tend to be when profit is not the goal and part of the actual gaming experience.

Now, it's absolutely true that you can just not play them - or pay for microtransactions - and I don't - but there's no reason to pretend it's good for gaming, or that ignoring it will help matters.

The more people realise that gaming will get worse the more we support this - and the more we accept it. Companies will interpret passive acceptance as support and will go on for as long as people are paying for it.
What is support exactly, didn’t you buy deus ex MD? ( not sure but thought I read here that you had)

I’m not talking for anyone else but it’s not a case of ignoring it or passive acceptance as much as it is just dealing with reality.

I suppose I could start boycotting games or developers with micro transactions but then my game selection will start to diminish more and more over time.

I remember not to long ago DLC was treated here the same as micro transactions are now. If one were to draw a hardline then and say not supporting games or developers making dlc, what would they be playing today?

The reality is that I want to game and I want to play games I like. Some of them and increasingly more of them will have micro transactions. I’m not willing to give up gaming to make a point.

My 1 vote with my dollars will mean nothing. So if you ever put together a site and organize a couple million people then I’ll surely join when we have a voice loud enough to be heard.

Also, Joxer what are you going on about? don’t you have 500+ hours in metal gear solid a game with micro transactions? < Insert joxer post on why some micro transactions are ok and some aren’t>
Last edited by sakichop; Yesterday at 22:51.
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Yesterday, 22:43
Originally Posted by sakichop View Post
What is support exactly, didnít you buy deus ex MD? ( not sure but thought I read here that you had)

Iím not talking for anyone else but itís not a case of ignoring it or passive acceptance as much as it is just dealing with reality.

I suppose I could start boycotting games or developers with micro transactions but then my game selection will start to diminish more and more over time.

I remember not to long ago DLC was treated here the same as micro transactions are now. If one were to draw a hardline then and say not supporting games or developers making dlc, what would they be playing today?

The reality is that I want to game and I want to play games I like. Some of them and increasingly more of them will have micro transactions. Iím not willing to give up gaming to make a point.

My 1 vote with my dollars will mean nothing. So if you ever put together a site and organize a couple million people then Iíll surely join when we have a voice loud enough to be heard.
I don't think you quite follow.

Buying the game in itself doesn't support the practice - it's paying for loot boxes that's the problem.

I mean, if no one paid for loot boxes (or whatever similar nonsense) - there wouldn't be a market there.

As for what you would be willing to do - that's your business.

If you want to support this kind of thing, you should go right ahead.
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Yesterday, 23:00
Originally Posted by NewDArt View Post
I don't think you quite follow.

Buying the game in itself doesn't support the practice - it's paying for loot boxes that's the problem.

I mean, if no one paid for loot boxes (or whatever similar nonsense) - there wouldn't be a market there.

As for what you would be willing to do - that's your business.

If you want to support this kind of thing, you should go right ahead.
Never paid for a loot box and never will. Different people draw the line in different spot was just wondering where you did. I now know.
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Yesterday, 23:20
Oh my goodness!!! He said it… its a trap!

Awesome!
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How about all games have a single huge lootbox you pay for up front that contains all the options, items, skins, unlocks etc? I'd pay for that!!
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Yesterday, 23:34
Originally Posted by sakichop View Post
Also, Joxer what are you going on about? don’t you have 500+ hours in metal gear solid a game with micro transactions? < Insert joxer post on why some micro transactions are ok and some aren’t>
I don't know how many hours I have in that game.

However, how many times you've heard me saying you have to play MGS5 MMO part? How many times I've hidden the fact MGS5 has pay2cheat microtransactions?

This is my minireview on Steam, sure it's low quality one, but guess how happy was I with the game:


There's more. Once you enter the game's MMO part, you cannot erase the stain, ever. Because, there is this achievement that says you went your online FOB.
Taken from my Steam profile:


Btw the huge number of hours with MGS5 is a result of me:
- first debunking the urban legend that it's not possible to 100% the game without playing it's MMO garbage part
- making savegames for all those who lost their progress due to a bug (and all of them are uploaded in steam guides section)


No I'm not just a common spammer. I fight for things I believe in. Perhaps not the best ways, but at least I'm trying, for years now. I was never the silent sheep that just waits for the slaughter.
I'm not PC Gamer who crowned MGS5 as GOTY and now when shit from Star Wars Gamblefront 2 hit the fan, now they pretend to be saints.

Originally Posted by sakichop View Post
Never paid for a loot box and never will. Different people draw the line in different spot was just wondering where you did. I now know.
Well I did.
Assassins Creed Origins contain lootboxes. I bought a few. With ingame cash ofc. You can't buy them with real $ in that game. Currently. I can't know for sure it won't change, I mean it's Ubisoft we're talking about.

Did it make me change my mind? No. Lootboxes are cancer that needs to be removed from videogames. Pay2cheat crap too, but leave that aside for now, one step at a time will yield best results.
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Last edited by joxer; Yesterday at 23:44.
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