Rate Bioware games

Originally Posted by GothicGothicness
1. Jade Empire

hmm, it is the only bioware game I managed to get through without getting bored.

Same as me. Well, I'd also add BG 2 to this, I think, although it had some boring moments. I vastly prefer JE to any of the newer Bioware games and would even consider replaying it for the tongue-in-cheek take on the Eastern themes…

Here is mine.

1. BG2 + ToB
2. DA:O + Awakening & ME2 (can't decide which one I like better)
3. BG1
4. ME1
5. NWN + SoU (I haven't played HotU -- I will rate it higher for mods but I didn't like any of Bioware mods)
6. DA2 & JE

I've never played KotOR

Originally Posted by JDR13
I'm the exact opposite when it comes to BG vs FO. I've never understood why so many people put FO 1&2 on such a pedestal. I can only assume it's the setting/story, because it sure as hell wasn't the gameplay.

Not that they (FO 1&2) weren't great, but I thought the Infinity Engine games were a significant improvement.

EDIT: Bleh, seems like you guys already sorted out this conversation

I prefer BG but can see strong points of both series. BG has a far better engine and better gameplay in terms of combat resolution, but a godawful ruleset (2nd edition AD&D is among the worst out there) and somewhat pedestrian writing.

The Fallouts have a much more interesting ruleset, better writing, and more choices and consequences, but the engine is godawful and combat is a tedium (in that it is extremely slow and repetitive and you have limited control over moronic AI allies).

There's also the matter of setting. High Fantasy vs dreary (and sometimes silly) post-apocalyptic.

The Fallout ruleset adapted to RTwP in the infinity engine would have blown both titles out of the water.

My list…

1. Baldur's Gate 2
2. Baldur's Gate & TotSC
3. Dragon Age: Origins
4. Mass Effect 2
5. KotoR
6. Mass Effect
7. NWN: Hordes Of The Underdark
8. NWN: Shadows Of Unrentide
9. Jade Empire
10. NWN OC

For the record I hated Jade Empire's action gameplay mechanics and basic leveling/skills system so I'd say NWN OC beats it there. However, JE at least tried a new setting, had some great music and nice graphics which I'd gladly take over NWN's general blandness, so it is above NWN on my list.

I bought Throne Of Bhall 2 years ago and I still haven't played it yet. Soon. Have not played DA 2 yet.

Also, not sure about Mass Effect's place on my list. I loved the beginning and the end but the middle of the game bogged down too much for me and the Mako was just unforgiveable. However, I haven't played the other games below it on my list in a long time.

Now, if we add the Obsidian sequels on here, my list would look like this:

1. Baldur's Gate 2
2. Baldur's Gate & TotSC
3. Dragon Age: Origins
4. Mass Effect 2
5. KoToR 2
6. KotOR
7. NWN 2: Mask Of The Betrayer
8. Mass Effect
9. NWN: Hordes Of The Underdark
10. NWN 2: OC
11. NWN: Shadows Of Unrentide
12. Jade Empire
13. NWN OC

Of course, I'd have to replay some of these to really be sure about these rankings The only thing that will never change is BG2 & BG1 at 1st & 2nd place and NWN OC at last place!

@Relayer what about NWN 2 SOZ? I've been replaying that recently and like it almost as much as MOB.

Originally Posted by skavenhorde
@Relayer what about NWN 2 SOZ? I've been replaying that recently and like it almost as much as MOB.

Completely forgot about that one, meant to pick it up a while ago, haven't played it yet. From what I've read it will likely appeal to me though.

Originally Posted by Relayer
My list…

1. Baldur's Gate 2
2. Baldur's Gate & TotSC
3. Dragon Age: Origins
4. Mass Effect 2
5. KotoR
6. Mass Effect
7. NWN: Hordes Of The Underdark
8. NWN: Shadows Of Unrentide
9. Jade Empire
10. NWN OC

For the record I hated Jade Empire's action gameplay mechanics and basic leveling/skills system so I'd say NWN OC beats it there. However, JE at least tried a new setting, had some great music and nice graphics which I'd gladly take over NWN's general blandness, so it is above NWN on my list.

I bought Throne Of Bhall 2 years ago and I still haven't played it yet. Soon. Have not played DA 2 yet.

Also, not sure about Mass Effect's place on my list. I loved the beginning and the end but the middle of the game bogged down too much for me and the Mako was just unforgiveable. However, I haven't played the other games below it on my list in a long time.

Now, if we add the Obsidian sequels on here, my list would look like this:

1. Baldur's Gate 2
2. Baldur's Gate & TotSC
3. Dragon Age: Origins
4. Mass Effect 2
5. KoToR 2
6. KotOR
7. NWN 2: Mask Of The Betrayer
8. Mass Effect
9. NWN: Hordes Of The Underdark
10. NWN 2: OC
11. NWN: Shadows Of Unrentide
12. Jade Empire
13. NWN OC

Of course, I'd have to replay some of these to really be sure about these rankings The only thing that will never change is BG2 & BG1 at 1st & 2nd place and NWN OC at last place!

wait until you play DA2 before you get to hasty about never moving NWN OC from last place.

Meh I the only one Ive finished was KotOR, and did some persistant world stuff with NWN. The others I only partially finished before quiting. Im not sure why, but I dont really like the BG games much at all, and havent played any of their more recent interactive movies. So with that said I guess Id rate what I can as:

KotOR (I liked it)
NWN
MDK2
BG2
Jade Empire
BG1

Haven't played them all, but of the once i've played:

1. Kotor(starwars nerd!)
2. Bg2
3. NWN(Hotu was the best)
4: Dragon age: Origins
5: Mass effect
6: BG1
7: Mass effect 2

Of those I played, including one Obsidian sequel (nice suggestion BTW):

1. Mass Effect 2
2. Dragon Age Origins+ Awakening + Dragon Age 2 (yes, definitely a tie)
3. KotOR 2
4. Mass Effect 1
5. Jade Empire
6. KotOR



7. Baldur's Gate 2
8. Baldur's Gate



9. Neverwinter Nights

Okay, so newer games leave fresher impressions, but that 's not the only reason I liked them in the direction given above.

I never finished any of the Baldur's Gate games because I had a really hard time enjoying them, but at least I tried to and came relatively far. NWN, on the other hand, was one of the most boring games I have ever tried to play, along with Dungeon Siege and Max Payne. While I liked the visual style and the armor designer tool that came along with NWN, I could not play through chapter 2 due to acute attacks of boredome … and I tried twice, with two years between the attempts. For me, the only good feature in DS was the ability to alt-tab it and reply to mails while playing. I found Max Payne extremely boring because I disliked the setting, the characters and the fake noir style art direction - take those three away and it's just a rail shooter.

At first I was going to say something about the preferences of female gamers, but purpleblob proves that some girls do have taste.

Nope, you're just weird Jaz.

You think? I just think that for me, the quality of shooters has really gone downhill since the mid-90s while the quality of cRPGs has improved. So I tend to give better ratings to older shooters and newer cRPGs as they cater to my baser instincts while older cRPGs and newer shooters don't . Exceptions excepted.

Originally Posted by Jaz
You think? I just think that for me, the quality of shooters has really gone downhill since the mid-90s while the quality of cRPGs has improved.

You might find some arguments with this one.

BG2
BG
DAO
ME2
DA2
ME
NWN (w/o exp.)

All games ranked include expansions except for NWN which was so horrible I couldn't bring myself to go any further with it. Never tried KOTOR because SW universe never appealed to me the way classic fantasy does. Also the ME universe feels more real, and therefore immersive to me than SW universe.

Originally Posted by Menigal
You might find some arguments with this one.

You sure ?

Originally Posted by Jaz
I just think that for me, the quality of shooters has really gone downhill since the mid-90s while the quality of cRPGs has improved.

Emphasized for … you know what.

1996 Shattered Steel (not played yet)
1998 Baldur's Gate (82%)
1999 Baldur's Gate: Tales of the Sword Coast (83%)
2000 MDK2 (75%)
2000 Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn (87%)
2001 Baldur's Gate II: Throne of Bhaal (93%)
2002 Neverwinter Nights (85%) (100% if I count all mods for it)
2003 Neverwinter Nights: Shadows of Undrentide (87%)
2003 Neverwinter Nights: Hordes of the Underdark (89%)
2003 Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic (87%)
2005 Jade Empire (75%)
2007 Mass Effect (80%)
2009 Dragon Age: Origins (89%)
2010 Mass Effect 2 (75%)
2010 Dragon Age: Origins – Awakening (83%)
2011 Dragon Age II (not played yet - unlikely that I ever play it)

1. Baldur's Gate 2
2. Baldur's Gate
3. BG - Tales of the Sword Coast
4. NWN - Hordes of the Underdark
5. NWN - Shadows of Undrentide
6. Dragon Age Origins
7. Neverwinter Nights
8. BG: Throne of Bhaal

Haven't played the others and will only when I see them in the bargain bin.

1: BG2
2: Mass Effect
3: KoTor
4: Dragon Age
5: NWN 2
6-10: Haven't played those.
11: NWN (that one was bad; sure, modding was a good thing, but I'm rating the game)

Originally Posted by Jaz
You think? I just think that for me, the quality of shooters has really gone downhill since the mid-90s while the quality of cRPGs has improved. So I tend to give better ratings to older shooters and newer cRPGs as they cater to my baser instincts while older cRPGs and newer shooters don't . Exceptions excepted.

That's the exact opposite of how I feel shooters have greatly improved better ai, stories and more open worlds. Crysis, farcry 2 and rear being good examples. Where as rpg's have gotten stripped down, actiony, less complex and more mainstreamed ( a bad thing imo.)

I guess if you like less complex and more actiony games then I could see your point.

I could never get into the older quakes and dooms. Just walk down a corridor and wait for things to come running at you. I'm sure there are probably some good pre-1995 shooters but I don't know of them.

Originally Posted by sakichop
I could never get into the older quakes and dooms. Just walk down a corridor and wait for things to come running at you.

Oh, but at least there were many corridors to choose from, and the games weren't interrupted by cutscenes.
The only pre-94 shooter I can think of you might have liked was Cyclones.

Modern shooters often are too short for me to get sucked in, which is why I replay Wolf 3D, Doom, Heretic and others several times a year. I don't care much about combat in RPGs, though, and if it can't be avoided, it'd better be intuitive or at least over quick (as in the newer Bioware games). Games like Wiz8 or Dungeon Master 2 are pure horror for me - tedious and complicated.

If I could switch off or at least simplify unnecessary combat, I would. System Shock 1 was perfect in this regard - it had four difficulty sliders for the intensity of combat, story, puzzles and cyber space (so I'm actually looking forward to what Bioware are planning for ME 3)…