Jobs that will disappear and what will people do instead?

What happens when there is a glitch and the 'controlling' power goes off or malfunctions? Things do break down. People will always be needed to assist the Cylons!!

Originally Posted by GothicGothicness
Yes, I have invested in solar power stocks myself, I really hope it'll keep improving and there'll be no unknown ill-effects from that. Also I hope they can improve the material usage in those solar farms to be more environmental friendly.. but it is very promising to be sure.

Stocks? Tsk Tsk, the fancy lottery. Good luck to you!

Originally Posted by GothicGothicness
Chemists - Process Machines

One thought on this -

As the production has become more automated, I have actually seen a new 'phase' appear in the product pipeline over the last decade or so.

Before it was Research, Development and Manufacturing, which all had some engineering involvement and trained operators to provide expertise to understand what is happening throughout.

Now we're seeing Research, Development, Engineering and Automated Production. And the time allowed to sail between Development and Production has shrunk, and the expectations of quality increased.

The result is actually more engineers and high level technicians and fewer low level operators.

I think people will naturally be drawn to more intellectual pursuits when the jobs dry up.

Instead of spending your days slaving at a labor job, you will be able to engage in arts, crafts, hobbies, thinking and creative endeavours.

Without a job to answer to every day, controlling your life and your time, etc., you will have a lot more free time to do whatever it is that you truly want to do. I think you can see a new Renaissance of thinking happen because of this.

Once again, Robert Anton Wilson talked all about this in some of his books. He was very in touch with futurism, and was very much a huge progressive, evolutionist and futurist himself. He was also none of these things. If you want to read more of his thoughts, you can just read his books.

Originally Posted by Fluent
I think people will naturally be drawn to more intellectual pursuits when the jobs dry up.

Instead of spending your days slaving at a labor job, you will be able to engage in arts, crafts, hobbies, thinking and creative endeavours.

I hope you're right. One of the things I think you'd see is some top quality community-built RPGs! I'd sign up for a bit of that if I had loads of free time.

This vision of the future does hinge on us sensibly distributing the wealth and labour as jobs dry up, though. We're not showing much progress on that front yet.

Originally Posted by Ripper
I hope you're right. One of the things I think you'd see is some top quality community-built RPGs! I'd sign up for a bit of that if I had loads of free time.

This vision of the future does hinge on us sensibly distributing the wealth and labour as jobs dry up, though. We're not showing much progress on that front yet.

It does hinge on that, but strides will be made in those areas once this reality really starts to come into focus. It will take some growing pains, but the evolution can't be stopped, so I think once people get over the natural fear of the unknown and of the change that's happening, good things will start to happen.

We've already seen a lot of progress in the social media and connected-ness aspects of life. More will certainly be coming and will help us progress to new levels of being.

I don't necessarily think it will take a bloody revolution to get there, just an evolution of thought, which is slowly but surely already happening.

You'd definitely see a lot of great community arts come to light in this future world, that's for sure. I'd love to work on an RPG with people who have unlimited free time and creative vision

Side note, but I think eventually we're going to have to see a serious wealth distribution, as you noted. Robert Anton Wilson suggests all the money going in a big pot (for lack of a better word), and being evenly distributed among every citizen in the country. Everyone would receive the same wage and be able to live comfortably without a job to worry about.

He also suggests that people should be able to choose what their tax money goes towards. So, every month/year, you would get a form that shows what your taxes can pay for, and then you would choose how your money is distributed.

He was a really brilliant thinker. You guys should check out some of his work if you're interested in these sorts of thing. He also wrote a lot about the occult, how the mind works, synchronicity and other interesting topics.

R.I.P. Pope Bob

There is no such think as a Star Trek-like society of leisure. There will always be a caste of workers who do not want to subsidize people who do not work. People have an inborn tendency to despise idlers and it is not good for society. Idle hands are the devil's workshop. People can tell how they despise their mundane job all they want, in truth they want to feel like they have a stake in society and a real purpose, that they are useful. How many of us have spent a few years of our adult life as NEETs? We could explore all the intellectual pursuits that fancied us but did it make us any happy? I know I just couldn't wait until it was over.

I'm a programmer myself, and something I like to say to others is that a program is only as smart as the programmer behind it. There's a reason why game AI is still beyond horrible and we have not progressed in the last 20 years. Technology doesn't have limitless power and human ingenuity is far more vital to our daily tasks than we realize. The job market will keep changing, but there will be no hecatomb.

Why do I constantly make the mistake of clicking "View Post" when you are on my ignore list, Humanity? I must be a glutton for punishment…

I know you want to live like it's 2 AD or whatever, but there are many of us who want to, ya know, progress? People like you who are afraid of change are just going to have to get used to a changing society because it is happening. The cogs are already turning. Either you embrace it, or you live a bitter life where you post on forums about how humans "despise idlers who are not good for society" and say silly things like "idle hands are the devil's workshop". Your views are archaic, brainless, and I would call you dangerous, but I think, no, I KNOW people are starting to wise up to trolls like you. The information age is upon us and there's a reason why society is already changing.

You and people like Pat Robertson can kick and scream all you want but the wave of change is going to sweep you up whether you like it or not.

And do I honestly have to respond to your ridiculous comments? *Sigh*…Idle hands will turn into working hands except the people will be pursuing what they love rather than what they have to do to survive. Remove the burden of having to work to survive and you will release the pressure that is building up on these people, allowing them to explore new avenues and pursuits at their leisure.

You do know many workers live paycheck to paycheck and struggle to survive? But no, these people want this because they want to feel useful? How ludicrous, idiotic, ridiculous; an absolute abomination of an idea!

I promise this is the last time I'm going to click "View Post" on you, my friend. I'll leave you with these words - I'll be praying for you, buddy. Good day, sir!

Originally Posted by Fluent
Remove the burden of having to work to survive and you will release the pressure that is building up on these people, allowing them to explore new avenues and pursuits at their leisure.

You do know many workers live paycheck to paycheck and struggle to survive? But no, these people want this because they want to feel useful? How ludicrous, idiotic, ridiculous; an absolute abomination of an idea!

This is an important point - that much of the sickness and self-destructive behavior people engage in is driven by the sometimes intolerable pressures of contemporary society.

I have no time for the silly argument about people falling into "idleness" - it makes no sense. If you take the yoke off the horses, they don't sit around in the stables all day growing obese on hay. They run off into the fields and start doing horsey things - quite a lot of grazing, running around, and shagging each other, I expect.

If had no more financial concerns, I could give you list of the constructive activities I'd be into, from education projects, to forming a band, to growing my own food. And I'm quite sure that I'm not special - most people would be doing useful things and enjoying life. It's really not that hard.

There'd be a few arseholes sitting around watching daytime TV and eating cheetos, a few psychos causing problems, but there already are. We'd cope.

I guess I should add a list of new jobs created, to the original post.. as there has been some suggestions.

Also the so called "citizen salary" has been discussed as a possible solution. What people tend to forget is that such a solution actually already exist in some Arab countries. I am not sure it'd work out very well, given what happened there. I think actually we'd risk becoming really really lazy and unproductive if such a thing got realized.

I don't think we'd become lazy and unproductive. I wouldn't. My two sisters - one with a medical vocation and the other an educational vocation - wouldn't stop turning up at the hospital or the classroom. I don't think the people who want to land spacecraft on comets, or cure ebola would be any less motivated, and they'd probably be much more suitably funded.

But it's not simply altruism, or a naive view of human nature. I think that one has to remember that we are primates, and a lot of behaviour is driven by social status and sexual advantage. That's not going anywhere. If the almighty dollar was no longer the driving factor and a primary expression of this behaviour, I think new, more constructive, more civillised forms of competition and achievement-seeking could emerge.

Well I hope people would engage in more creative endeavors, and would have the time to think about such things. And they may engage in more self-gratifying activities. I think it would be all across the board. Check out the books of Kim Stanley Robinson, namely

Red/Green/Blue Mars series, and
Earth 2312

There are some interesting updates, as I learned about some new robot workers that already exist in China, I'll post them here as well as update the original post:

Waitress ( Well, I knew about this but forgot to add to initial list, either robot or Drones)
Surgeon ( Much better to do with Robots actually, as they are more precise )
Cleaner ( Robots again )
Nurse ( Robot )
Customer Service ( Robots )
Disaster relief worker ( Robots )

It appears that google is even working on some kind of computerized lawyer service, it might be too early to add as I guess it'll mostly assist a real lawyer, but it could also predict outcome of cases and such a things. Might be something to add as I learn more.

Perhaps even music composer? That would probably be very far off, but there is some interesting research http://tones.wolfram.com/ …. I'll add it.

Window cleaning
"The KITE Robot is currently in its final test phase and will soon be brought onto the market."

Originally Posted by GothicGothicness
Perhaps even music composer?

Not possible.
Take stuff from Kenji Kawai for example. It's something a machine or a random person could never create.

Originally Posted by joxer
Not possible.
Take stuff from Kenji Kawai for example. It's something a machine or a random person could never create.

But think about Beyonce or such a music ? after all that is what sells the most…. hmm, probably I could do a computer program which makes something better….. maybe I should work on that instead of my game

Maybe I should feel ashamed but I heard no song from Beyonce. Saw that name plenty of times in yellowpages though.

Music *is* basically mathematics and as such, AI should be able to compose on it's own. However AI cannot ever understand how to make a music score more "dramatic" if necessary, how to play with human's ear by simple tempo changes, how to nail the point with just switching to a different instrument and how to make the whole of it - not boring.

Take as another example Adele's "Rolling in the Deep", there is absolutely no way a machine could ever drag it that long and then release the tension in the right moment before it becomes annoying. Why? The machine will never understand our brain.

About what sells best, can't say anything. Seems it depends on a current trend, not on an actual quality. Maybe I'm wrong though. Maybe Bieber's stuff (also never heard anything) is much better than Bach's fugues.

Originally Posted by GothicGothicness

Also the so called "citizen salary" has been discussed as a possible solution.

Communism?

Originally Posted by joxer
Maybe I should feel ashamed but I heard no song from Beyonce. Saw that name plenty of times in yellowpages though.

Music *is* basically mathematics and as such, AI should be able to compose on it's own. However AI cannot ever understand how to make a music score more "dramatic" if necessary, how to play with human's ear by simple tempo changes, how to nail the point with just switching to a different instrument and how to make the whole of it - not boring.

Take as another example Adele's "Rolling in the Deep", there is absolutely no way a machine could ever drag it that long and then release the tension in the right moment before it becomes annoying. Why? The machine will never understand our brain.

About what sells best, can't say anything. Seems it depends on a current trend, not on an actual quality. Maybe I'm wrong though. Maybe Bieber's stuff (also never heard anything) is much better than Bach's fugues.

Wow, how did you avoid that? you never listen to radio, go to shopping malls, gyms, buses, public events or such? Please tell me your secret!

Originally Posted by Caddy
Communism?

Well, it is different from communism, the idea is that you get a base "citizen salary" but if you work, or do other stuff you can get extra on top of that. Something like that might actually be necessary in case so many jobs disappears and are completed by machines instead. I guess a lot of more thinking is still needed in this area though.