Sui Generis - Interview @ IncGamers

David Reid of IncGamers had the chance to interview Bare Mettle’s Madoc Evans.

IG: Lastly, anything you would like to say to your fans and those looking for a new RPG?

ME: Too much. There are a lot of things that make this game special and set it aside from other games. It really needs to be experienced with an open mind and no preconceptions about what a game should be or how it should play.

Some people are initially taken aback by it, they expect to absent-mindedly press buttons and run around while things just fall into place and you somehow win and accomplish what you were supposed to. The physics aren’t just for show, you need to really embrace them and use them; information isn’t fed to you, you need to find it and piece it together; you’re not given objectives, you have to set your own. The game is ruthless, it does not want you to win.

The world is indifferent to you, AIs will do their absolute best to beat you. The aim is not to win and be rewarded, it’s to be challenged, to become immersed and have fun, even if you failed to do something. It is most certainly not a casual game, but it’s not complicated either. It has a lot of depth and freedom that are not immediately apparent. If you take the time to figure out what it’s about and how it works you might be captivated like never before.

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More information.

The more I hear about this game, the less I'm interested. I really believe that the developers don't have a clue about what people want and instead are making lots of disjointed parts of an engine that really aren't related. At least that's what I get from it every time I see something. Yes, I'm a backer. Also, they're almost confrontational about the game and that leads to failure 100% of the time.

Hey dude, in games the goal is to win and be rewarded. Real life is challenging enough. Even Dark Souls was about winning and being rewarded and it was supposedly very challenging; at least combat-wise. My only hope at this point is that the devs learn from what I fear is a disaster in the making. Of course, they probably only have this one shot.

P.S. I very much hope that I'm just being a pessimist and that this game is better than Skyrim

I'm not sure what to think about this project. When I read their answers about npcs for example, I just shook my head of disbelief. They sound quite ambitious, but I wonder how will any of that actually work in game and if it is fun.

Hopefully they can deliver all that.

I still can't imagine what the game will be about - which isn't necessarily a bad thing. I might get positively surprised.

But this...

you’re not given objectives, you have to set your own.

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...sounds like a sandbox game to me, which makes me dramatically lose interest. But I'm a backer, so I'll give it a try anyway.

They could use an assertive, Bioware-style designer - preferably in company founder status so people listen to him/her - to set strong story elements and missions.

crpgnut said:

Hey dude, in games the goal is to win and be rewarded. Real life is challenging enough.

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I strongly disagree. The idea that games must be about win and reward led to the state when most games are easy (sometimes even on hard difficulty), challenge is almost destroyed, annoying achievements are flashing everywhere for any ridiculous reason to remind you: you are rewarded, you are great, you are the best… gold is abundant for any banal action, game world is shallow, player is guided like an idiot, people are crazy about loot and rewards and forget about content and stories etc. You simplify very much.

But it doesnt mean I have particularly strong faith in Sui Generis or its devs. Thats completely different story.

@Farflame, your idea of winning is different than mine. I mean that you accomplish goals set by the game. There is a purpose to your existence and that purpose gets fulfilled by your direct actions. That is winning. Rewards can be anything: promotion, the girl, a new sword, building materials, etc.

There are very valid reasons why games follow a certain way of being made. This is called "what works". You can try new ideas, but if you don't have X amount of what works, then your game will flop and you will be a shoe salesman next year at this time

I haven't followed development of this, as it was clear to me from the start that they were way, WAY too ambitious and vague.

I hope it turns out alright, though I wouldn't count on it.

I don't have much hope for game itself but engine looks great.I hope they licence it to dev with more resources and clear vision.

I backed this as my Hail Mary kickstarter, although based on results all my kickstarters seem to be Hail Mary's.

I actually like what I'm hearing I don't mind being set down in a world and going out to see what there is to do. I played skyrim like that for 400 hours. Never completed the main quest and only completed the thieves guild of the major quests.

Now combat will have to be decent and there will have to be plenty to do but I don't have a problem with this kind of game, if that's what it turns out to be. To be honest I'm still a bit confused on their actual direction but I haven't been actively seeking answers either.

I'll just let it develop and see what happens.

This game always seemed a bit like Limit Theory; a marvelous technical exercise with plenty of ambition, but you don't really know if the game is going to be at all interesting. My guess is this release will end up being an elaborate rogue-like.

crpgnut said:

@Farflame, your idea of winning is different than mine. I mean that you accomplish goals set by the game. There is a purpose to your existence and that purpose gets fulfilled by your direct actions.

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But how do you know what is their idea of winning? Or that you wont have a purpose in their game? They are not first devs who tries to make some kind of sandbox.

crpgnut said:

There are very valid reasons why games follow a certain way of being made. This is called "what works". You can try new ideas, but if you don't have X amount of what works, then your game will flop and you will be a shoe salesman next year at this time

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Are we still talking about KICKSTARTER game which was supported because ppl LIKED the basic ideas there?

crpgnut said:

There are very valid reasons why games follow a certain way of being made. This is called "what works". You can try new ideas, but if you don't have X amount of what works, then your game will flop and you will be a shoe salesman next year at this time

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Or you discover a new way that works. Or you get close to a new way that works so you end up selling shoes but somebody else picks it up and perfects the new way.

DArtagnan said:

I haven't followed development of this, as it was clear to me from the start that they were way, WAY too ambitious and vague.

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There's a lot of that going around.

Mainly too vague.

I'm sorry... did he actually say that conversations with NPC's will be developed *after* the game is released? ROFLMAO. This Madoc Evans may be the brains behind the project but he is also a major liability. This game is going to be the biggest conceptual travesty since Trespasser. And that my friends, is saying something!

crpgnut said:

I really believe that the developers don't have a clue about what people want and instead are making lots of disjointed parts of an engine that really aren't related.

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The thing i like about Bare Mettle is that they arent making this game for anyone else but themselves, they are making the game they always wanted. so they dont need to know what other people want. and that they are making loads of disjointed parts thats not related, what do you mean? what parts, function, feature, etc,. of what they currently have created does not fit with the game/engine?

ToddMcF2002 said:

I'm sorry… did he actually say that conversations with NPC's will be developed *after* the game is released?

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read again, it is already developed but its not in a finished state (doesnt mean it doesnt work) and will most likely be worked more upon after release and they got more time on their hands.

While we’ve already prototyped dialogue, this is still in development. To be honest we’re still not entirely sure just how much we’ll be able to accomplish and it’s something we’re likely to continue expanding on after release.

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rjshae said:

My guess is this release will end up being an elaborate rogue-like.

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Exanima (prelude) is actually meant to be rouge-like like, but the main game Sui Generis will not be.

Im a backer of this game and have played both the combat beta and exanima alpha and have had alot of fun testing/playing them. the combat got quite a huge learning curve and requires timing and precision and can be very unforgiving if you make a mistake, so its obvious this game isnt meant for everyone, the way of controlling is unique/different from most games so just the controls can take a while to get used to.

Im gonna quote a guy from the bare mettle forum that i think applies quite well here:

I think Madoc said it best: people need to play the game to really understand what it's all about. People have too many ideas about what a game should or should not be so they automatically reject anything that doesn't fit into their preconceived mold. For many people it's not easy to recognize and appreciate something new as being a good thing; it's much easier to simply avoid the unknown and unproven. This type of person will only praise Exanima or Sui Generis after it's already proven by others to be a great game.

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@StageFrog - I'm also a backer, and played (very briefly) both the combat beta and exanima. I was underwhelmed, and unsettled. Even as a combat simulation it seemed very clumsy an unintuitive. This was not what I expected - especially this far along. It does really seem to be an engine with some content spliced on top. I would not have pledged to this game (rather a lot, I might add) if I have played what I have since played. I think many feel the same, and that is a problem. As for pledging: I pledged to see them make the game that *I* wanted - which I assumed was the same one they wanted, based on their original pitch, but it seems that is not the case.

Same here, booboo. Backer, not impressed and what we were promised in the kickstarter doesn't seem to exist.

Where are the thaumaturges, the exotic treasures and multiple non-humanoid monsters that look like nothing else seen before? I've seen a skeleton, ooh totally new! an ogre, ooh never seen one of those before, other humans, truly special…..

StageFrog if you're only a backer and don't have other interests in the company, tell us some of your concerns about the game. What don't you like? What would you like to see changed? You might want to read the updates and see what was promised by the devs. Do you think what you've seen so far matches what was promised to the people who have paid for the game to be made?

Regardless of your relationship with BM, welcome to the site StageFrog. I'm Mr. Pessimist, so don't take me for the standard RPGWatch dude. I'm the curmudgeon.

I like their push to innovate, but it's not clear they will deliver something playable and fun. We'll see.

Well when they accept my offer for an interview then my opinion may change. I won't judge the game yet, but right now I'm very indifferent about it, and the developer.