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Default Western fantasy games no longer fantastic?

January 17th, 2017, 17:09
I am finding “western” fantasy to be no longer fantastic, at least in game settings. What I mean is that, it no longer get my imagination going. I no longer look at something and wonder what’s going on here. In most cases I have figured things out. Things seems very “familiar” and the mystery and wonder seem to have gone. I guess the reason may be I have played too many “western” fantasy games and used to the conventions.

To elaborate, the types of monsters you fight are all pretty much the same or close variations of each other. They all look the same and behave the same and in most cases have the same lore backgrounds. This also applies to architecture, dungeon design and even world design. I no longer look at a monster or a building and wonder what the hell this is or what’s going on here etc.

In contrast I am finding “eastern” fantasy to be more fantastic and they seem to get my imagination going. The monster and world design is out of this world. They come up with wired ass monsters I never seen before. The world is full of building and structures I have not seen before etc so when I am playing theses games, I let my imagination run wild. I guess the reason for this may be that, I have not really played many eastern games.

Note that I am not saying eastern games are better, they have lot of problems. I am simply talking about the fantasy elements here.

Anyone else feels the same way?
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January 17th, 2017, 18:10
Eh, what? Western( european in particular) were always more grounded, in general, with it's highs and lows. Recently more than usual, at least in popular ones.
Eastern were always more: Weeboos go weeeee….
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January 17th, 2017, 18:54
I was thinking the same thing lately.

I've been looking at RPGs from the last few years that I missed to play in 2017 and most of what interest me are Eastern or Eastern inspired games and its not because I played all the Western ones.

Western games have become very "politically correct" in term of world/setting design to me. It is as if they have to follow a design formula, but even when they don't they come off as bland instead of "fantastic and magical". Too much need to science? Too much design by survey and market analyses? Too much "grey/brown is the new black"? Too much pushing the tech envelop over everything else?

I don't know the cause, but it's been a while since a Western game had any lasting impact on me in term of world/design. Even settings that started cool, turned bland in sequels (for example Dragon Age, so much of the setting design is ignored for "gameplay reasons" in the games).
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January 17th, 2017, 21:05
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post
Western games have become very "politically correct"
This. Not all of them, but the majority. And I'm sick of it.
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January 17th, 2017, 21:43
I think you are playing on the standard "fantasy" games maybe ?

There are games which are different, but may then not be the fantasy you want.

For example Masquerada is one. It may not be your type of game, but it certainly defies the standard fantasy ruleset.
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January 17th, 2017, 21:47
Too formulaic? Yeah, we've had this problem for a few years now.

I remember when my gang went from Junior High to Senior High how we much we got into Call of Cthulhu over D&D. Truth is, one problem with D&D is all the old kids had already own or played all of the TSR modules already. What I am trying to say is that people back then were branching out to find more creativity.

Unfortunately, the unfamiliar is not always marketable. Such was part of the complaint that WotC dealt with after acquiring TSR and they consolidated back to more familiar (nee: generic) grounds with 3e/d20 and Forgotten Realms (with a few exceptions).

This trend in "dark and gritty" and politically correct/liberal agendas has been pretty annoying lately. However, this indy movement, and even 8 bit has been some relief.

However, the 8 bit trend has also moved things in a direction back to JRPG's which have their own repetitive tropes such as the angsty teen and the linear grind to the next cutscene.
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January 17th, 2017, 22:11
Originally Posted by Pladio View Post
I think you are playing on the standard "fantasy" games maybe ?

There are games which are different, but may then not be the fantasy you want.

For example Masquerada is one. It may not be your type of game, but it certainly defies the standard fantasy ruleset.
I think Indie games are more experimental in this regard. Age of Decadence, Masqueradia, and Serpents in the Staglands come to mind, but I'd agree in general with the OP. almost all western crpgs don't vary much from core monsters that were pretty much present in the original Advanced Dungeons and Dragons Monster Manual, and the architecture is for the most part out of the middle ages. Tyranny is decently fresh for a western game from a mid sized developer, though.
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January 18th, 2017, 00:41
If by "Eastern" you mean Japanese, I have to strongly disagree. I still find Western fantasy games far more engaging. I don't like the characters in most JRPGs, and the gameplay tends to a lot more linear.

JRPGs also tend to have a much lighter atmosphere and also a lot of silly humor which is a big turn-off for me.

This is one of those things that will always just boil down to personal preference though.
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January 18th, 2017, 01:07
In terms of getting the imagination going alot of recent games just flat out fail in that regard. Too much of a cinematic emphasis and not enough expansive role playing opportunities (in gameplay & writing) makes the experience stagnant. Characters don't seem authentic and fail to engage while the games play themselves more or less as you go from point a to point b.

Too many developers are just collecting a paycheck and are not passionate about gaming. Thank goodness for indies.
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January 18th, 2017, 02:03
I would say the older we get and the more we play the same type of games the less fantastic they will seem as even the most bizarre will become commonplace over time. You probably see the eastern games as fresh and new because to you they are.
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January 18th, 2017, 02:25
I don't have a problem with this, because really it's up to the player to become invested in the lore of the game and care about it. I think developers put unique twists on things but sometimes it's easy to take things at face value. That's why you get people saying such and such lore is "generic" because it includes used elements, but the thing that will differentiate RPGs is their twist on those already used elements.

I do think some RPGs could benefit from going deeper into the bestiary than they typically do. I think striking a good balance between being familiar enough yet having a twist or a difference that fits the game's lore is essential. There are a lot of fantastical creatures and different ways to do things that haven't been completely done yet.

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January 18th, 2017, 04:53
Another day, another alternate reality.

Dang same-y caves.

Not much to kindle the imagination in Blackreach.

Yeah yeah, right out of the monster manual. You've got AC 5, right?

Can't let this go without a City of Hero's Shadow Shard Shot.

Honestly, I think you folks are getting Jaded!

Edit: A more serious point - a lot of western games are now putting the detail in a bit deeper so the people that don't care aren't "forced" to see it and can get on with slaughtering everything in sight. Audio/video tapes might be left around, or there could be a book on a subject, and so on.
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Last edited by Zloth; January 18th, 2017 at 05:15. Reason: Ooops, got first two shots crossed up!
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January 18th, 2017, 05:00
What game is the 3rd screenshot from?
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January 18th, 2017, 05:10
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
What game is the 3rd screenshot from?
Dragon Age Inquisition, that's "Blinky" (that's how one of the writer nicknamed it, aka an enormous spider covered in trypophobia) and the other thing in front of it is a demon of fear (aka Nightmare).
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January 18th, 2017, 05:16
Ooops, got my screenshots crossed up! (3rd shot is now the 4th)
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January 18th, 2017, 05:19
I must admit, while DA setting in-game is getting kinda bland (mostly because they focus way too slowly on the lore and the politics is way too streamlined), DAI fade demons had awesome (creepy) looks.
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January 18th, 2017, 17:52
Originally Posted by Pladio View Post
I think you are playing on the standard "fantasy" games maybe ?

There are games which are different, but may then not be the fantasy you want.

For example Masquerada is one. It may not be your type of game, but it certainly defies the standard fantasy ruleset.
I have to admit that I have not explore the indie scene much and I am sure lot of different and interesting ideas are coming out. However my point wasn't really around the ruleset or gameplay etc. Its more about the fantasy world itself.
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January 18th, 2017, 17:56
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post
I was thinking the same thing lately.

I've been looking at RPGs from the last few years that I missed to play in 2017 and most of what interest me are Eastern or Eastern inspired games and its not because I played all the Western ones.

Western games have become very "politically correct" in term of world/setting design to me. It is as if they have to follow a design formula, but even when they don't they come off as bland instead of "fantastic and magical". Too much need to science? Too much design by survey and market analyses? Too much "grey/brown is the new black"? Too much pushing the tech envelop over everything else?

I don't know the cause, but it's been a while since a Western game had any lasting impact on me in term of world/design. Even settings that started cool, turned bland in sequels (for example Dragon Age, so much of the setting design is ignored for "gameplay reasons" in the games).
Actually Dragon Age is the type of "western" game I had in mind when was writing this. I think western games sort of need to move away from "medieval fantasy" in order to be fresh I think. They don't need to look far in order to do that. We need games made in the "pulp fantasy" like Conan etc. I think this will go long way.
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January 18th, 2017, 18:00
Originally Posted by lostforever View Post
I have to admit that I have not explore the indie scene much and I am sure lot of different and interesting ideas are coming out. However my point wasn't really around the ruleset or gameplay etc. Its more about the fantasy world itself.
I think you may be surprised at the indie games. Some of them have interesting fantasy settings.

Even Banner Saga has a new type of low-fantasy setting. Masquerada has a setting of masked powers. Then there's even games like Lords of Xulima whose lore combines dinosaurs with standard fantasy tropes
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January 18th, 2017, 18:06
Yes! Was just about to post about Lords of Xulima. The lore is freaking amazing, IMO.

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