Cyberpunk 2077 - Some Devs left

I've already got mine, thanks.

You don't have to agree.

I think we need a Watch certified pitchfork vendor…there seems to be quite a demand :-)

Wow, some people are surely triggered over folks telling the truth about the working conditions in companies they like…

I love CDPR's games, but it really seems like they are a very asshole company with their employers. It's really sad to see the price that is paid to make such good games.

Well, I'm a huge fan of CDP Red, ever since the witcher 3, and will continue to buy their games (at least, the ones I'm interested in) such as future Witcher titles. As long as they keep up the kinds of quality and standards in the rpg genre that they have demonstrated so far, I'll be a customer.

(Polish national anthem playing in background)

#CDPRDevLivesMatter

Originally Posted by GabrielMP_19
Wow, some people are surely triggered over folks telling the truth about the working conditions in companies they like.

Ah.. because people only tell the truth on the internet.

You seem annnoyed that not everyone is jumping on the kneejerk bandwagon.

Originally Posted by booboo
I think we need a Watch certified pitchfork vendor…there seems to be quite a demand :-)

I am a verified capitalist. I will sell the pitchforks.

These people produce great work too. Here are some highly motivated workers for an ambitious company. It's great for the fans/customers!

No matter how great TW3 is, if the rumour is true, it's understandable why some employees left the company. I know sacrifices are needed at times to create something great but whether it is sustainable or not is another story.

Little dramatic. There is a huge difference between slave labor and voluntary 'enslavement'. Anyway I read some of the reviews. This is a problem with many companies that grow very quickly. Early folks get promoted into management position whether they are (or not) qualified. I would say this is the norm. A few companies with exceptional management will avoid this pitfall and some other companies will manage to correct themselves over time but normally it can be 5 to 15 years.
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Can't comment on the pay aspect as I don't know a thing about currency nor demand. I also don't know much about their bonus program (if they have one). Typically I would expect low base salary (unless demand drives it up) but reasonable large bonus on successful release. If the lack the bonus side then I would be a bit disappointed.

Originally Posted by posfan12


These people produce great work too. Here are some highly motivated workers for an ambitious company. It's great for the fans/customers!

Originally Posted by beldurax
Very revealing. Check out this comment to the vid :


I'm a software developer from Poland. I have not worked in CDP Red, but I'm involved in the game dev scene, as well as I've just worked in polish software companies.
The tales of CDP Red crunching are legendary in Poland - basically anyone that's even a bit interested in the game dev scene knows about it, and how it destroyed the people working there.
I can't find better version, but this is a picture of employees that left the company after Witcher 1:
https://i.imgur.com/bjm942Q.jpg
The red crosses are people that left, green ones are those that left and later returned. Most left due to very long crunch period.
This pattern did continue through Witcher 2 and Wither 3 development.

CDP Red is quite young company, that was established by people with little knowledge of running a software dev, let alone game dev studio - they learned as they went.. Most people didn't know how to handle big projects, how to properly plan and time work schedules etc.
There's a reason an "Enchanced Edition" of W1 came out like half a year after the premiere - it was a result of half a year long crunch to actually finish and polish the game, post launch.

Not much changed during W3 development - QA were mostly inexpirienced people working for minimal wages, crunching for 10-12h a day. And when they weren't needed any longer - they were fired or let go. They used to work 10h shift Monday-Friday, and 8h during the weekend.. Some people weren't leaving the company at all, sleeping in the office. One of the former QAs stated that "he was loosing the track of time. He knew it was weekend only because of free pizza, that was provided by the employer". There was almost a mutiny/rebelion by QAs, when one of the demo versions was delayed. It was toned down with 3-shifts-work schedule.
Programmers didn't have it easier either.

Those are not just some random reviews on random sites. Those words come from interviews with people that did work in CDP Red, there are plenty (old) articles in polish games media about it. People as high as the former head of production of W1 and W2 (Maciej Miąsik), Bartłomiej Nagórski (who was almost an executive producer, but quit after learing about the crunches) - software dev who also writes for Polygamia.pl - a polish site about everythig-games-related. There are plenty of other employees that preferred to stay anonymous, when interviewed by the journalists..

So ye - Witcher is great. CDP Red makes great games. CDP Red has great approach to their consumers. But not many really want to work there, especially after knowing a bit more how it works on the inside..
Although there are some good sides of all that shitty inside of CDP Red.. Companies like MoaCube or Flying Wild Hog were created by people who left CDP Red..

Useless. CDProjekt were tagged the good guys. As long as they keep serving, whatever it takes them to do to keep serving, their good guy status will not change.

Good/bad tags are not set in the stone.
From zero to hero can always happen vice versa.

If they produce a good product and treat their customers well then I will continue to support them. If you are employed there and don't like your job look for a new one, if conditions degrade as the result so will their service and product and it will either correct it self or they will go out of business. In the free market that is how it works.
I suspect the workers there would rather have that then the communist system they were under before.

Originally Posted by Terry
If you are employed there and don't like your job look for a new one, if conditions degrade as the result so will their service and product and it will either correct it self or they will go out of business. In the free market that is how it works.

Connecting degradation of the product and people leaving is infirmed.
That would be a very poor management of resources.
People were worked to death in many activities without their departing affecting the quality in the product. It is based on having opportunities to substitute them.
It was one goal in the standardization of processes: people leaving do not affect the product as the production is standardized: people can come in and fill the shoes in quickly.

Standardization ensures that peculiar howtodos does not belong to peculiar workers but to the group they work for. Leaving workers do not retain any of their knowledge, the group extracted it from them. Workers are swappable and expendable.

This stuff has been going for more than one hundred years now so it takes a bit more effort to paint it in another way.

The vid industry has long gone past standardization, so people are expected to deliver a standardized work.

As to the job opportunities, going for another of the same kind does not change the perspective. The change in perspective is when taking a job that is about extracting from people and these jobs are in short supply.

Originally Posted by Terry
If they produce a good product and treat their customers well then I will continue to support them. If you are employed there and don't like your job look for a new one, if conditions degrade as the result so will their service and product and it will either correct it self or they will go out of business. In the free market that is how it works.
I suspect the workers there would rather have that then the communist system they were under before.

This

However, it may be a result of the totalitarian society they used to live in. Certainly in China the work culture there goes back before Communists just as serfdom affected the work culture in Russia.

Poland was know for steel manufacturing and was a model of industry at one point, and obviously they are famous for their union defiance under the Soviets.

Originally Posted by Lucky Day
Poland was know for steel manufacturing and was a model of industry at one point, and obviously they are famous for their union defiance under the Soviets.

But the defiant Poles (and please remember that I'm Polish) can be as meek as field mice. We are kinda of screwed up nation chock full of contradictions…