Originally Posted by TheRealFluent
[MENTION= I'll take a happy life for however long that may be, and if I end up dying from some horrible cancer from smoking, well that's just how God sees fit to end it then, eh?

Smokers do not live a lot shorter lives than non smokers in general. They do risk getting lots of complications eventually, which cause suffering for several years if not decades. The cancer risk is usually exaggerated and the other conditions forgotten.

Not that it's any of my business. I've got my own vices which I enjoy now but will likely regret when I get old.

Not trying to be offensive, but saying "whatever I do is endorsed or ok with God" is kind of a cheap excuse. That excuse can be used for literally anything. For example, someone commits suicide, and says to themselves "well, if I am successful in committing suicide, then God wished it, otherwise why didn't he stop me?"

Of course, we can go to much darker examples, and any murderer can say the same thing. Maybe a serial killer believes in God, and says to themselves, "God must want me to kill these people, otherwise, I would get caught!"

I'm not an atheist, and do believe we don't yet know many things about the universe, and if there is a "God" - in the classical sense - then he also gives us free will and we have our own agency. This means, we are responsible for our own actions.

We can't just do whatever we want and lay it all at God's feet.

Originally Posted by SveNitoR
Smokers do not live a lot shorter lives than non smokers in general. They do risk getting lots of complications eventually, which cause suffering for several years if not decades. The cancer risk is usually exaggerated and the other conditions forgotten.

Not that it's any of my business. I've got my own vices which I enjoy now but will likely regret when I get old.

Yes, there are other conditions. But it's still supposed to be something like a decade less lifespan for (heavy?) smokers. On the other hand you are right that the quality of life is of course something that is often not considered.

https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_sta…lity/index.htm

Also, the good news is that the evidence suggests that if you quit relatively early, say by your thirties, your risk factors for most smoking-related diseases will have returned to similar levels to the general population by the time you reach the age when these diseases tend to catch up with us.

EDIT: Oops, better back that with a sane source.

Life Extension That Works™

https://www.who.int/tobacco/quitting/benefits/en/

And smoking causes wrinkles. Some people may not like that.
Google pictures of non-/smoking twins

Also: gum disease, increased plaque build up, delayed healing, etc.
Bunch of Google links

To me the only reason that mattered and that was strong enough to do a cold turkey without any problem (well, walking around and sipping water whenever I felt the urge): lack of freedom. In the end I detested being addicted, having to smoke a cigarette, especially when being at places where it is not easy to get a smoke inhalation. Definetely no fun.

Yes, apart from anything else, it's something that you want, but don't need, and, if you avoid it for long enough, you stop wanting it, and it becomes irrelevant to you.

Originally Posted by Arkadia7
Not trying to be offensive, but saying "whatever I do is endorsed or ok with God" is kind of a cheap excuse. That excuse can be used for literally anything. For example, someone commits suicide, and says to themselves "well, if I am successful in committing suicide, then God wished it, otherwise why didn't he stop me?"

Of course, we can go to much darker examples, and any murderer can say the same thing. Maybe a serial killer believes in God, and says to themselves, "God must want me to kill these people, otherwise, I would get caught!"

I'm not an atheist, and do believe we don't yet know many things about the universe, and if there is a "God" - in the classical sense - then he also gives us free will and we have our own agency. This means, we are responsible for our own actions.

We can't just do whatever we want and lay it all at God's feet.

Whatever I say your mind is going to twist my words. But everybody is playing their role in the cosmic drama. God is in even the rapist, the murderer, the liar, the thief; Jesus said to the thieves while on the cross that they will be coming to Paradise with him. That is not to justify their behavior, but everyone lives out their destiny as determined by God. God has been kind and loving enough to give us a sense of free will, as a sheep is free to roam the pasture yet still tended by the shepherd. But everything plays out according to God's will, even what our minds perceive as 'bad' or 'evil'. Those who were killed are now in a better place - some cultures even celebrate death, but in the West its seen as dark and foreboding. We all play our role in this divine play and God makes no mistakes. You can lay everything at God's feet.

Well, if I did go off on one, I hope some people may understand how the contents of this thread might have tipped me over the edge.

Bloody hell…

I think we should just nod our heads and smile at this point.

Well, this was something else. I do believe Fluent enjoys Hindu philosophy/religion, at least some of those concepts are from that, if I recall from when I looked into it a little many years ago.

That is pretty far out stuff, even for me. What can I say. I guess I'm glad somebody thinks they know all the answers, because it sure ain't me.

What it is, is a hodgepodge of beliefs, that amounts to nihilism with God as an alibi.

Originally Posted by Ripper
What it is, is a hodgepodge of beliefs, that amounts to nihilism with God as an alibi.

I tend to agree, at least in that seems to be the practical effect of those beliefs.

But maybe I need to go read the Bhagavad Gita, I think this might be the religious book where its said the whole experience of life is but a dream and we all are just playing our parts. I can picture Krishna saying something like - "Good and Evil? Bah, you foolish mortals! How limited you are!"

https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bhagavad_Gita

Anyway, whatever floats one's boat, I suppose.

Yes, some Eastern philosophy, but with a special modern, Western spin, that turns it into nothing but responsibility-free self-justification.

Well, here is an attempt to inject my version of positivity, and to return to the original topic (sort of). I have my own version of religion/philosophy/whatever-you-want-to-call-it. I name it: The Church of the Nice Cup of Tea.

The acceptance of mystery lies at the heart of all the religions, and, in that aspect, I agree - I think mystery is the fact of our condition, I just dispense with the other dogma. I think we are rather like dogs trying to understand a microwave (well, me anyway.)

But, whatever we are, we dislike suffering, we have empathy, and we seem to require a sense of purpose. So, lets try to make sure everyone is fed, housed, educated, and cared for, then spend the next few centuries investigating the mysteries of the universe and ourselves… and having a nice cup of tea.

Or perhaps I'm just adding to the weirdness. I may have gone quite mad.

Tea with or without milk?

Originally Posted by Eye
Tea with or without milk?

Either is acceptable, so long as no madman puts the milk in first.

Seeing this is such a remarkable thread, perhaps you people feel like rating it? I am curious.
Sort of a poll in a poll.
(That is, I think all of the ratings are combined thus getting an average, but I’m not sure… )

Top of the page you’ll see: Thread Tools, Search Thread, Thread Rating.
Thanks!

Originally Posted by Ripper
Either is acceptable, so long as no madman puts the milk in first.

I find the idea of milk in my tea already disgusting. Thinking of doing it the other way around is just…… I have no words for that.

As we have stretched the topic already, I like chocolate. 70-80% chocolate is great and infused with some nuts is even better. Sometimes I combine that with hot chocolate milk and whipped cream. Although that combo I only do in the weekends and it isn’t really depending on whether or not I am gaming. So to stay on topic I drink Diet Coke, tea or water, but sometime I just forget to drink.