President Biden

[JDR13]

I am not American so I can't think like you guys, but to me Biden was just a placeholder President to get rid of Trump. He needs to step aside and let a new contest begin.

Yes, Democrats need to find someone more appealing because I think it's unlikely that Biden would get elected for a second term.

Recent history isn't on the Democrats side here. You have to go all the way back to the 1960's since the last time the US had two different Democratic Presidents in a row.

 

[Carnifex]

I'm not American either yet I can fake it with the best (or worse) of 'em! The politics here are pretty amusing for the most part, I keep hoping year after year that a parliamentary system might spring up and make sense of all this lackluster effort, yet so far it's not happened. A two party system just isn't viable, especially these days. The whole supposed checks and balance system is one of the biggest farces I've ever personally witnessed in action.

And agreed, Biden wouldn't get a second term. The way he's currently limping through this one is painful enough to watch.

 

[Ripper]

I thought this interview was interesting. It references Biden (she thinks he's so dumb he might need watering, but is a genuinely nice man) so I'll put it here, but really it's a much bigger conversation about the state of play. I don't always agree with her, but I do generally agree with her take on wokeness - in some ways it's a bit like the McCarthyism panic, and she thinks it will burn itself out.

She says some nice things about the UK, but I think her critique is honest, and she has some interesting things to say about the differences between the American and British mind.

 

[JDR13]

That was a good watch. I wasn't familiar with her prior to seeing that, but she seems to know her stuff. She doesn't mince words about wokeness, and she's absolutely right that it's a form of neurosis.

She's also right about the American mentality of people trying to have a connection to their "roots" when there's no real connection. I have several friends who think they're Irish because they have some trace of Irish in their family tree. As soon as you put a pint of Guinness in their hand they start talking about the "Old country". It's pretty funny.

 

[Carnifex]

Yeah, I run into that "I'm-irish-or-german" thing all the time. A few pointed questions sorts them out rather quickly, lol. Stick to your rednecks roots and cease trying to glam onto the old world, says I.

 

[Ripper]

That was a good watch. I wasn't familiar with her prior to seeing that, but she seems to know her stuff. She doesn't mince words about wokeness, and she's absolutely right that it's a form of neurosis.

She's also right about the American mentality of people trying to have a connection to their "roots" when there's no real connection. I have several friends who think they're Irish because they have some trace of Irish in their family tree. As soon as you put a pint of Guinness in their hand they start talking about the "Old country". It's pretty funny.

I'm glad someone found it interesting. One of the other things I found interesting was the talk about the Rustbelt situation, and the sort of true American religion of self-reliance and making your own way in a land of opportunity. The trouble is, that was born in conditions that aren't reflected in today's reality.

I mean, there's obviously tons of opportunity if you can become an engineer, a tech guy, or quite sophisticated in business. And of course there's folks who would always tend to have the more basic jobs. But there's a huge swathe of people in the middle who once could have had good jobs in the auto industry, or steel, and so on - but that contemporary economic conditions simply don't provide that, and push them socio-economically downwards. That's got to be a kind of torture rack, when the foundational myths of your society could once be realised, but increasingly not so for the ordinary guy.

 

[JDR13]

I'm glad someone found it interesting. One of the other things I found interesting was the talk about the Rustbelt situation, and the sort of true American religion of self-reliance and making your own way in a land of opportunity. The trouble is, that was born in conditions that aren't reflected in today's reality.

I mean, there's obviously tons of opportunity if you can become an engineer, a tech guy, or quite sophisticated in business. And of course there's folks who would always tend to have the more basic jobs. But there's a huge swathe of people in the middle who once could have had good jobs in the auto industry, or steel, and so on - but that contemporary economic conditions simply don't provide that, and push them socio-economically downwards. That's got to be a kind of torture rack, when the foundational myths of your society could once be realised, but increasingly not so for the ordinary guy.

That's very true, and it's one of the reasons Trump managed to get elected in 2016. He knew exactly how to appeal to that segment of America by making them believe he could turn back the clock and completely revitalize those industries. A lot of the middle class bought into it despite how unrealistic it was. I think she even said something similar at one point in the interview.

 

[JDR13]

Speaking of wokeness…

I first saw this posted over at the Codex. I thought it was a joke at first, but apparently it's not.

However, that's not good enough for a certain Brittni Finley who writes for GameRant. She had this to say..

The caveat to Bethesda's decision to include they/their pronouns, there are more pronouns, or lack of pronouns, used by folks who don't identify with any gender or may have an otherwise heightened identification with genderfluidity. One common example is the use of the Ze/Hir and Ze/Zir pronouns, which are used so as not to assume a person's gender based on attributes or attire. "Ze" can refer to a person who is male, female, nonbinary, genderneutral, or anything else, but is meant to be ambiguous.

https://gamerant.com/starfield-pronouns-they-she-he-genderfluid-nonbinary-options/

She then goes on to say that those additional pronouns should also be included in Starfield and their future games.

I had to read the entire article twice because I actually thought she was being sarcastic at first. She's not. This is fucking insane.

 

[Ripper]

The way I look at it, there's always been people who don't fit neatly into male or female definitions, and might not like to called him or her. I think adopting "they" as an agreed solution for those folks is reasonable - we do actually use "they" in the singular quite a lot when we don't mean to imply a particular gender: "If someone wants to get to Camden, they should take the 168 bus." That's technically, grammatically incorrect, but so widely done that I'd say it's a common usage.

So, if folks who would like to see that option in games want to argue for it, that seems fine, to me. But I think it's this proliferation of personal pronouns that gets into silly territory. It's just not feasible to accommodate every way a person might want to be addressed. A while back I read a guidance sheet that was put out on the subject, and it talked about many of the alternative pronouns out there, and it also mentioned that a person must never be referred to as "it", because that's a slur. Then just the other day I saw a debate where everyone declared their pronouns at the start, and one of them was to be addressed as "it".

Surely it's obvious that this just becomes silly, and starts to defeat the point of using pronouns rather than proper nouns in the first place.

 

[Carnifex]

I laugh at people that attempt to force their will upon me, such cretins deserve all the scorn headed their way. People should focus on being kind instead, it costs nothing and can reap huge benefits. Irking people for absolutely no reason is just a serious waste of time and effort.

 

[JDR13]

The way I look at it, there's always been people who don't fit neatly into male or female definitions, and might not like to called him or her. I think adopting "they" as an agreed solution for those folks is reasonable - we do actually use "they" in the singular quite a lot when we don't mean to imply a particular gender: "If someone wants to get to Camden, they should take the 168 bus." That's technically, grammatically incorrect, but so widely done that I'd say it's a common usage.

So, if folks who would like to see that option in games want to argue for it, that seems fine, to me. But I think it's this proliferation of personal pronouns that gets into silly territory. It's just not feasible to accommodate every way a person might want to be addressed. A while back I read a guidance sheet that was put out on the subject, and it talked about many of the alternative pronouns out there, and it also mentioned that a person must never be referred to as "it", because that's a slur. Then just the other day I saw a debate where everyone declared their pronouns at the start, and one of them was to be addressed as "it".

Surely it's obvious that this just becomes silly, and starts to defeat the point of using pronouns rather than proper nouns in the first place.

I think that pretty much sums it up.

I don't have a big issue with they/their being used, although I do think it's a waste of time and resources for a video game.

The other stuff is, as you said, silly. What irritates me though is that a lot of people would call us intolerant for simply pointing out the obvious. I hope Daley is right about this shit burning itself out, and I hope it happens sooner rather than later.

 

[Ripper]

I think that pretty much sums it up.
What irritates me though is that a lot of people would call us intolerant for simply pointing out the obvious. I hope Daley is right about this shit burning itself out, and I hope it happens sooner rather than later.

Yes, I think that's a big part of how things have arrived at this point. I think two separate conditions are true - there's been a dangerous rise of the far-right all over (with tons of the buggers enjoying letting all the hate hang out online), and also that a section of the left has embraced some flawed and self-defeating ideology, particularly around ideas of identity politics and gender theory. And we have to try to navigate that complexity.

The trouble is, things have become so partisan that people tend to divide into easy camps. And if you try to make a criticism of your "side" in good faith, which sounds superficially like something the other side might say, there's a sharp intake of breath, and a feeling of, "Oh my God - you're not one of those, are you?" I think people are very aware of that, and tend to censor themselves around these contentious subjects, knowing it will likely bring them grief. This is particularly where I think it has echoes of McCarthyism.

I personally see it as a constructive thing to say, "Guys - these are complex issues that need to be addressed, but I think the approach you're taking is flawed, and is going to get you checkmated."