Risen 3: Titan Lords - Review Roundup #2

That's not true, we had Ultima 6-7 (which inspired the Gothic games) and TES (probably also a inspiration), Divine Divinity and a few other open world RPG's. Gothic 1-2 are easily 9-10 for fans yes, i meant in general, they werent games with a high budget and polished performance and UI. I remember the UI, controlls and performance got bashed in reviews (which i think is fair). Combat was also not considered good (which i dont agree with, but i can see how many people didnt like it)
 
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Morrowind came out a year after Gothic, Ultima 9 two years earlier. Ultima 7 was distant past even then.
 
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Yeah just saying it wasnt first and that nothing existed that was similar. I agree that they were unique and not given enough credit for it, but i guess that's because gamers in general doesnt appreciate things like NPC schedules or day/night cycles or that the games had a very interactive environment (which still stands true even to this date).
 
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Sorry but I just can't put Ultimas in the same basket with Gothic games.
Similarity with TES is just the openworld, nothing else even remotely.
Divine Divinity happens from different perspective.

UI was odd, but worked on me. Can't remember reviews nor care, I adapted fast to it. And I never had any problems with combat, those who did should go play Tetris.

9/10 from me wouldn't go because of being fan, but because back then those two games were spectacular in just about every single aspect. Sure, there were some problems and that's why 10/10 just can't be applied.

But if JoWood wasn't greedy EA wannabe who rushed the release of the third game, the history of gaming would look different today. Not only Gothic 3 would be an unquestionable masterpiece, but we wouldn't get an insulting DLC for it nor the silly Arcania game. And PB wouldn't be forced to start from scratch with Risen series.
 
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Realistically Gothic 1-2 are probably in the 7.5 range, though we fans, who thinks those games really "hits the spot", obviously rate it higher (9 - 10 range).

That same logic applies to everything though. Of course "fans" would rate them higher. Just like fans of Grand Theft Auto would rate that higher or fans of WoW would rate that… well, you get the picture.


9/10 from me wouldn't go because of being fan, but because back then those two games were spectacular in just about every single aspect. Sure, there were some problems and that's why 10/10 just can't be applied.

I've never rated anything a 10/10 because, in my mind, there's no such thing as a 10/10. I'd give Gothic 1&2 9.5s though. Those two games are about as close to perfection, for me, as I've ever played.
 
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We'd already had Outcast (and Nomad Soul which I think of as open-ish) too.
 
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Outcast is not openworld, is not RPG and used voxels which were very pretty back then. Awsome game, yet not similar to Gothics. But it was also 9/10 material!
Now Nomad Soul I don't remember, honestly.


JDR, I can give 10/10. A game I can't possibly find something wrong with (apart from nitpicking some bug or bad font used on tavern menu, stuff like that).

Of course, my 10/10 would be completely different from Angry Joe's. So I'd give 10/10 and say "no grindin'!", he would go "this game doesn't have enough mobs to level up on!" and put 4/10 or something. ;)
 
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That same logic applies to everything though. Of course "fans" would rate them higher.

Yes and since there are many obvious PB fanboys i was interested in if the thought the older games were both 10/10 in every area, because then his 6.5-7/10 score (as a hardcore fan) would be pretty terrible.
 
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For the record, Divine Divinity was also a 2002 game. Gothic premiered in Germany on March 15, 2001.
At that time it was one of a kind. It was the first real seamless open world RPG where you could see stuff in the far distance and actually go there without a loading screen in between.
It was an incredibly awesome experience at a time when most RPGs were claustrophobic Infinity engine top-down point&click borefests on tiny maps (oh yes, can ya smell the flamebait, hm? :biggrin: ).

Do we know anything about PB's next
game?

Very little as always.

- Björn Pankratz (Risen 3 project director) said a few months ago in an interview that they already do have concrete plans for the next project. In the same interview he said that they have no current plans for a Gothic sequel. He also said that Risen 3 is the conclusion of the Risen series.
So we know from Björn that they are already working on a next game and that it is not a Gothic game and no Risen either.

- Then Harald Iken (design/story/dialogue guy) said in a Gamestar video that Risen 3 may not be the end of the road for Risen but that anything is possible and all options are on the table.
So, contrary to what Pankratz said, it could be that they are working on another Risen.

- And finally out of the blue this week came Michael "Mike" Hoge, the only remaining founding member of Piranha Bytes, who had simply disappeared from PB after Risen 2. He made a post at the WoR forums which unfortunately does not clarify whether he is still affiliated with PB or not. The post says…

Mattias Filler [ed: ex-PB story guy] made me aware of this thread. It seems that there are more than this one [ed: referring to threads about him] so here is a short statement for everyone who is curious:

1. I was not involved in the making of Risen 3.

2. I did indeed lock myself up for two years in order to work on a new concept, albeit not related to Gothic. A prototype based on this concept is being developed by a small core team since the beginning of this month.

3. Before you ask: I can not give you any more information at this point. First, we deliberately want to take our time with everything and secondly this is not the right place to divulge further details.

Thank you for your understanding that I do not yet want to reveal anything about this new project. Those of you who are interested won't have to wait too much longer though.
So, whether Hoge's new project has anything to do with PB or not remains to be seen.
It doesn't sound like it but I wouldn't totally chalk it off either quite yet.
It is possible that PB had a contract with DS to make a Risen trilogy. There are also lots of indications that Risen 2 was a commercial failure.
It seems possible to me that Michael Hoge officially left PB after Risen 2 to work on concepts to ensure PB's future post-Risen 3.
Whatever it is that Hoge is working on, it sounds like a crowdfunding project to me. Why else would we get any info based on concepts and a prototype soon? A publisher would immediately put Hoge on the NDA leash. So the only possibility is it's either self-funded or he's going to try his luck on Kickstarter.
 
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For the record, Divine Divinity was also a 2002 game.

I know perfectly well when Morrowind and DD came out, he said there was nothing similar in the Gothic 1 -2 timeline, which isnt really true if you take Morrowind and DD into account, i never said they were the inspiration to G1.
 
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Yes and since there are many obvious PB fanboys i was interested in if the thought the older games were both 10/10 in every area, because then his 6.5-7/10 score (as a hardcore fan) would be pretty terrible.

You mean for Risen 3? Personally, I can't comprehend all the low scores it's getting. The game is being badly underrated imo, and the Metacritic score is joke - mostly due to all the juvenile trolls who felt the need to score it in the 0-4 range despite barely playing it.

In my 25+ years of gaming, I honestly can't think of another game that's less deserving of the scores it's getting.

I'm at 90 hours of total play time now, and I'm still enjoying it. It's easily the best game of the year so far for me, and Divinity:OS is the only other 2014 release that I see myself enjoying as much.

I know perfectly well when Morrowind and DD came out, he said there was nothing similar in the Gothic 1 -2 timeline, which isnt really true if you take Morrowind and DD into account, i never said they were the inspiration to G1.

I don't find Morrowind or DD to be very similar to Gothic at all. Unless you're saying that just because they're open-world.
 
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Björn Pankratz (Risen 3 project director) said a few months ago in an interview that they already do have concrete plans for the next project. In the same interview he said that they have no current plans for a Gothic sequel. He also said that Risen 3 is the conclusion of the Risen series.
So we know from Björn that they are already working on a next game and that it is not a Gothic game and no Risen either.

Didn't one of those guys make a comment awhile back about PB wanting to explore a different setting? Something other than medieval fantasy?
 
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Didn't one of those guys make a comment awhile back about PB wanting to explore a different setting? Something other than medieval fantasy?
Yes, over a year ago one of the devs was musing about a steampunk/scifi setting but that was before Risen 3 was announced so it may have been a ruse. I've seen nothing on World of Risen about such a thing since.
 
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I think the employees who made the original games what they were are gone for the most part, so I don't anticipate Piranha Bytes ever going back to its lionized past. As a fan I have no interest in playing this, Risen 2 convinced me they'd always have to compromise for the console fans and they didn't get or care about what made Gothic great anymore.
 
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There was nothing even similar at the market when Gothics went out.

This is just dead wrong. Ultima Ascension came out in 1999. You'd have to be either willfully ignorant or blind to not see the similarities in perspective and game-play elements. That you don't equate the two in quality is besides the point.
I'm also sure that I've read an interview or two in the past that shows Ascension had an influence.

Edit:
The issue has nothing to do with whether you liked Ascension or not, the point was that it was an obvious influence on Gothic. If you can't see and acknowledge that and need to twist the fact into something that's more agreeable to your personal crusade against Skyrim, then I can't help you.

I'd just like to also add a thank you to Moriendor for the informative post on PB's future project. It all makes for very fascinating reading. :)
 
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This is just dead wrong. Ultima Ascension came out in 1999. You'd have to be either willfully ignorant or blind to not see the similarities in perspective and game-play elements.

I totally forgot about Ultima Ascension, probably because i wasnt really a fan of it. It was pretty similar to Gothic's, but in many ways a big step back from Ultima 7 and it wasnt nearly as advanced as Gothic 1. Some of the quests are really similar and are obvious inspirations, like the cleansing of the shrines, which both Ascension and G2 had.
 
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Well, I'm about 30 hours into Risen 3 - and, so far, it's the best PB game I've played.

I still have ~20-30 hours to go, I think - so it can still change, and we all know how the ending can change our perception quite a bit.

But it's utterly fantastic so far.
 
This is just dead wrong. Ultima Ascension came out in 1999. You'd have to be either willfully ignorant or blind to not see the similarities in perspective and game-play elements.
Ultima Bugscension was a game that inspired Skyrim.

The truckload of bugs and no tooltip even if you kill someone had no connection to Gothic.
 
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