KoA: Reckoning - Answers from the Team

I too agree with the comparison to Div2 first half. Watching the videos and the mini map on them, the feeling I get is the game won't be proper open world like TES or Gothic games rather "path" restricted like in Div2.

Hmm.. I'm currently playing Divinity II and I don't find it restricted at all. Sure there are invisible barriers when you get to the edges of the map, but you're not stuck on any kind of "path". In fact, I'd say it's very close to being on the same level as the Gothic games in terms of openess.

Let me clarify bit further, there are no invisible wall like say Bio games but you hit the "edge" of the map quite often since there are plenty of "edges" say compared to Gothic 3 where you can easily run for long time without coming across an "edge".


Gothic 3

Bars are the edges

JDR13 said:

Hmm.. I'm currently playing Divinity II and I don't find it restricted at all. Sure there are invisible barriers when you get to the edges of the map, but you're not stuck on any kind of "path". In fact, I'd say it's very close to being on the same level as the Gothic games in terms of openess.

Click to expand...

People mean that there is tiny corridors to cross to get from Area 1 to Area 2. In Div 2 you have the Broken Valley split in two with a small corridor in between the two zones.

I don't believe it restrict freedom personally.

azarhal said:

In Div 2 you have the Broken Valley split in two with a small corridor in between the two zones.

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Yeah, there are corridors between larger areas in BV too, but that´s where the similarity ends.
BV´s map is far more organic, the open areas have varied sizes and, well, the game is of different scale. Also, from what I´ve seen of KoA´s exterior footage, Div 2´s maps work a lot more extensively with z-axis, which sorta ties to the fact in KoA´s you´re stuck on the ground unless on hot spot.

For a comparison:





I honestly can´t remember a supposedly open world game with worse map design than KoA. Could this collection of mostly identically sized segments be any more artificial? Not only are all these areas artificially enclosed, but, considering the overall size of traversable space is supposed to be roughly the same as in Oblivion, they´re also all pretty small.
Inorganic and claustrophobic .

This is the ingame map of the Southern portion of the Plains of Erathell in your map above...

azarhal said:

This is the ingame map of the Southern portion of the Plains of Erathell in your map above…

Click to expand...

No. It´s an in-game map showing pretty much all of what´s marked as Dalentarth (only two westernmost segments are missing) and Plains of Erathell on the map I posted.
But thanks for posting the in-game iteration, it shows the artificiality a bit more transparently.

It's pretty clear from the in game map that the game world is heavily "edge" restricted like div2.

Basically small regions (circle blogs) are connected by narrow paths to other small regions to form a big region or the world. You can only get to the other small regions by these paths only. I see about 2 to 5 paths to some regions.

This is better than "invisible" walls found in other games but this is certainly nowhere close to the open world to the scale of TES games. I am not sure I will classify this game as open world at all...

I find the name of "Alabastra" cute Maybe I should call a female NPC in my story this way ?

Alrik Fassbauer said:

I find the name of "Alabastra" cute Maybe I should call a female NPC in my story this way ?

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Terra Cotta? Porcelaina?

Click on the link above !

I suppose this area would look rather like a salt lake ?

DeepO said:

No. It´s an in-game map showing pretty much all of what´s marked as Dalentarth (only two westernmost segments are missing) and Plains of Erathell on the map I posted.
But thanks for posting the in-game iteration, it shows the artificiality a bit more transparently.

Click to expand...

You are right about the zones shown. My bad, I should have looked more closely to the geography...

lostforever said:

It's pretty clear from the in game map that the game world is heavily "edge" restricted like div2.

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Not sure why you insist on comparing this game to Div2, or why you keep trying to claim that Div2 is heavily edge restricted. DKS has few restrictions other than the aforementioned geographical features that divide certain parts of the map. You can jump, fly, etc. in DKS, and it has a degree of vertical freedom that few other games can match.

So is it official then? This is the next game for rpgwatch to hate irrationaly?

I'm willing to give it the benefit doubt...and I'm hoping it's gonna be fun. Looks good so far, if you take what has been released.

The fact that Div2 doesn't feel restrictive when you play is actually a good indicator that KOA shouldn't feel restrictive either, because if you just look at the Div2 map without ever having played the game, you might think that areas like the Bandit Camp, the Quarry, the South Valley, and Maxos' Temple are enclosed spaces with just a simple pathway to get to them. And yet, when you play the game, it just feels like you're following a ridge or a mountain or a river and then there you are at, say, the Bandit Camp or Maxos' Temple

Many previews for Reckoning have commented on how big it all feels, and while I'm sure that people went through those little passageways on the map to get from one "bubble" to another, not one previewer has mentioned feeling like they were closed-in or restricted, and in fact several have gone out of their way to emphasize how open everything feels.

So far, all indications are that Reckoning and Div2 are similar in that their maps don't look particularly open, but when you play, you don't feel like you're being restricted at all...

We shall see, of course, but the hands-on feedback has been pretty clear on how open the game feels.

Just because the maps are open doesn't mean it's going to have the same level of freedom. If it's true what they're saying about only being able to jump in "hot spots", then that's quite limiting by itself.

I was walking my dog this afternoon and wanted to jump a 5 inch pile of sticks, but it wasn't a hotspot. We had to track the whole 30 foot length, till I found a patch of sunlight. Fortunately, that spot was hot enough for us to make the leap I reckon I can get used that in a game but it sure sounds funny.

Go Cards!

So we're back to the jumping debate, eh?

No doubt, Div2 is made with the Z-axis in mind, and Reckoning is not. Reckoning instead focused on a much larger and more spread-out landmass. Different design choices and philosophies, but one is not necessarily better than the other if both are done in a good way that allows meaningful exploration.

JDR13 said:

Not sure why you insist on comparing this game to Div2, or why you keep trying to claim that Div2 is heavily edge restricted. DKS has few restrictions other than the aforementioned geographical features that divide certain parts of the map. You can jump, fly, etc. in DKS, and it has a degree of vertical freedom that few other games can match.

Click to expand...

Poor choice of word from my part about Div2. I don't think Div2 is "heavily" restricted but I did feel many times (before becoming dragon) that many of the geographical features were designed to restrict rather than natural feature, say compared to TES games and Gothic games. So to me these geographical restrictions are sort of invisible walls. However I don't really hold geographical restrictions or invisible walls against a game. I still enjoy many of Bio games.

Having said that, in game map from KOA seems to suggest that the geographical restrictions are even artificial than say Div2. Anyway its all speculation right now (but that the purpose of this forum right?!) so need to wait for the final game before we know for sure.

I liked Div2 a lot, but it most definitely gave me an "artificially constrained" feeling that I never got in Gothic or Oblivion. I wouldn't say it was as bad as, say, Fable - but it was noticably "unopen" in terms of what I prefer.

The closest comparison I can think of, offhand, would be The Witcher 2 - but without the vertical movement (flying/jumping). The sense of scale was fine, but I don't like enclosed areas with load-screens between them. That's what makes me feel restricted - or rather "guided" - more than anything. Especially because the areas were meant to be explored in what seemed like a linear fashion. I only completed ~50% of the game, though, so I can't say what it's like at the end. But I seem to recall being informed what level enemies were for each level, and they got tougher and tougher in a linear fashion. It's hard to get anymore artifical than that, and I found it quite unfortunate for the overall appeal of the game.

It looks like KoA will be similar - except that the individual areas will be huge - and that should result in me feeling less enclosed and restricted.

I don't know if there will be much vertical movement though, as I haven't heard mention of that. I always prefer swimming/jumping and stuff like steep hills that I can explore for secrets. But I don't really care about being able to fly. Typically, flying is very bad for the level designer - because they have to find "excuses" for not being able to fly everywhere and do everything in a totally uncontrolled fashion. That's very, very hard to design around - if you want a balanced and evolving experience.

As much as I love freeform exploration, I'd MUCH rather have a compromise as long as the sensation of non-linearity is preserved and I get the huge benefit of having an intricately designed world where everything has a sense of place and can be explored with good rewards.

Oblivion is a good example of the typical scenario when you make a game too open. Gothic is an example of a decent compromise, though I honestly don't think it's the best.

From what I've seen of KoA, and especially what I've heard, it looks like it may just be the best example of rewarding exploration ever. However, that's ONLY if what the developers are saying is actually true.