Elder Scrolls Online - Editorial @ Forbes

I actually considered buying into thsi MMO - I'm not a fan of this game type, but I enjoyed ES - but the price and subs put me off. So there, a data point for you consider ;-) First off, the base game is a lot more expensive than any game I have bought (ever) and then having to pay a steep (in my opinion) subscription each month…nope. I have no opinion on F2p vs subs since I don't play these games, but I would not pay their subscription - it is too high (for me). IMHO, a monthly susbscription should be a small proportion of the retail price, otherwise it will turn people off. But we shall see I guess.

Well, my time is a lot more valuable than money overall.

If something is priced reasonably - and I know I'll get hundreds of hours worth of entertainment from it, I stop thinking about it.

For me, something worth my time is likely worth my money - unless we're talking extremes.

Also, I'm not the kind of person for which a game is less worth my time because it uses a different pricing model.

As long as I can understand the reasoning behind a subscription - I'll support it. But in this case, it's something we can't actually establish being "good" until we see what they do with that support. It's about giving them the benefit of the doubt - and I'm doing that for purely selfish reasons.

WoW brought a subscription model. Millions accepted it - instead of rejecting tax paying to a company like it's a government. Others tried the same model, and it failed. We got free-to-scam model instead.

You want to play MMO -> that means you have to pay one way or another, the question remains which model is lesser evil?

Or perhaps not? There is a third model in some MMOs like Wizard101 or the upcoming speech recognition Bots MMO adventure game where you pay once to unlock content any play for a lifetime.

So there comes a game, called ESO, and you want to try or play it.
Will you lose anything by refusing to play it because you dislike the model? No you won't. But to make an article as a journalist today that you dislike the milking model is hypocritical. Where were you with such article when WoW got released?

IMO previews, reviews and editorials about ESO should skip the payment model and should concentrate on the game content, is it fun or is it not.

I have to admit I haven't played an MMO for a while now, and probably won't play this one either. However, I find the so called "free to play" model much more offensive than a subscribtion model.

Some things you can associate with this game:

- Zenimax
- Multiplatform (ie. lowest common denominator in tech and audience casualness)
- Bottlenecked exploration (huge SWTOR and Age of Conan vibes)
- Zones make freestyle TES exploration impossible
- Poor drawing distance (where vistas should matter)
- Disgusting cutting of content to sell it separately overpriced (this being one of the most important races!)
- No extensive endgame content except for PvP

I really wanted to like this game, but I've never had a blander starting quest chain (that you have to do over and over again for new characters...) or a more boring starter area in an MMO before (maybe it was just the redguard), and that coupled with the above list really put me off. People said they think it'll get better later on. Well, all the MMOs I played taught me that they only get worse and emptier later on.

That said, I really hope the people who buy this won't burn themselves and enjoy it thoroughly, and I see a little chance that later on - when I hear and see more of it - I will change my mind. But for now, for this price and this payment model I find it unacceptable.

It'll surely be a commercial success. It being out on consoles (no real competitor), with 20mil Skyrim copies sold, even if a million people subscribe for a month after the initial free month, they will have made a huge profit, and I think this is what they are doing the game for. Same happened with AoC and SWTOR and tons of other MMOs.

If you've never had a blander starting quest chain, then you can't have played many MMOs, that's for sure

Sandbox versus Theme-Park MMOs

If you enjoy linearized MMOs, by all means give TES Online a try. If you want a return to actual danger and truly free-roaming exploration, consider pledging towards Pantheon.

I know you are out on a crusade to defend ESO, DArt, and it's alright. Been there, done that. Let's pretend we got into a drawn out argument about specifics and semantics of my initial post, where you can eventually feel triumphant, or at least draw the conclusion that everything is subjective.

And maybe it's true. For me - personally - the two racial starting questlines and areas were worse than SWTOR's, and that's saying a lot. I kept asking myself it this will be in the real game or just a placeholder.

joxer said:

WoW brought a subscription model. Millions accepted it - instead of rejecting tax paying to a company like it's a government. Others tried the same model, and it failed. We got free-to-scam model instead.

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Monthly subscription was already very well-established for almost a decade when WoW came along, from games like Ultima Online, EverQuest, Asheron's Call, Dark Age of Camelot, and many more. Could have criticized all those for the same thing.

I agree that the payment model is none of a game reviewer's business, they're supposed to be reviewing the game itself and it should be up to the customers to decide whether the product is worth the asking price or not. I've actually been a bit disgusted reading some of the articles about ESO, even though I do think ESO is an awful game (and not because of the price).

Soulbane said:

I know you are out on a crusade to defend ESO, DArt, and it's alright. Been there, done that. Let's pretend we got into a drawn out argument about specifics and semantics of my initial post, where you can eventually feel triumphant, or at least draw the conclusion that everything is subjective.

And maybe it's true. For me - personally - the two racial starting questlines and areas were worse than SWTOR's, and that's saying a lot. I kept asking myself it this will be in the real game or just a placeholder.

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SWtOR had decent quest lines - but that's pretty much all it had. Not the most objective example you could come up with - but it's not like you're trying

Yes, and you're on a crusade to blindly bash it - and let's pretend you've failed to rationalise your critique like so many others and leave it at that.

Fine by me

Just as an FYI - they are changing things. This was my first beta and they made a bunch of changes in the starting quest line/opening that were not there before. Also when you first arrive in Tamriel.

Graphics seemed a tad better but that could just be me. I am not as enthused as Dart (although it is nice to see him enthused ) but I don't have anything bad to say about it.

I plan on playing - the cost is minimal all things considered and if I get a month or two of fun out of it ... well that is worth it to me.

wolfgrimdark said:

Just as an FYI - they are changing things. This was my first beta and they made a bunch of changes in the starting quest line/opening that were not there before. Also when you first arrive in Tamriel.

Graphics seemed a tad better but that could just be me. I am not as enthused as Dart (although it is nice to see him enthused ) but I don't have anything bad to say about it.

I plan on playing - the cost is minimal all things considered and if I get a month or two of fun out of it … well that is worth it to me.

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I agree, got me to preorder. I found the bit I played so far quite enjoyable and bit more RPGish than your average MMO. Also enjoyed being able to play in first person view.

booboo said:

IMHO, a monthly susbscription should be a small proportion of the retail price, otherwise it will turn people off. But we shall see I guess.

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On this site, there is an article explaining there is no much room for variation of monthly fees: it is either around $15 per month or free to play.

Drithius said:

If you enjoy linearized MMOs, by all means give TES Online a try. If you want a return to actual danger and truly free-roaming exploration, consider pledging towards Pantheon.

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It was enough to watch 10 seconds of the intro video to understand this KS wont make it.

Subscriptions help keep away more of the kiddies. Free games are just a grief-fest.