The "I Just Bought" thread

[pibbuR]

Are they quite tolerant to slight changes of position? For example, if you look up and down, or if the headset moves slightly with time?

The feeling must be strange.

That is (or used to be) a known problem with this type of headphones, but these are not affected by head moving, or chewing (another known problem). Another known problem is that they tend to glide when lying on the back - I haven't tried that.

Yes it is a bit weird. But they work!

I definitely recommend these headphones if their main purpose is important to you. They are IMO in the top range of bone conducting thingies. But make sure that you can return them if they you don't like them. They're more than good enough for me, but very likely not good enough for everyone.

pibbuR

PS. They come with a pair of spongy earplugs which you can use to block sounds from the outside. These will no doubt improve sound quality significantly, but still probably not enough for audiophiles. I haven't tried them. DS

 

[pibbuR]

I'm glad I learned what bone conduction earphones are so I can avoid them.

Not that there's anything wrong with them. I just really dislike being able to hear outside noise when I'm gaming or listening to music. I can see the use for them though.

I use them when walking outside, when for safety reasons hearing outside noise (cars) is important. And when exercising, because they are very waterproof. When exercising at home, that is - they're not very useful at training facilities because of the loud, usually despicable music they force upon me there.

And of course, they're definitely not my gaming/music headset.

 

[pibbuR]

Here's a review of the headset, which tells you exactly what you need to know: https://www.techhive.com/article/1512949/philips-taa6606-sports-headphone-review.html

As stated they're not very good for listening to music, but to me, as a non audiofile, they're good enough.

pibbuR the pusher

 

[danutz_plusplus]

I've been wanting to try a wheel for racing games for years, but was never too enthused to actually pull the trigger. Well I guess there's a day for everything.

Logitech G923 TRUEFORCE Sim Racing Wheel for Xbox, Playstation and PC

Shop G923 Racing Wheel. Features next gen force feedback, launch assist control, premium build, RPM indicator, on-wheel controls, progressive brake pedal and more.

www.logitechg.com

Logitech G Driving Force Shifter for G29 and G920 steering wheel

Shop Driving Force Shifter for G923/G29/G920 Racing Wheel. Features 6 speed H pattern with reverse gear, steel and leather construction, and durable built in clamps.

www.logitechg.com

Got this pair and will be interested how these work. Only bad thing is I'll need to constantly mount/unmount them from my desk since I don't have the room or money to get one of those racing frames that you can mount these to.
I'll be curious how it feels. I think that at least my ultrawide 38" will prove to be very useful.

I also haven't ever driven a car and don't have a permit, and was never really interested in getting one.
I wonder what the chances are at learning at least the basics of driving on something like this.

 

[Redglyph]

I've been wanting to try a wheel for racing games for years, but was never too enthused to actually pull the trigger. Well I guess there's a day for everything.

Logitech G923 TRUEFORCE Sim Racing Wheel for Xbox, Playstation and PC

Shop G923 Racing Wheel. Features next gen force feedback, launch assist control, premium build, RPM indicator, on-wheel controls, progressive brake pedal and more.

www.logitechg.com

Logitech G Driving Force Shifter for G29 and G920 steering wheel

Shop Driving Force Shifter for G923/G29/G920 Racing Wheel. Features 6 speed H pattern with reverse gear, steel and leather construction, and durable built in clamps.

www.logitechg.com

Got this pair and will be interested how these work. Only bad thing is I'll need to constantly mount/unmount them from my desk since I don't have the room or money to get one of those racing frames that you can mount these to.
I'll be curious how it feels. I think that at least my ultrawide 38" will prove to be very useful.

I also haven't ever driven a car and don't have a permit, and was never really interested in getting one.
I wonder what the chances are at learning at least the basics of driving on something like this.

With 3 pedals and a manual gear lever, nice! It's good-looking too. You'll see, racing sims are a completely different game with a FFB wheel drive.

I bought a T500 RS long ago. Maybe not the best because of the belt system, which tends to lose grip after a while when you play for more than short sessions, but cheaper than direct drive and doesn't require a special stand (direct drive are real beasts).

I did buy a stand (Wheelstandpro). It's easy and quick to install, and you don't get vibrations and shocks on your desk all the time, so I highly recommend it. But you'll see how it goes without it; maybe it's fine for you.

Finally, if the 38" proves not to be enough, you should check tracking devices like TrackIR or competitors. It's less often used with racing sims than with flight sims, but I find it more immersive. But yeah, yet more things to buy and more wires to trip over.

Don't expect to learn much about driving a normal car with simulators, even good ones like rFactor 2 or Assetto Corsa. Perhaps you can train somewhat to learn how to use a clutch on a manual transmission, but sims are very race-oriented so most of what you'd use to drive every day isn't there (no turning indicators, no parallel-park exercises, no finding your way in the middle of a traffic jam, ...). Though I remember a game, City Car Driving I think, which was about driving normally in a city environment, but I never tried and it seems pretty old now (perhaps there are more recent ones - I'm not into that any more).

EDIT: If the question was more a concern about using your device, don't worry. I think you can learn that pretty quickly even if you don't drive IRL.

The FFB is very different from one game to the other, and it usually requires a little time to get used to it and feel what it's telling you. Once you get it, it's hard to go back to a simple pad. It's like playing in 3D for the first time after playing platformers.

Do you have a particular game in mind? The 3 I found great were rF2, Assetto Corsa (I started with AC, then ACC when it was released), and R3E. Before that, I spent some time with Project Cars, but it's not good. I've heard very good things about Automobolista 2, too. Then there's iRacing, but it's online, requires a subscription, and it's mostly US cars and tracks unless you buy extra packs.

 

[danutz_plusplus]

Wow, thanks for all the pointers. The Wheelstandpro looks amazing, and it doesn't seem to occupy any significantly more space than just hooking the wheel to the desk. I think I'm definitely going to jump on that one.
As for games, I do have a few I want to try out. Not sure if I'm ready for the more sim ones. I did recently pick up Forza Horizon 5.

 

[Redglyph]

As for games, I do have a few I want to try out. Not sure if I'm ready for the more sim ones. I did recently pick up Forza Horizon 5.

Yes, those I mentioned are quite focused on the sim/physics, which isn't everyone's cup of tea. I don't know the improvements they got, but a few years ago they didn't have much in terms of campaign, which is another aspect if you want to have fun. I don't really know FH5 but FH had a good reputation, and the game has a campaign and other modes, so that sounds rather cool.

 

[danutz_plusplus]

Yes, those I mentioned are quite focused on the sim/physics, which isn't everyone's cup of tea. I don't know the improvements they got, but a few years ago they didn't have much in terms of campaign, which is another aspect if you want to have fun. I don't really know FH5 but FH had a good reputation, and the game has a campaign and other modes, so that sounds rather cool.

I will probably want to try those at one point, after I get accustomed to the new peripherals. On keyboard or controller I never had the patience for all the minutiae in terms of settings. We'll see.

 

[danutz_plusplus]

Ok I tried the new wheel in Dirt Rally 2.0 and man am I awful. It's incredible how many things you have to synchronize in order to properly drive.
Which is obvious, duh, but until I actually had to respond in split seconds between steering, two feet for gas or brake and another arm on the manual shifter.
Holy shit. For the most part I was everywhere with the car except on the middle of the road. In crevices, holes and over boulders.
The feeling's pretty cool but this will take a long time for me to get a hold of. And right now I'm also still in pain with my right shoulder and it easily tires out.
I was also surprised how tired my ankle/foot got from all the gradual accelerating. Way more involved than I imagined.

Oh, a question. Is it normal that out of the 3 pedals, the brake pedal seems to be considerably harder to press, compared to the clutch or gas?
The spring under it seems to offer at least double or triple resistance compared to the gas one.

 

[Redglyph]

Ok I tried the new wheel in Dirt Rally 2.0 and man am I awful. It's incredible how many things you have to synchronize in order to properly drive.
Which is obvious, duh, but until I actually had to respond in split seconds between steering, two feet for gas or brake and another arm on the manual shifter.
Holy shit. For the most part I was everywhere with the car except on the middle of the road. In crevices, holes and over boulders.

That's what makes it so fun.
It takes some time to recognize the clues and to build reflexes (conditioned responses), but they'll come.

Oh, a question. Is it normal that out of the 3 pedals, the brake pedal seems to be considerably harder to press, compared to the clutch or gas?
The spring under it seems to offer at least double or triple resistance compared to the gas one.

Yes, it's the same in reality. Which is good, because the brake pedal is sometimes used in an emergency, and it's natural to stomp on it in those situations. If it wasn't hard, you'd block the wheels each time and crash. Of course, anti-blocking systems have existed for a while, but I don't think they have it on all racing cars (and it wasn't always there).

As a general rule, you can brake heavily when you're fast, but the slower you get, the more easily you'll start skidding. It also depends on the tyre temperature, for games that handle it. When they're cold, or when the track is cold, it's easier to lose control when braking or taking a sharp turn. Check also 'trail braking' and 'apex'; racing's all about finding the ideal trajectory and staying on it with a good synchronization between those pedals.

 

[danutz_plusplus]

That's what makes it so fun.
It takes some time to recognize the clues and to build reflexes (conditioned responses), but they'll come.


Yes, it's the same in reality. Which is good, because the brake pedal is sometimes used in an emergency, and it's natural to stomp on it in those situations. If it wasn't hard, you'd block the wheels each time and crash. Of course, anti-blocking systems have existed for a while, but I don't think they have it on all racing cars (and it wasn't always there).

As a general rule, you can brake heavily when you're fast, but the slower you get, the more easily you'll start skidding. It also depends on the tyre temperature, for games that handle it. When they're cold, or when the track is cold, it's easier to lose control when braking or taking a sharp turn. Check also 'trail braking' and 'apex'; racing's all about finding the ideal trajectory and staying on it with a good synchronization between those pedals.

Interesting. I'll bet there's loads of little details I'll keep finding out about.

Yeah, I assume after enough repetition I'll probably get the hang of it, but it's funny that currently it feels like that exercise of trying to rub your belly and tap your had with both arms at the same time in different rythms.

I'm constantly in the wrong the gear, because I just forget to switch. Or I often am not sure to which one I shifted. The H letter manual transmition (took me a while to realize that I need to set the game to that for it to even use the logitech shifter) is a bit bewildering. I noticed in some videos featuring other shifters that some have all the positions of the shifter exposed, so you clearly see in which one it is. Why exactly do then some of them, mine included, have the positions covered in that textile leathery skin? Are you supposed to know the position by feel and covering it makes sure you don't take your eyes of the road? (in a real care scenario I mean).

I also ordered one of those wheelstandpro stands, since you were right; you cannot let the wheel have force feedback enabled while attached to the desk. The desk just shakes all over.

 

[Redglyph]

Are you supposed to know the position by feel and covering it makes sure you don't take your eyes of the road? (in a real care scenario I mean).

I've always assumed so, but I can only speak for me. I started driving with a manual gearbox, and I quickly got used to the positions. When I'm not sure of which gear I'm currently in, I just touch the lever without looking at it (an habit I developed when I had to start the car at traffic lights). Usually I can also tell from the noise and frequency of the engine (and estimating the current speed). It all comes quickly with practice.

Later, I drove a dual-clutch transmission with up/down paddles. That was trickier because I had to look at the current gear on the dashboard; that's when I started not forgetting which gear I was in (especially since the car was more insulated and the motor less audible). So it's also something you can train.

 

[danutz_plusplus]

@Redglyph My wheelstand arrived and I assembled all parts on it. And so I also enabled force-feedback and all the physical stimulants. It's definitely a different experience with these turned on and the wheel constantly shaking and vibrating.
But one thing I don't get. During races the wheels seems to constantly be turning on it's own. Is this to simulate how the wheel feels in reality when the car's wheels are affected by the surface of the ground?
I feel like I'm constantly fighting it. And if I don't hold it down it'll constantly whirl in any direction the car is moving.
But I don't get if the car is moving and the wheel is simply responding to that, since the steering wheel is connected to the orientation of the wheels, or if it's the other way around.
I'm confused if this is intended, or did I accidentally turn on some steering assist? I thought I disabled all assists.

 

[Redglyph]

@Redglyph My wheelstand arrived and I assembled all parts on it. And so I also enabled force-feedback and all the physical stimulants. It's definitely a different experience with these turned on and the wheel constantly shaking and vibrating.
But one thing I don't get. During races the wheels seems to constantly be turning on it's own. Is this to simulate how the wheel feels in reality when the car's wheels are affected by the surface of the ground?
I feel like I'm constantly fighting it. And if I don't hold it down it'll constantly whirl in any direction the car is moving.
But I don't get if the car is moving and the wheel is simply responding to that, since the steering wheel is connected to the orientation of the wheels, or if it's the other way around.
I'm confused if this is intended, or did I accidentally turn on some steering assist? I thought I disabled all assists.

It does sound like the game trying to keep you on the ideal trajectory or something similar. Did it always do that? Are you racing on the track when it does that, or is it in the pits or somewhere else?

Maybe it's the caster angle - the angle between the steering axis and the vertical, if you look at a car from its side. You shouldn't have to fight it much, though, and it never struck me as odd, unless your car is too heavily tuned.

• With a negative caster, it's unstable. It means that if you're in a turn, the wheel wants to turn even more in the same direction, a little like what you describe. It makes the car more agile on a track with many bends, but it can be annoying to handle.
• With a positive caster, it's stable: the wheel tends to get back as if it wanted to drive straight. You must make more efforts in bends, but it doesn't require constant corrections in straights.

If you see a settings like that, you could play with it and make it less negative or even slightly positive.

 

[danutz_plusplus]

It does sound like the game trying to keep you on the ideal trajectory or something similar. Did it always do that? Are you racing on the track when it does that, or is it in the pits or somewhere else?

Maybe it's the caster angle - the angle between the steering axis and the vertical, if you look at a car from its side. You shouldn't have to fight it much, though, and it never struck me as odd, unless your car is too heavily tuned.

• With a negative caster, it's unstable. It means that if you're in a turn, the wheel wants to turn even more in the same direction, a little like what you describe. It makes the car more agile on a track with many bends, but it can be annoying to handle.
• With a positive caster, it's stable: the wheel tends to get back as if it wanted to drive straight. You must make more efforts in bends, but it doesn't require constant corrections in straights.

If you see a settings like that, you could play with it and make it less negative or even slightly positive.

No, I was in Dirt Rally, just some random driving in some backyard. Not a race. I'd drive around, and as the car would move around, the steering wheel itself would also turn. Sometimes I feel it turning itself back to neutral position.
But this only happens now that I turned force feedback on. With feedback off I'm getting nothing. But I can't distinguish if it's simply the force feedback or if it's something else.
I tried the same in Forza Horizon 5, and felt pretty much the same thing. The wheel constantly fighting me.

 

[Redglyph]

No, I was in Dirt Rally, just some random driving in some backyard. Not a race. I'd drive around, and as the car would move around, the steering wheel itself would also turn. Sometimes I feel it turning itself back to neutral position.
But this only happens now that I turned force feedback on. With feedback off I'm getting nothing. But I can't distinguish if it's simply the force feedback or if it's something else.
I tried the same in Forza Horizon 5, and felt pretty much the same thing. The wheel constantly fighting me.

It's normal you don't feel anything without FFB. The motor is turned off and there's no torque to fight against.

Most games let you set the amount of torque and the sensitivity, so maybe it's just that.

When you're in a car, you feel the road through the steering wheel, which is what it's trying to emulate. Each bump on the road make the wheel jerk a little; it's sudden and short, then it stops. When you're in a bend, the wheel may want to turn on its own depending on the caster and other things; it will do it constantly and smoothly as long as you're turning. You also feel it's easier or harder to turn the wheel, which depends whether you're slow or fast (trying to turn when you're stopped is harder, normally). If you have lost adherence, it's very easy to turn the wheel, as if no force was required - usually a very bad sign. All the nuances in-between give you clues about what's happening.

If the torque of your FFB is set too high, all those feelings will be amplified and the steering wheel will be all over the place. I suppose that a rally game is even worse since the ground is uneven.

In real racing cars, it's actually very exhausting and pilots need to exercise a lot to have the strength for an entire race.

 

[Redglyph]

Some games are just bad with FFB. If you have another one, it could be worth trying. Rally games are usually quite difficult, too. Maybe it's not the best to learn racing with FFB.

 

[danutz_plusplus]

Some games are just bad with FFB. If you have another one, it could be worth trying. Rally games are usually quite difficult, too. Maybe it's not the best to learn racing with FFB.

Yeah, between Forza and Dirt Rally 2, it was way worse in Forza. Constantly had the car spin out of control, and then the wheel would turn on its own. Kinda felt something similar in Dirty Rally but much less.
I guess I should just enjoy it and not bother too much. But I am starting to get a feeling this wheel might've been too much of an impulse buy. I kind feel I force myself to play, and lost a bit of the enthusiasm. Then I kind of got it back after getting taste of FFB.
I'll just let it flow naturally, and not force myself.

 

[Redglyph]

Yeah, between Forza and Dirt Rally 2, it was way worse in Forza. Constantly had the car spin out of control, and then the wheel would turn on its own. Kinda felt something similar in Dirty Rally but much less.
I guess I should just enjoy it and not bother too much. But I am starting to get a feeling this wheel might've been too much of an impulse buy. I kind feel I force myself to play, and lost a bit of the enthusiasm. Then I kind of got it back after getting taste of FFB.
I'll just let it flow naturally, and not force myself.

It takes some time to get adjusted. Don't form an opinion too quickly.

With my first sim, I remember some cars were much better than others, and the game needed some adjustments to be enjoyable. Still, it also took a while to really appreciate the FFB.

 

[danutz_plusplus]

I refunded Forza Horizon 5, since it's just too chaotic and fast for a wheel, with FFB. The wheel is just all over the place.
I'll stick to Dirt Rally 2 for now, and probably look into other more simulation type games.