Three categories

[GothicGothicness]

Writing
Ultima 7
PS: Torment
( Will update with third one later )

Combat:
Kings Bounty ( all three of them )
Ogre Tactics: Let us Cling Together ( might very well be number one )
Wizardy 7,8

Atmosphere
Gothic 1
Ultima 7
Diablo

 

[Nameless one]

Combat:
Kings Bounty ( all three of them )

Does KB count as RPG?If so I like to edit my third option.

 

[GothicGothicness]

It should count as an RPG most certainly,

C&C -> Check ( it is more than in some tradional RPG's )
Quests -> More than most RPG's
Char Development -> More than a lot of RPG's
Exploration -> Again more than a lot of RPG's

And it is definetly more RPG than a lot of other games mentioned in the combat section of this thread

 

[DArtagnan]

Interesting input - thank you!

I'm quite surprised that so many of you aren't particularly invested in combat. I would have thought that a rare position. Interesting.

As for Bioshock Infinite - that would most definitely have been my number one if I considered it an RPG. Still, I mentioned BioForge - and let's not get hung up on rigid definitions. So, great choice - and I wholeheartedly agree with it!

 

[Corwin]

Writing: PS-T; U7; G2/Fallout1&2

Combat: Fallout 1&2; M&M 3-5; UU2

Atmosphere: System Shocks; Arx Fatalis; UU1&2

 

[Menigal]

Hmmm…

Writing:
Planescape Torment, naturally.
I suppose if you ignore the emogoth WoD crap, VtM: Bloodlines had some good writing. I might just be listing that becuse it came to mind when I thought of atmosphere.
Nothing else really stands out. There are lots of fun, servicable bits of writing out there, but for me the game itself is what I'm there for.

Combat:
Temple of Elemental Evil and the early Gold Box games for tactical, classic RPG combat.
Skyrim does some aspects of action combat quite well and is probably the most enjoyable of that group for me.
FO1 and 2 are pretty high up there, too.

Atmosphere:
Morrowind, and to a lesser extent some bits of Skyrim.
Bloodlines, again, and I loathe modern illuminati-vampire fiction with a passion.
Arcanum felt a bit sketchy at times, but the atmosphere really made that game.

 

[Menigal]

Interesting input - thank you!

I'm quite surprised that so many of you aren't particularly invested in combat. I would have thought that a rare position. Interesting.

It shows how much views have changed over the years. Once upon a time that was one of the most important parts of an RPG. Of course, these days gameplay tends to be marginalised in favor of flashy NPCs and cinematic stories.

 

[DArtagnan]

It shows how much views have changed over the years. Once upon a time that was one of the most important parts of an RPG. Of course, these days gameplay tends to be marginalised in favor of flashy NPCs and cinematic stories.

Hmm, not sure I agree actually. Well, except that cutscenes and "experience-driven" content is way too big a part of a modern AAA game.

I think combat has a tendency to dominate all aspects of gameplay - and I think many games would be served by reducing the amount of "filler" combat.

Bioware games in particular suffer from this issue - but it's really a very widespread approach.

Maybe it's because I've gotten older - but I just don't find constant combat all that appealing. Maybe that's why I'm not such a big fan of Dark Souls - because that's essentially what that game is all about.

That's probably also why I tend to prefer freeform and open world games, because you can often avoid combat in a non-linear environment. Incidentally - I always play stealth characters - where I used to always play some variety of melee warrior in the past

Hehe, a pattern!

 

[wolfgrimdark]

Not to get to off-topic but the combat issue with me is filler mainly. I just don't enjoy constant combat. I think I like Skyrim for that as well - so much to do and combat is there when you want it. I would prefer far less filler combat and more deeper battles. It is why I tend to play on easy except for boss fights - dislike trash mobs in any game most of the time (although sometimes it is fun to feel powerful).

 

[GothicGothicness]

Well, Basically to construct a really good and complex combat system takes a lot of time and is very hard to right. To create CG Cinematics is not hard to do given that you have enough resources. So I think it is easy to understand why the AAA developers mostly takes that route.

 

[DArtagnan]

Well, Basically to construct a really good and complex combat system takes a lot of time and is very hard to right. To create CG Cinematics is not hard to do given that you have enough resources. So I think it is easy to understand why the AAA developers mostly takes that route.

But once you've constructed your combat system - it becomes exceedingly trivial to create encounters. Which is why there's SO VERY MUCH filler combat in most games of today.

Well, that's my theory - anyway.

 

[GothicGothicness]

That and the fact that if the game lasts for 15 hours, you get a whole lot of complains, but if it lasts for 40+ hours.. none is complaining. Even if the 15 hours was 4 times as high quality as the 40+ hours.

I don't mind if there is quite a lot of combat if the system is REALLY good though. My problem is that there are so many games with filler combat that's just not any good.

 

[DArtagnan]

That and the fact that if the game lasts for 15 hours, you get a whole lot of complains, but if it lasts for 40+ hours.. none is complaining. Even if the 15 hours was 4 times as high quality as the 40+ hours.

I don't mind if there is quite a lot of combat if the system is REALLY good though. My problem is that there are so many games with filler combat that's just not any good.

Well, I don't like short RPGs - especially if they're open world RPGs.

But 40 hours of nothing but filler combat wouldn't make for a very good long RPG.

A balance is required. I think the first Mass Effect had a reasonable enough balance - because combat was mostly very quick and exploration seemed to be a higher focus. Well, except the optional planet quests - which were horrible.

But ME2 and especially ME3 had too much focus on combat - and combat was too drawn out. A high amount of combat can be fine if the combat system is fast and furious.

Temple of Elemental Evil has FANTASTIC combat - but way too much of it for my tastes. Fights take a long time and can be frustrating because of it.

Wizardry 8 has a good combat system - but WAY too much filler combat. It's obscene - really.

Might and Magic 6 has too much filler combat - but is somewhat balanced out by being quite fast and simplistic.

Dragon Age was a very good RPG - but filler combat was definitely a big issue. WAY too much - especially in those dreadful dwarven underground levels. Ugh!

In my opinion, examples of the right balance would be Gothic and Skyrim. Both are open world games - and both games allow for the player to do things more or less at his own pace. Skyrim melee combat isn't that good - but archery is the best archery I've played - especially when you're a stealth character.

There's really no golden rule that can apply to every game.

 

[Corwin]

Wow, for once I agree with Dart!!

 

[Thrasher]

Here's mine:

Writing
Planescape: Torment
NWN2: Mask of the Betrayer
Vampires: Masquerade (?)

why so many colons?

Combat
Temple of Elemental Evil
Gold Box games
3-way: Wizardry 8 or Gothic II or Dark Messiah of Might and Magic

Atmosphere
Morrowind
Skyrim
System Shock 2 (?)

plus another couple categories near and dear to my heart

Character Building
Neverwinter Nights with all expansions and Kaedrins PRC pack
Wizardry 8
Temple of Elemental Evil

Exploration
Morrowind
Skyrim
Might and Magic: Worlds of Xeen

 

[Zloth]

Man, these things are always hard, even when you just limit to RPGs. I know there are bunches that I'm just forgetting.

Writing
Planescape: Torment - good overall story and lots of interesting characters.

Elder Scrolls: Oblivion - the main story wasn't all that much until the VERY end but I do remember lots of really good side-quests. The troll painting, the paranoid guy, SAVE the rats in the basement, the adoring fan, the main quest of Shivering Isles…

Dragon Age: Origins - it's hard for me to tell how much was writing and how much was actually from voice acting, music, and seeing my choices bearing fruit but the ending to this game was really impressive. Some reasonably interesting characters and some tricky moral dilemmas helped, too.

(Honorable mention: Bioshock. Best plot twist evah!)

Combat
The Last Remnant - when you first play it seems like it's almost totally random but, as you learn the system and advance your (many) characters, you learn how to but weights on the dice to get things to roll your way. Mostly. You've also got a lot of flexibility in your union ("squad" would be a better word) make up. Changing from three large squads and a small squad to three medium and two small squads can really change how a battle plays out. A pity the game designers didn't make some of the mechanics more clear but now we've got a Wikia page to give us the straight scoop.

City of Heroes - this would actually get pretty dull in real small groups for the first years of the game but, once they added difficulty sliders, it really took off. You've got a great variety of powers, a great deal of customization over those powers, and a great variety of enemy powers. They also did a particularly good job with knockback/knockdown powers. Ah, running around with my grav/storm controller throwing people all over the place and teleporting them a quarter mile into the sky… it was like fighting in one of those air-pop popcorn machines only the popcorn couldn't escape!

XCom: Enemy Unknown - hey, it won an award so it's got to be an RPG, right?

(Honorable mention: the recent Batman games with their procedural melee fighting. Fun to play and fun to watch! A pity they aren't RPGs. Mount & Blade deserves something, too.)

Atmosphere
Elder Scrolls: Skyrim - climbing up the Throat of the World was just epic. The end scenes were epic. The entire western mountain range was epic. The dragons were epic. Blackreach is ridiculously epic. The aspen around Riften are… well, mostly those are real pretty. It might have been getting a lot of help from 3D Vision but it sure bowled me over. Extra sound mods probably helped, too.

Secret World - This would have been one awesome action RPG if it hadn't been released as an MMO. Even with other players running around, it's still got a really spooky, Lovecraftish atmosphere.

Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines - I only just played this a year or two ago and the atmosphere was great. It must have been incredible when it first came out!

(Honorable mention: Bioshock 1 & 2. Not enough RPGness for me to count on the list but incredible atmosphere!)

 

[Menigal]

Vampires: Masquerade (?)

It might be a good thing they never got to do a sequel.

Vampire: The Masquerade: Bloodlines: The Redeadening, Part II: Bloodraven's Reqium: Undeath of a Salesman (Director's Cut)

 

[JDR13]

I would love to see another Vampire:TM game someday, but I'd be torn about who I would want to develop it. I'm not sure who would be able to make a worthy sequel to Bloodlines today with the same kind of atmosphere.

 

[Kostas]

Interesting categories, while I'd agree with character development and exploration being in some sense more important/easy to rate I will stick to the original groups because they're challenging.
As far as I'm concerned Combat was the hardest to populate since it is almost never brilliant and it usually just gets a pass while Atmosphere was the one where I struggled to pick the top 3.

Writing:
Planescape: Torment (I can't quite put to words how much of a fanboy I've become since playing it)
Fallout 2
Fallout: New Vegas

Combat:
Gothic 2
The Witcher 2
Mount & Blade

Atmosphere:
Gothic 2
The Witcher 1
S.T.A.L.K.E.R. (or Vampire: The Masquarade - Bloodlines if STALKER fails your RPG test)