Thrasher
Wheeee!
Well I played Fate, and loved it back then, but I think I'd rather play something different…
Torchlight?
- Thread starter dteowner
- Start date
Interesting, I played Fate and hated it back then, so I think I would rather play something different...
So my question is: Is Torchlight different enough from Fate to justify a try?
E. g.:
Does it have a real story? Does it have a real ending?
Are the levels not all identical in their randomness?
Are there side quests different from: Kill this and that and get the random xyz-uber-loot?
Are the side quests not distributed by the same five quest givers all the time?
etc. ...
In other words: Is it something else than a random fight generator?
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txa1265
SasqWatch
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OK, you hated Fate ... so I assume you aren't a huge action-RPG fan, since all the stuff you ask is pretty much a summation of the sub-genre ...
Torchlight is a pure action-RPG, and is clearly derived from Fate as Diablo 2 is from Diablo. If you hate Fate you'll hate Torchlight.
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In fact I like Action RPGs with interesting world and story. I don't like randomly created dungeons, because they work against the illusion of an actual world. I am only interested in single player.
For example I like Ttan Quest, Divine Divinity, Sacred 1 and 2. I played through Diablo and Diablo 2 but don't feel any urge to repeat them.
For me Fate was even worse than Diablo with respect to the non-story, randomness aspect (Diablo at least had a story/main quest).
By the way I tried the demo for Torchlight after my last post above. I finished the Demo (except that side quest of the guy, who opens additional dungeons for you).
The overall game mechanicsand play are nearly identical to Fate. The side quests seem a little bit more story oriented than in Fate. There is still no overall story or main quest.
So probably the summary is:
If you liked Fate, you will like Torchlight. If you didn't like fate you will not like Torchlight.
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DAMMIT!!! Divine Divinity is NOT an action RPG!!!
It is a full fledged RPG with a story, well written side quests that are not random seeming, and a huge open world with lots going on in it.
Just because it uses a click-happy combat system as Diablo does not mean it is a simple dungeon crawler + loot fest.
You are right of course. I only mentioned it because it has a similar fight mechanics as ARPGS. The things you mention areexactly the reasons, why I like it.
However, there is no strict dividing line betwee the two genres. For example Sacred, and even moreSacred 2 also have a complete story and non-random side quests. In fact the sidequests in Sacred 2 even support your knowledge about the world and fit to the themes of the main quest.
So if you ignore the fighting mechanics you can also play Sacred 2 as a story-driven RPG. (And that is in fact, how I play these games.)
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What actually constitutes an "action rpg"?
Wheres professor roqua when you need him...
Wheres professor roqua when you need him...
In my opinion, Divinity 1 has many pieces of an Action-RPG, but personally, I don't see it as such.
To me, it's just an hybrid.
It has *lots* of fightings, but what it differs from Action-RPGs is that it also contains a relatively well-developed story - but that's not that important to me,
more important to me is the fact that it has sooooo many sidequests ! Of which only a part consists of hacking & slashing like one is used to from "true" Action-RPGs (remember the dish-washing ?).
Action-RPGs only have relatively few sidequests, I assume (well, Sacred 1 is an exception in that respect), and very, very few character interaction. In D2 by Blizzard it is reduced to the absolute tiniest necessary minimum. Blizzard shaped their Action-RPGs so as if the character interaction waw considered only a hindrance, a distraction from "real" gameplay, and that "role-playing" merely consists of happily hacking monsters, nothing more. Blizzards games are a testament against social skills.
I fear that this was another reason (among many others) that social skills were rather left out from even "real" RPGs (Gothic, for example) - from almost the whole RPG genre.
Not that they were often implemented either.
Blizzard kind of defined - imho - the "Action-RPG" genre, and everyone is only too willing to give in that, because that's what sells !
The influence was also masive on other RPGs. Now almost every game has "Action/RPG" written on its cover, no matter how much this *really* truly applies to the game itself.
Except The Witcher, maybe.
Now, the current state is, that under the influence of sub-genre defining Blizzard, RPGs in general are considered to be just or nothing but a line of hacking & slashing intermezzos, with a little bit of shopping and even less social interaction being nothing but a break of that.
Even Drakensang, which uses a system which contains rather a *lot* of possibilities for social interaction, consists rather of a series of fights.
The hardcore Action-RPG üplayer will - this is just a theorym, nothing more - just despise any attempt to make any RPG more "social", so to say. Because for the hardcore Action-RPGer "role-playing" merely consists of killing monsters, and getting loot for it, and shopping, of course. In this theory, The SIMs would be most hated, because it is the direct opposite of the essence of the Action-RPG genre.
To me, it's just an hybrid.
It has *lots* of fightings, but what it differs from Action-RPGs is that it also contains a relatively well-developed story - but that's not that important to me,
more important to me is the fact that it has sooooo many sidequests ! Of which only a part consists of hacking & slashing like one is used to from "true" Action-RPGs (remember the dish-washing ?).
Action-RPGs only have relatively few sidequests, I assume (well, Sacred 1 is an exception in that respect), and very, very few character interaction. In D2 by Blizzard it is reduced to the absolute tiniest necessary minimum. Blizzard shaped their Action-RPGs so as if the character interaction waw considered only a hindrance, a distraction from "real" gameplay, and that "role-playing" merely consists of happily hacking monsters, nothing more. Blizzards games are a testament against social skills.
I fear that this was another reason (among many others) that social skills were rather left out from even "real" RPGs (Gothic, for example) - from almost the whole RPG genre.
Not that they were often implemented either.
Blizzard kind of defined - imho - the "Action-RPG" genre, and everyone is only too willing to give in that, because that's what sells !
The influence was also masive on other RPGs. Now almost every game has "Action/RPG" written on its cover, no matter how much this *really* truly applies to the game itself.
Except The Witcher, maybe.
Now, the current state is, that under the influence of sub-genre defining Blizzard, RPGs in general are considered to be just or nothing but a line of hacking & slashing intermezzos, with a little bit of shopping and even less social interaction being nothing but a break of that.
Even Drakensang, which uses a system which contains rather a *lot* of possibilities for social interaction, consists rather of a series of fights.
The hardcore Action-RPG üplayer will - this is just a theorym, nothing more - just despise any attempt to make any RPG more "social", so to say. Because for the hardcore Action-RPGer "role-playing" merely consists of killing monsters, and getting loot for it, and shopping, of course. In this theory, The SIMs would be most hated, because it is the direct opposite of the essence of the Action-RPG genre.
dteowner
Shoegazer
A little advice for anyone planning on playing Torchlight: don't play on "easy".
Even if you're looking for a nice, relaxing romp, "easy" is just too darn easy. I don't know how far thru the game I am, but at 26 floors, the story will have to take a big twist if I'm not approaching the end. Anyway, I've used a grand total of 6 health potions so far. 6. I'm nearly immune to damage. My prime tactic right now is to run to the middle of a room, wait for the critters to surround me (they can't hit me while I'm waiting, but they sure make the effort), and then use my slash attack to wipe them out.
I'm still having a good time with the game, but "easy" is just pointless, even when looking for a relaxing experience.
Even if you're looking for a nice, relaxing romp, "easy" is just too darn easy. I don't know how far thru the game I am, but at 26 floors, the story will have to take a big twist if I'm not approaching the end. Anyway, I've used a grand total of 6 health potions so far. 6. I'm nearly immune to damage. My prime tactic right now is to run to the middle of a room, wait for the critters to surround me (they can't hit me while I'm waiting, but they sure make the effort), and then use my slash attack to wipe them out.
I'm still having a good time with the game, but "easy" is just pointless, even when looking for a relaxing experience.
Nukester
Sentinel
Ive found Hard to be a perfect difficulty for me. Its not too hard where I die all of the time, and more times than not Im mopping the floor with the monsters, but once in awhile I get cornered by a ton of monsters and a boss or two (or champions or whatever they might be called) and get destroyed, even though I might have like 30 health potions. Once in awhile Im so cornered that downing health potions cant save me. Add to that that Im playing hardcore, and its made the game soooooo much more fun for me. Ive yet to get past the 2nd glyph room in the gardens with any of my H-HC toons (yeah I suck lol). I just wish the death penalty for the softcore game was much more severe than it currently is (and a bug causes it to currently not even take away ANY exp when you die even though it shows that it is. Only fame and gold are lost)
Definitely agree, I even though 'normal' was too easy.
I was playing on 'normal' before I quit on the 7th or 8th level. I never died a single time, and I had at least a dozen health potions stocked up.
txa1265
SasqWatch
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I actually have my review in the queue (yes, there is a queue at this point!), and that is one of my points. Easy is so trivial as to suck the fun out of it ... it might have been fun when my kids were like 6 or 7 as they were when Fate came along, but certainly not now. Normal plays like Easy on many games.
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I wonder if starting a new Titan Quest game on the hardest level with make it more entertaining?
That's the main problem I had with it, just too easy (aside from the somewhat slow pace - also hated that the bosses all really required the same strategy: hit & run tactics + plenty of potions, basically a game of OUTLAST THE BOSS).
As for Torchlight - is it me or is it hard to make out all the action with the explosions and texts popping up all over the screen? Could be I'm playing at such a low resolution (1024x768)... I seriously need a new monitor!
That's the main problem I had with it, just too easy (aside from the somewhat slow pace - also hated that the bosses all really required the same strategy: hit & run tactics + plenty of potions, basically a game of OUTLAST THE BOSS).
As for Torchlight - is it me or is it hard to make out all the action with the explosions and texts popping up all over the screen? Could be I'm playing at such a low resolution (1024x768)... I seriously need a new monitor!
LuckyCarbon
RollPGs
I picked up Torchlight over xmas during the $5 steam sale. It's exactly what it says it is. A fun little romp that doesn't take itself too seriously. It's not pulling me in though, I really wish the character classes were a little more flushed out. Most of the skills are repeated from each class and from my (limited) experience none of the skills were all that interesting. For $5 I'm happy though.
I had a conversation the other day wondering how much Torchlight would eat into Diablo 3's sales? Since I got Torchlight, that niche in my gaming library has been refilled for the next 3-5 years. As only a casual Diablo fan, I'm probably not going to buy D3 now. At $5-10 I'm guessing they sold a lot of copies, how many of those casual hack&slash players are going to be happy with Torchlight and just not feel like playing the "same game" when Diablo 3 finally comes out?
I had a conversation the other day wondering how much Torchlight would eat into Diablo 3's sales? Since I got Torchlight, that niche in my gaming library has been refilled for the next 3-5 years. As only a casual Diablo fan, I'm probably not going to buy D3 now. At $5-10 I'm guessing they sold a lot of copies, how many of those casual hack&slash players are going to be happy with Torchlight and just not feel like playing the "same game" when Diablo 3 finally comes out?
Same here, I've been looking at new monitors for over a month now.
Yeah 1024x768 is pretty darn low, my friends make fun of me for playing at 1280x1024.
That's a good question, but I don't think Blizzard is all that worried about the casual crowd. Diablo 2 has a HUGE fan base, and I'm pretty sure most fans of D2 will be buying D3. That alone will give D3 a good start from a sales point of view, and then Blizzard will also have their usual advertising blitz as well.